Date: July 2005

Bus Type: BlueBird 1985 FC Wanderlodge

Project: Dash AC repair

FYI's: My purpose in posting this is just to outline what I did, it might help 
someone, and someone else might have a better way.  I do not offer this as "the 
only way to do it".  I am not a mechanic or AC tech and only want to try this 
project once, and I do not want to spend what I hear can run over $3 thousand 
for an "in-shop" replacement.   I am a first time novice at AC service. 

I'll put parts sources and numbers at the end of this, I find the biggest headache 
is finding the right part, not the job itself (mostly).

Problem:  I want dash AC!  Working dash AC will do, in my opinion, all I need in 
moderate weather, where it is a waste to run the generator for just cooling the 
front of the bus off a little.  I realize that in the hot summer I will still need the roof 
air(s) run by the generator to be effectively cool the front and/or all of the bus 
while on the road.

Second issue is the drivers' side dash AC fan control switch got "hot to the touch" 
when turned on, that worried me and prevented use of the fan to aid de-fogging 
in winter. 

Initial Inspection: This is what I found when I opened up the system:

? The dash switch and feed wire for the drivers' side blower was visibly burned 
out. 
? The evaporator blower motors (in the dash) and the condenser fans (on the 
roof) were found to be working when tested, but a little noisy. 
? Both of the hoses to the roof top condenser had visible deterioration and one 
had a crack to the core of the hose.  The interior hoses felt and looked fine.
? AC System had apparently no coolant present and would neither pump nor 
hold pressure/vacuum, the compressor clutch clicked and seemed to work, 
but compressor was not putting anything out as far as I could tell.
? The hoses I could get to, the expansion valve and the dryer all showed gross 
contamination, with crud and hard metal bits clearly evident coating interior 
walls/surfaces.  The dryer inspection glass was cloudy, oil streaked and 
orange/red in overall color.  
? All components appeared to be OEM and date to 1985, although new port 
fittings were found on the compressor head indicating a previous attempt to 
use a simple kit to convert to R-134a and recharge at some previous time.



Decision:  I contacted BlueBird parts and was advised that BB offers no parts for 
the AC system.  Based on my AC repair reading and other forum member's 
comments and my goals, I made my repair choices.  I decided that the bus 
system was worth at least one good effort to fix.  Based on the time I was going 
to have to spend and my inspection findings, I chose to disassemble as much of 
the system as I could and flush it, convert to new 134a coolant, replace the roof 
top condenser to get greater heat exchange capacity, and replace the 
compressor/clutch, expansion valve, and dryer.  My thoughts were that this 
approach presented the best chance for a reasonable cost outcome that 
addresses the specific problems I faced and would upgrade the condenser/fan 
unit to allow the best chance of long term effective cooling with 134a. 

Part One - Dash Fan Switch Repair & Adding a Solenoid to the Fan Circuit.

Removal of the screws securing the brown plastic upper dash panel around the 
perimeter frees the panel and it can be pulled forward easily.  The switch and the 
first inch or so of supply wiring was "burnt black".  After replacement the drivers' 
side fan worked fine.  If all else fails, at least I can use the fan to move air and 
defog the windshield.   

I received some sound advice from other forum members about adding a relay to 
the switch circuit and thus reducing the heavy fan loads from the driver's side fan 
switch.  It appears that this OEM switch is basically carrying a full capacity load 
when you are running full fan and the roof top condenser fan(s) are on.  
Additionally, the wiring to the condenser fans looks one gauge lighter than I 
would be comfortable with for anything I would wire, so I replaced it with a 
heavier gauge wire.  The dash AC driver's side switch now powers the rooftop 
condenser fan via a new relay protected by a new circuit breaker.  Fan power is 
obtained from an existing heavy-duty load center located to the left and above 
the AC evaporator unit in the upper dash area, and is just switched via the relay 
with the OEM type switch. 

Part Two - AC Components Removal

You can mark all these hoses/fittings with a pen marker or tape to keep them 
organized, same with wires and other parts. I use Dixie cups and mark what the 
bolts/nuts/parts go to (because I do some work today, and some work next week, 
this helps me keep parts organized and remember where they came from).  A 
battery powered LCD type headlamp is very helpful when working in the 
overhead area.it is very tight up there and everything in there was painted flat 
black.   Use two wrenches to remove any hose flare fittings.do not try just to 
force off with one wrench without backing up the other side to prevent damage 
from high torque loads to the fitting and the tube. Liquid Wrench will be needed 
for practically every nut and bolt.

