![]() |
||
electrical problems - Printable Version +- Wanderlodge Gurus - The Member Funded Wanderlodge Forum (http://www.wanderlodgegurus.com) +-- Forum: Yahoo Groups Archive (/forumdisplay.php?fid=61) +--- Forum: WanderlodgeForum (/forumdisplay.php?fid=63) +--- Thread: electrical problems (/showthread.php?tid=5667) |
||
electrical problems - denny heck - 09-14-2007 16:33 Back air works, center air works, from air does not. 110 lights in bathroom does not work,outlets in the kitchen, some work. 12volts works fine in kitchen and bathroom. is there any breakers in the back, bedroom. by theway it a 1989 bluebird 38'. breaker box in the back bedroom right side. it seems it started went the elec contractor wire in a temp. service. more power on one leg then on the other side in the front right of gauges. shut it down and rewire it then both legs ran 120. does any one have a wiring dig. for a 1989 120volt-220. thanks denny electrical problems - Don Bradner - 08-28-2008 12:34 I've experienced two serious electrical problems on our current trip. I'm hoping the second problem (solved) was the cause of the first, but I can't get my head around exactly how it would be, so I'm hoping someone with more RV electrical experience than I have will have a clue. I will rest easier if I know what caused the first problem. The first problem I talked about here earlier, but will run through for clarity: With a lot of draw going on, I had the 50-amp breaker on the park pole blow, plus the main inside breakers, plus the breaker for the inverter. Power was lost on the inverter circuit, and did not return when breakers were turned back on with reduced draw. The inverter, a ProSine 2.0, is toast - burnt components obvious when opening the case. I removed the inverter and wired input/output together for power on the inverted circuit when on park power, and bought a small charger to keep the batteries up while parked. Xantrex sent out a new ProSine 2.0 (half-price, well out-of-warranty) and I will get it tomorrow. I've been worrying about hooking it up without knowing what caused the failure. Problem number 2: Yesterday I moved, and on arrival at a park in Ogallala the 50-amp park breaker blew as soon as turned on. After turning off the internal main breakers I was able to get the park breaker to hold after one more failure. The breaker was "spongy" so I wasn't sure if it was just weak. Turning on the main breakers inside worked fine. Moved again today, and the problem repeated except that nothing would make it work. In trying various things I found that my 30/50 cord worked fine. So, I took the coach connector apart and found: Screw for black wire fell out, and was quite black on the end. White and Red attached, but screw not tight. Green was not attached at all - screw all the way in, and wire laid across the top. Contacting case, but who knows how well. It is amazing I had power at all. I cut the end off and rebuilt the connector, and had no problem turning on the power. It would seem to be an odd coincidence if problem one was not caused by problem two, but since the ProSine 2.0 should in theory work regardless of what occurs on the input side I'm not sure what the connection is. Anybody have thoughts on this? Don Bradner 90 PT40 "Blue Thunder" Posting today by satellite from Grand Island, Nebraska My location: http://www.bbirdmaps.com/user2.cfm?user=1 electrical problems - bubblerboy64 - 08-28-2008 12:56 Don, I know so little about this I shouldn't even comment but do you think you were shorting across to the ground wire? You know we tend to grab those plugs and pull and tug on them and if a wire gets loose it can't be a good thing. Could the problem have started by plugging into a socket that was shorted which damaged the male end of your power cord resulting in the problem with the inverter. People have been know to drive off having there bus plugged into the electrical connection. If they do that and do damage how many of them would stop and tell the owner of the camp? I guess we take our chances everytime we plug into a strange hookup when you think about it. John Heckman central Pa 1973 FC > > I've experienced two serious electrical problems on our current trip. I'm hoping the second problem (solved) was the cause of the first, but I can't get my head around exactly how it would be, so I'm hoping someone with more RV electrical experience than I have will have a clue. I will rest easier if I know what caused the first problem. > > The first problem I talked about here earlier, but will run through for clarity: > > With a lot