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+--- Forum: WanderlodgeForum (/forumdisplay.php?fid=63)
+--- Thread: generator weirdness (/showthread.php?tid=4049)
generator weirdness - Jeff August - 12-23-2006 03:04
Our generator battery did the same thing, when the voltage got to low
the fuel selonoid closed and it would shut down. I now put a 10 amp
battery charger in the tray when we get somewhere and it keeps itself
charged when it runs, have had no problems since I started doing this.
I know its not the right way and it adds another thing to do when you
get somewhere but it works. Mr. Miller had a fix for this but I could
not figure it out myself, a Kohler generator shop in Green Bay told me
this was the way they would do it. Someday I would like to get it
working the right way though.
Michelle and Jeff August
1980FC35RB
Plymouth Wi.
Merry Christmas Everyone!
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ernest Ekberg"
>
> dave Hardy- 84 PT40, his generator, while running will not charge his
> generator battery. The inverter on the coach is no help. He can put
an
> aux battery charger on the generator battery and the generator will
run
> from now on- without that the voltage drops and she dies. Anyone have
> ever have the same problem? How about a fix? Thanks, Ernie-83PT40 in
> Texas- my generator just leaks diesel- no problem there
>
generator weirdness - pattypape - 12-23-2006 04:50
On our 88 FC , the Onan has an alternator, it charges the battery
when the Onan is running. This is easy to check with a volt meter.
The generator battery is also charged by shore power or the 3208
alternator. The diode that Ralph mentions is located behind the entry
steps( on our 88 FC), It is a hefty fat diode , I would guess at
about 80 amps. There is also an automotive type fuse link, next to
these parts is the Aux Battery solenoid to tie all batteries together
for weak battery starting. All located center coach behind the step
near the leveler reservoir tank and motor.
There is also a relay in the left side front load center, that is
energized with 12 volts to latch these charging circuit together,
when on shore power or 3208 alternator charging, This circuit is
also fused with a glass automotive fuse. So check this circuit.
This could be a trouble area.
It is a good idea to check the age and load test all batteries
before replacing.
Bill 88 FC Michigan/Florida
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph L. Fullenwider"
>
> I don't have a charging print for a PT off hand, so this is from
memory.
>
> Unlike the '84/'85FC's which have a 160 amp battery isolator, the
PT
> usually had a large diode rectifier located in the gen set battery
circuit.
> The diode allowed voltage to pass from the alt or charger but not
back,
> ergo isolated. The out put side of the gen set battery follows the
usual 2
> solenoid pattern for the battery tie switch. Two of the solenoids
are under
> the entry door step and the third is usually found in the gen set
> compartment on the curb side wall, near the breaker box for the gen
set.
> Also in the '84, there was not an alt. installed on the Perkins for
> charging. The second solenoid in the gen set compartment was not
installed
> on all PT's it is also an isolation circuit.
>
> So, going from the above, here is a list of "might be's"
> 1. The Diode is bad, not allowing the gen set battery to charge.
(usually
> located under the drivers side front behind the bumper area)
> 2. The charger side of the inverter is not hooked up to the gen set
battery
> to charge when the gen set is running
> 3. The tie solenoid contacts are welded together.
> 4. Or as Jay mentioned, there is a high resistance short in the
cable some
> where.
>
> There are a couple of other things I have seen happen but they are
rare so
> won't go there right now.
>
> Would help to have a PT schematic of an '84 or '85 PT to trace out.
>
> Ralph
>
>
> At 11:45 PM 12/22/2006 +0000, you wrote:
> >dave Hardy- 84 PT40, his generator, while running will not charge
his
> >generator battery. The inverter on the coach is no help. He can
put an
> >aux battery charger on the generator battery and the generator
will run
> >from now on- without that the voltage drops and she dies. Anyone
have
> >ever have the same problem? How about a fix? Thanks, Ernie-83PT40
in
> >Texas- my generator just leaks diesel- no problem there
> >
> >
>
generator weirdness - Gregory OConnor - 12-23-2006 05:31
I would replace the battery too. or just un ground it and jump in a
pepboys jump pack to keep the fuel open and pumped. If it is a diode,
what caused it to fail? Low amp starts on a diesel started always
cost me a rebuild.
GregoryO'Connor
94ptRomolandCa--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Wilhelmus
Schreurs
>
> Jay:
> I have to agree with you except for the "replace battery with good
one". Since he puts the aux charger on and it works ok, then in
theory it should work with the inverter/charger as well.
> When you put the charger on, do you clip the positive and negative
directly to the battery, if that is the case, how about the "GROUND"
again. To complete the answer, we need some more info as Jay has
requested.
>
> Bill 84 FC 35 SB "$quanderlodge"
> Terrace, B.C. Canada
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Jay Darst
> To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 5:49:18 PM
> Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: generator weirdness
>
> Replace the battery with a known good one.
>
> Take a volt reading on the gen battery with out anything running.