Compressor; You will need to open the front up radiator access to get at this, 
but only open (not remove) the interior doghouse lid. The single wire coming off 
the compressor is the power to the electric/magnetic clutch.  Should have a "pull 
apart" to separate the wire.  You can test this circuit with a meter on the 
bus/supply side of the wire, when AC switch is on and temp control set to high 
cool you should get power to this wire to activate the clutch.   

NOTE: If in your specific case only the clutch is bad (lucky you!), you might be 
able to get it off without removing the entire compressor or opening up your 
system.  The clutch is a separate part to the compressor.  Slack the belt; remove 
the center bolt in the pulley, pull off and then remove the four bolts to the clutch 
fan to complete removal. 

Four bolts on the compressor side mounting plate and one more bolt was found 
on the bottom front.  All bolts on my bus are close to other items and here a 
ratcheting flat style wrench is ideal.  The bottom bolt is a tight fit, and impinges on 
an engine radiator coolant fitting, but it did come out without removing the hose.

The AC coolant suction/discharge hoses are left on the 90-degree fittings; the 
hose fittings are held on to the compressor top plate by large ring nuts.  Remove 
the ring nuts to remove the hoses from the compressor head.  

Condenser; The rooftop shroud can stay on for removal.  Roof unit is unbolted 
from the bus by removing the four outer mounting bolts on the L brackets. You 
can then tilt it up and back and remove coolant hoses and cut the two wires for 
the fans.  One person can lift this entire unit off the bus with care, a helper makes 
it easier and safer.  
 
Dryer; A cylinder about 3" x 7" with 2 hose fittings on the top, mounted to right of 
the evaporator/fan housing in the overhead dash area.  

Evaporator/Blower Fan/Expansion Valve Housing: This part was a big pain.  I 
removed the two coolant hoses on the right hand side and then the fun started.  

You will find 8 phillips head sheet metal screws (read "feel" for the 3 on the back 
side) around the perimeter of the "AC box", about 3" down from the top where the 
horizontal "seam" is.  There is no room to work here.  Try a stubby screwdriver 
and/or ratcheting screwdriver.  The screws in the rear loosened up after dowsing 
with Liquid Wrench with a can with the small red tube sprayed from the front 
inside (I lifted up the front side and sprayed, then wiggled the unit up and down 
about 20 times).  In removing the ducts I took the two metal hose adapter boxes 
off, rather than trying to remove the hose from the metal box.  Just move the 
hoses and adapter box off to the sides.  Once this is done, you can lift the top 1/3 
of the unit off and then from the inside bottom unplug the wiring, slide the rubber 
grommet out, and push the wiring harness through the hole in the top.  This 
upper AC box section holds the two blower fans.  The fans seemed fine - I 
checked for binding and finding none, oiled them up with Teflon based lube.

Next you can undo the four bottom mounting screws which secure the lower 
section AC evaporator box to the drip pan and remove the bottom 2/3 of the AC 
unit.  This lower AC housing has the evaporator and the expansion valve.  The 
expansion valve is on the inner right side of the housing tucked down tight.  
Removing the perimeter screws and the endplate screws at the hose inlets will 
allow you to remove the entire evaporator assembly and then remove the 
expansion valve.  Note that there is one screw that is near the screen inlet area 
on the end of the box where the inlet hoses/expansion valve is located that can 
interfere with the removal of the evaporator unit.back this screw out and 
removal is easier.

FYI: on re-assembly, I only used the two screws on the ends and two on the front 
to secure these two parts of the AC housing back together.  I used duct tape to 
seal the seam and did not use the other screws.  I see no functional reason to 
put them all back in. 

Part Three - AC system cleaning, component replacement. 

I cleaned up all the parts I was going to keep and flushed everything out with AC 
cleaner and compressed air.  

Due to the time investment, age of components, and the level of contamination, I 
decided to replace the compressor/clutch, dryer, and expansion valve.  The 
evaporator I heard could be flushed out, so I decided to go with it.  I assumed 
finding another exact replacement that would fit into the space available in the 
AC housing would not be easy.  

All the hoses inside the coach looked and felt real good and I did not wish to run 
new hoses up the walls or up the center of the windshield unless a later pressure 
test indicated I had to.  The two rooftop condenser hoses were shot and will be 
replaced.