of draw going on, I had the 50-amp breaker on the park pole blow, plus the main inside breakers, plus the breaker for the inverter. Power was lost on the inverter circuit, and did not return when breakers were turned back on with reduced draw. The inverter, a ProSine 2.0, is toast - burnt components obvious when opening the case. I removed the inverter and wired input/output together for power on the inverted circuit when on park power, and bought a small charger to keep the batteries up while parked. > > Xantrex sent out a new ProSine 2.0 (half-price, well out-of- warranty) and I will get it tomorrow. I've been worrying about hooking it up without knowing what caused the failure. > > Problem number 2: Yesterday I moved, and on arrival at a park in Ogallala the 50-amp park breaker blew as soon as turned on. After turning off the internal main breakers I was able to get the park breaker to hold after one more failure. The breaker was "spongy" so I wasn't sure if it was just weak. Turning on the main breakers inside worked fine. > > Moved again today, and the problem repeated except that nothing would make it work. In trying various things I found that my 30/50 cord worked fine. > > So, I took the coach connector apart and found: > > Screw for black wire fell out, and was quite black on the end. White and Red attached, but screw not tight. Green was not attached at all - screw all the way in, and wire laid across the top. Contacting case, but who knows how well. > > It is amazing I had power at all. I cut the end off and rebuilt the connector, and had no problem turning on the power. > > It would seem to be an odd coincidence if problem one was not caused by problem two, but since the ProSine 2.0 should in theory work regardless of what occurs on the input side I'm not sure what the connection is. Anybody have thoughts on this? > > Don Bradner > 90 PT40 "Blue Thunder" > Posting today by satellite from Grand Island, Nebraska > My location: http://www.bbirdmaps.com/user2.cfm?user=1 > electrical problems - Gregory OConnor - 08-28-2008 13:00 May be you can install a 10 amp breaker inline ( like the ac power box???) for each Prosine. I wonder if the problem that caused the prosine failure is the connection issue you found and the prosine is the result. You might want to read thru this link, it may have some answers???? (look at "open neutral") http://www.myrv.us/electric/ Greg --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Bradner" > > I've experienced two serious electrical problems on our current trip. I'm hoping the second problem (solved) was the cause of the first, but I can't get my head around exactly how it would be, so I'm hoping someone with more RV electrical experience than I have will have a clue. I will rest easier if I know what caused the first problem. > > The first problem I talked about here earlier, but will run through for clarity: > > With a lot of draw going on, I had the 50-amp breaker on the park pole blow, plus the main inside breakers, plus the breaker for the inverter. Power was lost on the inverter circuit, and did not return when breakers were turned back on with reduced draw. The inverter, a ProSine 2.0, is toast - burnt components obvious when opening the case. I removed the inverter and wired input/output together for power on the inverted circuit when on park power, and bought a small charger to keep the batteries up while parked. > > Xantrex sent out a new ProSine 2.0 (half-price, well out-of- warranty) and I will get it tomorrow. I've been worrying about hooking it up without knowing what caused the failure. > > Problem number 2: Yesterday I moved, and on arrival at a park in Ogallala the 50-amp park breaker blew as soon as turned on. After turning off the internal main breakers I was able to get the park breaker to hold after one more failure. The breaker was "spongy" so I wasn't sure if it was just weak. Turning on the main breakers inside worked fine. > > Moved again today, and the problem repeated except that nothing would make it work. In trying various things I found that my 30/50 cord worked fine. > > So, I took the coach connector apart and found: > > Screw for black wire fell out, and was quite black on the end. White and Red attached, but screw not tight. Green was not attached at all - screw all the way in, and wire laid across the top. Contacting case, but who knows how well. > > It is amazing I had power at all. I cut the end off and rebuilt the connector, and had no problem turning on the power. > > It would seem to be an odd coincidence if problem one was not