>
> Now, with the Inverter in charge mode(either shore power or gen
power
> connected), check the voltage at the gen battery. If the voltage
does
> not increase with the inverter/charger on, probably the isolator
has
> an issue or there is a broken wire from the rear compartment
running
> up to the gen battery. My brothers FC had a 2ga cable with hole
> rubbed in the insulation, about mid coach. Ran from the battery
bank
> to the stock inverter. Kept depleting his battery bank.
>
> I removed the factory isolator, someone told me it was a rectified
> isolator- don't have a clue what the "rectified" part is. Anyway,
the
> new isolator is a Sure Power Industries 24023A, 160 amp isolator.
> Looses about .2 volts input to output posts. Bought brand new on E-
> bay for $90.
>
> I'm guessing now...
> Maybe the fuel solenoid is compromised and requires higher volatge
to
> remain in the ON position????
> Is the connection to the fuel solenoid not so good?
> Where's Ralph?
>
> Jay Darst
> 85PT40
> Springfield, IL
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@ yahoogroups. com, "one_dusty_hoot"
>
> >
> > Ernie, sound to me like the aux charger is keeping
> > the fuel pump going,no fuel will kill it. Check the
> > genset alternator, source of battery problem too.
> > bob janes, greenville, sc
> >
> > --- In WanderlodgeForum@ yahoogroups. com, "Ernest Ekberg"
> >
> > >
> > > dave Hardy- 84 PT40, his generator, while running will not
charge
> his
> > > generator battery. The inverter on the coach is no help. He can
> put
> > an
> > > aux battery charger on the generator battery and the generator
> will
> > run
> > > from now on- without that the voltage drops and she dies.
Anyone
> have
> > > ever have the same problem? How about a fix? Thanks, Ernie-
83PT40
> in
> > > Texas- my generator just leaks diesel- no problem there
> > >
> >
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
generator weirdness - warbucks13477 - 12-23-2006 09:11
For those that are interested in attending a rally here in NY in the
spring troubleshooting of the charging system may be of interest to
you as well as how to check isolators, how they are constructed etc.
tom warner
vernon center,ny
1985 PT 40
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Jay Darst"
wrote:
>
> Replace the battery with a known good one.
>
> Take a volt reading on the gen battery with out anything running.
>
> Now, with the Inverter in charge mode(either shore power or gen
power
> connected), check the voltage at the gen battery. If the voltage
does
> not increase with the inverter/charger on, probably the isolator
has
> an issue or there is a broken wire from the rear compartment
running
> up to the gen battery. My brothers FC had a 2ga cable with hole
> rubbed in the insulation, about mid coach. Ran from the battery
bank
> to the stock inverter. Kept depleting his battery bank.
>
> I removed the factory isolator, someone told me it was a rectified
> isolator- don't have a clue what the "rectified" part is. Anyway,
the
> new isolator is a Sure Power Industries 24023A, 160 amp isolator.
> Looses about .2 volts input to output posts. Bought brand new on E-
> bay for $90.
>
> I'm guessing now...
> Maybe the fuel solenoid is compromised and requires higher volatge
to
> remain in the ON position????
> Is the connection to the fuel solenoid not so good?
> Where's Ralph?
>
> Jay Darst
> 85PT40
> Springfield, IL
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "one_dusty_hoot"
>
> >
> > Ernie, sound to me like the aux charger is keeping
> > the fuel pump going,no fuel will kill it. Check the
> > genset alternator, source of battery problem too.
> > bob janes, greenville, sc
> >
> > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ernest Ekberg"
> >
> > >
> > > dave Hardy- 84 PT40, his generator, while running will not
charge
> his
> > > generator battery. The inverter on the coach is no help. He can
> put
> > an
> > > aux battery charger on the generator battery and the generator
> will
> > run
> > > from now on- without that the voltage drops and she dies.
Anyone
> have
> > > ever have the same problem? How about a fix? Thanks, Ernie-
83PT40
> in
> > > Texas- my generator just leaks diesel- no problem there
> > >
> >
>
generator weirdness - mrkane1952 - 12-23-2006 16:27
Greetings:
This is similar to a fault I experienced with my '85 PT40. My fix
required first replacing the solenoid under the entry step, then the
second solenoid mounted in the rear under the battery charger
compartment, and finally the 30 Amp circuit breaker mounted near the
rear solenoid.
The forward solenoid was apparently constantly drawing current, as it
was warm to the touch. I replaced it and the rear one as a
preventative measure. ($20 each from O'Reilly's.) I think the main
problem was the failed circuit breaker, which was open.
The diode, if good, should show a voltage drop of around 0.7 volts in
the conducting direction. Common failure mode is shorting to ground.
Ralph performed the main troubleshooting that helped me resolve this
problem. BTW, I think the root cause of the failure was boiling the
gen battery dry, leading to excess current in the charging circuit.
I have schematics and can provide a copy via email if needed.
Otherwise, I'm in the Sanger, TX area for the next week or so.
--M.R.Kane
'85 PT40
> > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ernest Ekberg"
> > >
> > > >
> > > > dave Hardy- 84 PT40, his generator, while running will not
> charge
> > his
> > > > generator battery. The inverter on the coach is no help. He can
> > put
> > > an
> > > > aux battery charger on the generator battery and the generator
> > will
> > > run
> > > > from now on- without that the voltage drops and she dies.