I replaced the roof condenser and fan unit as I wanted more cooling capability.  I 
had heard from several forum sources that the OEM unit was too small to be 
effective with 134a coolant.  The fan motors also seemed to be drawing a lot of 
amps and be very weathered and noisy, so I went with a new bolt on after-market 
condenser/fan unit instead of trying to just replace the condenser element alone.  

Intermission

To this point; the dash switch replacement and getting everything else "opened 
up, taken off, and cleaned" took around 6-7 combined hours of labor spread over 
two weekends.   

The only real pain has been working inside the upper dash on the evaporator and 
figuring out there was a bottom bolt on the AC compressor. 

Will do install and update this file posting with my results, do I have cold AC or 
one hell of an expensive dash fan?

Results

The new condenser required new hose fittings and hoses.  I had these done as a 
custom job by a local A/C shop, as the hoses needed to go from the OEM flair 
type roof fittings to the new condenser "o-ring" type fittings.   The "footprint" of my 
new roof top condenser is a bit smaller than the OEM unit, so new mounting 
holes were required.  No real problems encountered for this change, there was 
plenty of open area within the upper dash roof area for the new mounting feet 
and bolts, but be careful, as hoses/wires do run just under the roof - particularly 
for the front right mounting hole.  For the specific unit I used, the rearward 
mounting "feet" have two possible positions.  I moved the mounting feet to the 
forward most slots, and with this avoided a conflict with a roof reinforcement 
beam that runs under the bus roof skin.  

I had some left over aluminum seam sealer tape from a roof vent repair and just 
used this over a small bead of caulking for sealing the old holes.  I painted this 
tape with cream paint that matches my base color and this blends in the tape-
patched areas very nicely.  If this repair is ever noticed, I'll tell them these are  
inspection holes! 

I evacuated the system and finding it "tight" charged the system up.  The fan 
blowers all run, no wiring is getting hot, and I have nice cold air shooting out from 
the vents!!!!   I do not have a thermometer, but the system blows cold air.   

Final Observations -  Caution..opinions voiced here:

I wanted to do the whole job.I learned a little and cussed a bit too.  If this project 
holds up over time, and blows cold air, then that's great!  Time will tell on this 
aspect.  If it does not, I'll likely have an AC shop look it over and tweak my work 
or anything I missed or messed up. 

I think the basic concept of my repair hit the big weak design aspects of the OEM 
set up and there is in my mind no real inherent reason not to have working dash 
AC on the FC.  The compressor type used in the FC is regarded as a rock solid 
unit; our 3208's can more than handle the load; all the major components are 
grouped together (unlike some of the pushers where there are long hose runs).   

Like most of the workmanship on this fine classic bus, this project has a lifetime 
guarantee..I likely will be working on this bus for the rest of my life, and loving it!

For anyone who does not want to do "the whole thing", I would suggest perhaps 
doing all the basic component replacements, and then let a AC shop do the final 
system flush, evacuation, refrigerant charge and testing.   With a good shop 
working with you, you could get a fair overall project price by buying the main 
parts from a discount source, and just have the AC shop do the real technical 
final work.  This approach would save a ton of direct labor costs and parts 
markups and you would know the hidden workmanship would be top notch 
(because you did it). 



Information References: 

All these were good internet information and/or parts sources:

http://www.ackits.com/

http://www.coldacparts.com/index.htm

http://www.truckair.com/                            (great parts catalogue) 

http://www.kysorhvac.com/                           (great parts catalogue)


Parts References:

Dash fan switch: NAPA Auto Parts; #HC313 (3 speed/off)

Roof Condenser/Fan Unit: Thermo-King; Red Dot; Model  #R6160

Compressor Clutch: Truck Air Parts; # 02-3004 (6 _ pulley diameter, « inch belt, 3 3/16 "C" 
measurement).  

Compressor:  Truck Air Parts; York/CCI with Rotolock head; Model R210-L; Left-hand suction; 
TAP # 30-3004.  Came with oil for 134a coolant.

Dryer:  Truck Air Parts; TAP #07-3006A  (cross ref to: Kysor #402352)

Expansion Valve: Truck Air Parts; TAP #12-3013A (cross ref to: TruckPride #1610.



Hope you find this file helpful.  I know this is a long posting, but I wanted to be detailed 
for those who like me, are starting from a zero base when working on a AC system and 
need a basic reference point as to what is involved.    

There are several dedicated veteran BB forum members who really take the time to 
explain things and help others and post some really good information for all of 
us..these great folks inspired me to try this project.  This is sort of my payback to this 
select group and my "thank you" to them.

Frank W.
85FC33
Woodbridge, VA.