caused by problem two, but since the ProSine 2.0 should in theory work regardless of what occurs on the input side I'm not sure what the connection is. Anybody have thoughts on this? > > Don Bradner > 90 PT40 "Blue Thunder" > Posting today by satellite from Grand Island, Nebraska > My location: http://www.bbirdmaps.com/user2.cfm?user=1 > electrical problems - Gardner Yeaw - 08-28-2008 13:03 Don, The loose wires would likely result in a voltage drop. The burned end on the balck wire proves that it was getting very hot and this is an indication that it was drawing a high current through a poor connection. This will produce heat and a drop in voltage. I am only making an educated guess here, but when the Xantrex sensed the shore line voltage it would engage the bypass relay. As soon as it did, current would flow, the voltage would drop, and the Xantrex would sense this and possably switch to invert mode. Now with no load on the shore line, the voltage would come back up and the cycle would repeat. So it is possable the Xantrex was switching in and out of invert mode at a rapid pace, and that could easily result in a failure. Gardner 83FC35 --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Bradner" > > I've experienced two serious electrical problems on our current trip. I'm hoping the second problem (solved) was the cause of the first, but I can't get my head around exactly how it would be, so I'm hoping someone with more RV electrical experience than I have will have a clue. I will rest easier if I know what caused the first problem. > > The first problem I talked about here earlier, but will run through for clarity: > > With a lot of draw going on, I had the 50-amp breaker on the park pole blow, plus the main inside breakers, plus the breaker for the inverter. Power was lost on the inverter circuit, and did not return when breakers were turned back on with reduced draw. The inverter, a ProSine 2.0, is toast - burnt components obvious when opening the case. I removed the inverter and wired input/output together for power on the inverted circuit when on park power, and bought a small charger to keep the batteries up while parked. > > Xantrex sent out a new ProSine 2.0 (half-price, well out-of- warranty) and I will get it tomorrow. I've been worrying about hooking it up without knowing what caused the failure. > > Problem number 2: Yesterday I moved, and on arrival at a park in Ogallala the 50-amp park breaker blew as soon as turned on. After turning off the internal main breakers I was able to get the park breaker to hold after one more failure. The breaker was "spongy" so I wasn't sure if it was just weak. Turning on the main breakers inside worked fine. > > Moved again today, and the problem repeated except that nothing would make it work. In trying various things I found that my 30/50 cord worked fine. > > So, I took the coach connector apart and found: > > Screw for black wire fell out, and was quite black on the end. White and Red attached, but screw not tight. Green was not attached at all - screw all the way in, and wire laid across the top. Contacting case, but who knows how well. > > It is amazing I had power at all. I cut the end off and rebuilt the connector, and had no problem turning on the power. > > It would seem to be an odd coincidence if problem one was not caused by problem two, but since the ProSine 2.0 should in theory work regardless of what occurs on the input side I'm not sure what the connection is. Anybody have thoughts on this? > > Don Bradner > 90 PT40 "Blue Thunder" > Posting today by satellite from Grand Island, Nebraska > My location: http://www.bbirdmaps.com/user2.cfm?user=1 > electrical problems - Curt Sprenger - 08-28-2008 15:31 Don,
Great Post...Everyone...All of us with our older coaches need to do what Don just did, check our coach connectors. I'll add that we should also check our shore cord coach ends. .On Thu, Aug 28, 2008 at 5:34 PM, Don Bradner <"bluethunder@arcatapet.com"> wrote:
-- Curt Sprenger 1987 PT38 8V92 "MacAttack Racing" Anaheim Hills, CA electrical problems - Juergen - 08-29-2008 01:27
electrical problems - Gary Smith - 08-29-2008 01:45 While I have some minor disagreements with some of what Juergen said (there is only one common wire in the cable, two hot, and one ground), with loose wires, it is possible you crossed the two 120v hot lines, providing the high voltage he suggests. I believe the whole problem was caused by the poor connections, Don. Not sure how the ProSine should react to 240v hitting it, but could well weld some contacts, as you found.