> Anyone
> > have
> > > > ever have the same problem? How about a fix? Thanks, Ernie-
> 83PT40
> > in
> > > > Texas- my generator just leaks diesel- no problem there
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
generator weirdness - Curt Sprenger - 12-23-2006 16:36
Please send me a copy via email. Thank you. One never knows what was the
same, and what was different between 'Bird years.
curtsprenger @ adlephia . com remove the spaces.
Curt Sprenger
1987 PT38 8V92 "MacAttack Racing"
Anaheim Hills, Calif.
>I have schematics and can provide a copy via email if needed.
>Otherwise, I'm in the Sanger, TX area for the next week or so.
>
>--M.R.Kane
>'85 PT40
>
>
>
>
generator weirdness - dhardy1944 - 12-27-2006 02:59
Hi Ernie,
My thanks to you and others in the group for possible fixes on the
generator problem. I have been gone and did not see the posts until
this morning. I took the battery out Friday and left it with
Interstate batteries to make sure it was ok. We have some company
with us, but hope to do some checking on the Bird today. I expect
one of my primary problems will be locating everything (where it is
and what it looks like). I will post again when I have worked with
it a little. Thanks again so very much.
Dave in Tulsa (84 PT 40)
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "mrkane1952" <mrkane@...>
wrote:
>
> Greetings:
>
> This is similar to a fault I experienced with my '85 PT40. My fix
> required first replacing the solenoid under the entry step, then
the
> second solenoid mounted in the rear under the battery charger
> compartment, and finally the 30 Amp circuit breaker mounted near
the
> rear solenoid.
>
> The forward solenoid was apparently constantly drawing current, as
it
> was warm to the touch. I replaced it and the rear one as a
> preventative measure. ($20 each from O'Reilly's.) I think the
main
> problem was the failed circuit breaker, which was open.
>
> The diode, if good, should show a voltage drop of around 0.7 volts
in
> the conducting direction. Common failure mode is shorting to
ground.
>
> Ralph performed the main troubleshooting that helped me resolve
this
> problem. BTW, I think the root cause of the failure was boiling
the
> gen battery dry, leading to excess current in the charging circuit.
>
> I have schematics and can provide a copy via email if needed.
> Otherwise, I'm in the Sanger, TX area for the next week or so.
>
> --M.R.Kane
> '85 PT40
>
>
> > > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ernest Ekberg"
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > dave Hardy- 84 PT40, his generator, while running will not
> > charge
> > > his
> > > > > generator battery. The inverter on the coach is no help.
He can
> > > put
> > > > an
> > > > > aux battery charger on the generator battery and the
generator
> > > will
> > > > run
> > > > > from now on- without that the voltage drops and she dies.
> > Anyone
> > > have
> > > > > ever have the same problem? How about a fix? Thanks, Ernie-
> > 83PT40
> > > in
> > > > > Texas- my generator just leaks diesel- no problem there
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
generator weirdness - erniecarpet@... - 12-27-2006 03:25
Hi Don, Dave wrote me and said he had his grandkids for Christmas. i suspect
when they go home he will be back at work on his generator. Thanks for your
input.
Ernie Ekberg
83PT40
Weatherford, tx
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
generator weirdness - erniecarpet@... - 12-27-2006 05:12
In a message dated 12/27/2006 3:08:15 P.M. Mountain Standard Time,
dhardy@... writes:
Ralph mentioned I should have a diode behind the bumper on driver's
side.
Dave- don't feel bad. I wouldn't know a diode from anything else- unless it
has a label on it that says "diode"
Ernie Ekberg
83PT40
Weatherford, tx
--electrically challenged
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
generator weirdness - worktohobby - 12-27-2006 08:12
Ernie,
On my 1987 the genset charge circuit is is tied in to the two hot
terminals on the auxillary battery relay (Genset batter + post, and
coach batteries + Post). It is a very simple circuit, a 30 amp circuit
breaker in line with a 50 amp diode wired between the previous
mentioned hot posts. If the diode burns out or the self reseting fuse
fails no charge may reach the battery. My genset has no alternator.
The main problem with this set up when working is the 0.6 voltage drop
accross the diode; the genset battery never sees a decent charge.
On my coach I disconnected the diode/circuit braker and installed a 50
amp battery combiner accross the two hot posts. Now whenever charge
voltages are present the combiner combines the two coach battery banks
(genset/coach) and the genset battery recieves an excellant charge.
This bus has no battery isolator.
Regards,
Don Duncan
1987 PT40
Beaverton, Oregon
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ernest Ekberg"
>
> dave Hardy- 84 PT40, his generator, while running will not charge
his
> generator battery. The inverter on the coach is no help. He can put
an
> aux battery charger on the generator battery and the generator will
run
> from now on- without that the voltage drops and she dies. Anyone
have
> ever have the same problem? How about a fix? Thanks, Ernie-83PT40 in
> Texas- my generator just leaks diesel- no problem there
>