Gary
SOB
----- Original Message -----
electrical problems - Don Bradner - 08-29-2008 01:59 I may not have been clear: It was the coach end of the shore cord, not the connector that is part of the coach. The pole end is a molded connector, but the coach end is not; don't know if that is original? There is a plastic ring cinched down to the cord, just behind the connector. I never gave it much thought, but now I wonder why that is there. It lends itself to be the point that is grabbed to pull the connector out, but that puts strain on the wires in the connector. Clearly I should grab the connector body to pull it out, not the wires. On 8/28/2008 at 8:31 PM Curt Sprenger wrote: >Don, > >Great Post...Everyone...All of us with our older coaches need to do what >Don >just did, check our coach connectors. I'll add that we should also check >our >shore cord coach ends. > >.On Thu, Aug 28, 2008 at 5:34 PM, Don Bradner > > >> I've experienced two serious electrical problems on our current trip. >> I'm hoping the second problem (solved) was the cause of the first, but I >> can't get my head around exactly how it would be, so I'm hoping someone >with >> more RV electrical experience than I have will have a clue. I will rest >> easier if I know what caused the first problem. >> >> The first problem I talked about here earlier, but will run through for >> clarity: >> >> With a lot of draw going on, I had the 50-amp breaker on the park pole >> blow, plus the main inside breakers, plus the breaker for the inverter. >> Power was lost on the inverter circuit, and did not return when breakers >> were turned back on with reduced draw. The inverter, a ProSine 2.0, is >toast >> - burnt components obvious when opening the case. I removed the inverter >and >> wired input/output together for power on the inverted circuit when on >park >> power, and bought a small charger to keep the batteries up while parked. >> >> Xantrex sent out a new ProSine 2.0 (half-price, well out-of-warranty) >and I >> will get it tomorrow. I've been worrying about hooking it up without >knowing >> what caused the failure. >> >> Problem number 2: Yesterday I moved, and on arrival at a park in Ogallala >> the 50-amp park breaker blew as soon as turned on. After turning off the >> internal main breakers I was able to get the park breaker to hold after >one >> more failure. The breaker was "spongy" so I wasn't sure if it was just >weak. >> Turning on the main breakers inside worked fine. >> >> Moved again today, and the problem repeated except that nothing would >make >> it work. In trying various things I found that my 30/50 cord worked fine. >> >> So, I took the coach connector apart and found: >> >> Screw for black wire fell out, and was quite black on the end. White and >> Red attached, but screw not tight. Green was not attached at all - screw >all >> the way in, and wire laid across the top. Contacting case, but who knows >how >> well. >> >> It is amazing I had power at all. I cut the end off and rebuilt the >> connector, and had no problem turning on the power. >> >> It would seem to be an odd coincidence if problem one was not caused by >> problem two, but since the ProSine 2.0 should in theory work regardless >of >> what occurs on the input side I'm not sure what the connection is. >Anybody >> have thoughts on this? >> >> Don Bradner >> 90 PT40 "Blue Thunder" >> Posting today by satellite from Grand Island, Nebraska >> My location: http://www.bbirdmaps.com/user2.cfm?user=1 >> >> >> > > > >-- >Curt Sprenger >1987 PT38 8V92 "MacAttack Racing" >Anaheim Hills, CA electrical problems - bubblerboy64 - 08-29-2008 05:09 The 30 amp cord is pretty much a standard 110 with a funny plug on it then? I knew that 220 was essentially two 110 hot wires but did not know that the 50 was similar. Having been in a RV store not long ago I noticed they had a featured item up near the check out a 50 amp plug with a distinct pull handle on it. I think they also had 30amp plugs similar. Didn't impress me at the time nearly as much as it does now. I don't have 50 amps into my coach but I learned something. I also did not realize the risk involved in the battery campartments. I was informed last year at the Maxton rally about that. I guess the low voltage stuff can be rather nasty as well. Perhaps some one will review and explain what the risk with the low voltage. Does make a rather nasty spark if you short the positive against the metal I know that. All kinds of ways a fellow can get hurt. I was up on the roof of my bird this morning and I was VERY careful. I remember seeing Don's X rays. I don't much like it up there but once a year I go up to check it over and see that all is well. Lets see. The thing can crush you, electrocute you, you can fall off, and then there is the road risk. I guess we can say it can get you coming and going as well as a couple ways in between. John Heckman central Pa 1973 FC > > I may not have been clear: It was the coach end of the shore cord, not the connector that is part of the coach. The pole end is a molded connector, but the coach end is not; don't know if that is original? > > There is a plastic ring cinched down to the cord, just behind the connector. I never gave it much thought, but now I wonder why that is there. It lends itself to be the point that is grabbed to pull the connector out, but that puts strain on the wires in the connector. Clearly I should grab the connector body to pull it out, not the wires. > > On 8/28/2008 at 8:31 PM Curt Sprenger wrote: > > >Don, > > > >Great Post...Everyone...All of us with our older coaches need to do what > >Don > >just did, check our coach connectors. I'll add that we should also check > >our > >shore cord coach ends. > > > >.On Thu, Aug 28, 2008 at 5:34 PM, Don Bradner > > > > > >> I've experienced two serious electrical problems on our current trip. > >> I'm hoping the second problem (solved) was the cause of the first, but I > >> can't get my head around exactly how it would be, so I'm hoping someone > >with > >> more RV electrical experience than I have will have a clue. I will rest > >> easier if I know what caused the first problem. > >> > >> The first problem I talked about here earlier, but will run through for > >> clarity: > >> > >> With a lot of draw going on, I had the 50-amp breaker on the park pole > >> blow, plus the main inside breakers, plus the breaker for the inverter. > >> Power was lost on the inverter circuit, and did not return when breakers > >> were turned back on with reduced draw. The inverter, a ProSine 2.0, is > >toast > >> - burnt components obvious when opening the case. I removed the inverter > >and > >> wired input/output together for power on the inverted circuit when on > >park > >> power, and bought a small charger to keep the batteries up while parked. > >> > >> Xantrex sent out a new ProSine 2.0 (half-price, well out-of- warranty) > >and I > >> will get it tomorrow. I've been worrying about hooking it up without > >knowing > >> what caused the failure. > >> > >> Problem number 2: Yesterday I moved, and on arrival at a park in Ogallala > >> the 50-amp park breaker blew as soon as turned on. After turning off the > >> internal main breakers I was able to get the park breaker to hold after > >one > >> more failure. The breaker was "spongy" so I wasn't sure if it was just > >weak. > >> Turning on the main breakers inside worked fine. > >> > >> Moved again today, and the problem repeated except that nothing would > >make > >> it work. In trying various things I found that my 30/50 cord worked fine. > >> > >> So, I took the coach connector apart and found: > >> > >> Screw for black wire fell out, and was quite black on the end. White and > >> Red attached, but screw not tight. Green was not attached at all - screw > >all > >> the way in, and wire laid across the top. Contacting case, but who knows > >how > >> well. > >> > >> It is amazing I had power at all. I cut the end off and rebuilt the > >> connector, and had no problem turning on the power. > >> > >> It would seem to be an odd coincidence if problem one was not caused by > >> problem two, but since the ProSine 2.0 should in theory work regardless > >of > >> what occurs on the input side I'm not sure what the connection is. > >Anybody > >> have thoughts on this? > >> > >> Don Bradner > >> 90 PT40 "Blue Thunder" > >> Posting today by satellite from Grand Island, Nebraska > >> My location: http://www.bbirdmaps.com/user2.cfm?user=1 > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > >-- > >Curt Sprenger > >1987 PT38 8V92 "MacAttack Racing" > >Anaheim Hills, CA > |