LX vs LXi

[tumble_weed_ft]

I notice that the Wanderlodge LX resale amounts are significantly lower
than the LXi and earlier model Wanderlodges. Why is this? Is the LX a
newer version of the BMC? Does it have a different chassis? Just doing
my research. I'm thinking about possibly fulltiming in the future and
have been interested in a Wanderlodge. I would like one with a Detroit
Series 60 but don't know if I will be able to afford that. I also want
to stay at the 40 to 41 length.

Thanks in advance for your input.

Dave

[Pete Masterson]

The DD Series 60, an in-line 6 cylinder engine is longer than the previously used DD 8V92 (a V8). So, the 40' chassis was extended by about 2' and some inches to accommodate the Series 60 engine. It was first used in the '95 "42 foot" model. (Some one claims that it actually measures 42' 3" -- but I haven't measured my coach to get the exact length.)

Sometime after 95, the DD Series 60 engine was repositioned to allow a larger rear closet and the 43' model was born. In 1996, the 42' had the S-60 and the 40' had the 8V92. In 1997, a 41' and 43' model with the DD Series 60 were available. There was no 40' model in '97. (97 BMC had 37 and 40 models with a Cummins engine.)

In 1998 the LX and LXi models were introduced. 1999 model line up was about the same.

LX - 40' with Cummins M11/450hp engine

LXi - 41' and 43' with S-60/500hp engine

LX                LXi-40       LXi-43

12.5kw      15kw          15kw  -- generator

175 gal      260 gal      300 gal diesel fuel capacity

4 house      4 house      6 house batteries

47200       47400        48900 GVWR

no                yes             yes  -- bulk oil fill

3000w       3000w       6000w inverter(s) total capacity

there are also modest differences in the fresh and holding tank capacities,

alternator sizes, and other details.

Judging from the brochure photos, it appears that the shorter LX had a less elaborate interior design than the LXi, although the basic components are quite similar. But differences seem to include laminate covered cabinets vs. stained wood, more leather-like furniture, more mirrors (including on the ceiling), etc. 

So, it appears that the LX is simply a 'stripper' (but still high-end) design with fewer features than the LXi with the major difference being a 50 hp lower powered engine.

In 2000, the 40' LX was joined by a 40' LX - Millennium Limited Edition. Same engine, generator, and capacities as the regular LX, but with (apparently) a higher-design level interior. The 41' LXi was gone from the line-up. A Millennium Limited Edition LXi was also produced. These Millennium edition units might have a higher resale price to reflect the upgraded interior fittings.

In 2003, the M380 and M450 were introduced, ending the LX and LXi era.

See the Vintage birds "history" link at 

<http://www.vintagebirds.com>

Pete Masterson

'95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42

El Sobrante CA

"aeonix1@mac.com"

On Apr 9, 2008, at 6:42 PM, tumble_weed_ft wrote:

I notice that the Wanderlodge LX resale amounts are significantly lower 

than the LXi and earlier model Wanderlodges. Why is this? Is the LX a 

newer version of the BMC? Does it have a different chassis? Just doing 

my research. I'm thinking about possibly fulltiming in the future and 

have been interested in a Wanderlodge. I would like one with a Detroit 

Series 60 but don't know if I will be able to afford that. I also want 

to stay at the 40 to 41 length.

Thanks in advance for your input.

Dave

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[tumble_weed_ft]

Pete:

Thanks. Great information. Does the LX have the same chassis and
steel siding / roofing as prior Wanderlodges and the LXi? Other than
the lower horsepower, is the Cummins engine considered inferior to
the DD?

Dave

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete Masterson
wrote:
>
> The DD Series 60, an in-line 6 cylinder engine is longer than the
> previously used DD 8V92 (a V8). So, the 40' chassis was extended
by
> about 2' and some inches to accommodate the Series 60 engine. It
was
> first used in the '95 "42 foot" model. (Some one claims that it
> actually measures 42' 3" -- but I haven't measured my coach to get
> the exact length.)
>
> Sometime after 95, the DD Series 60 engine was repositioned to
allow
> a larger rear closet and the 43' model was born. In 1996, the 42'
had
> the S-60 and the 40' had the 8V92. In 1997, a 41' and 43' model
with
> the DD Series 60 were available. There was no 40' model in '97.
(97
> BMC had 37 and 40 models with a Cummins engine.)
>
> In 1998 the LX and LXi models were introduced. 1999 model line up
was
> about the same.
> LX - 40' with Cummins M11/450hp engine
> LXi - 41' and 43' with S-60/500hp engine
>
> LX LXi-40 LXi-43
> 12.5kw 15kw 15kw -- generator
> 175 gal 260 gal 300 gal diesel fuel capacity
> 4 house 4 house 6 house batteries
> 47200 47400 48900 GVWR
> no yes yes -- bulk oil fill
> 3000w 3000w 6000w inverter(s) total capacity
> there are also modest differences in the fresh and holding tank
> capacities,
> alternator sizes, and other details.
> Judging from the brochure photos, it appears that the shorter LX
had
> a less elaborate interior design than the LXi, although the basic
> components are quite similar. But differences seem to include
> laminate covered cabinets vs. stained wood, more leather-like
> furniture, more mirrors (including on the ceiling), etc.
>
> So, it appears that the LX is simply a 'stripper' (but still high-
> end) design with fewer features than the LXi with the major
> difference being a 50 hp lower powered engine.
>
> In 2000, the 40' LX was joined by a 40' LX - Millennium Limited
> Edition. Same engine, generator, and capacities as the regular LX,
> but with (apparently) a higher-design level interior. The 41' LXi
was
> gone from the line-up. A Millennium Limited Edition LXi was also
> produced. These Millennium edition units might have a higher
resale
> price to reflect the upgraded interior fittings.
>
> In 2003, the M380 and M450 were introduced, ending the LX and LXi
era.
>
> See the Vintage birds "history" link at
> <http://www.vintagebirds.com>
>
> Pete Masterson
> '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42
> El Sobrante CA
> aeonix1@...
>
>
>
> On Apr 9, 2008, at 6:42 PM, tumble_weed_ft wrote:
>
> > I notice that the Wanderlodge LX resale amounts are
significantly
> > lower
> > than the LXi and earlier model Wanderlodges. Why is this? Is the
LX a
> > newer version of the BMC? Does it have a different chassis? Just
doing
> > my research. I'm thinking about possibly fulltiming in the future
and
> > have been interested in a Wanderlodge. I would like one with a
Detroit
> > Series 60 but don't know if I will be able to afford that. I also
want
> > to stay at the 40 to 41 length.
> >
> > Thanks in advance for your input.
> >
> > Dave
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>

[Pete Masterson]

Looking at the photos I've seen of the various LX and LXi units, they appear to be variations of the same chassis. The length difference all appears to be behind the rear axle, although that may be an optical illusion as I've never seen a longer and shorter coach side by side. (I can assure you that the extra rear overhang of the longer units is not without some annoyances when encountering driveway dips, etc.) I suppose somewhere you might find specifications that list the wheel base of the various models.

The specifications given on the Vintage Birds site, describes near-identical running gear for the different models -- but the GVWR differences would suggest slightly different components in the axles, etc. The one earlier model, the BMC that used a different chassis, had a lot of family resemblance but is still fairly obviously not the same chassis as the 'regular' Wanderlodges built in the same years. The 40, 41, and 43' LX and LXi appear to be near identical in every visible way in the exterior views, so it appears that the chassis is the same. The primary difference in the resale value would appear to be related to the slightly lower hp engine and value difference of the variations in fittings. 

The "missing" 50 hp in the Cummins engine might be noticeable, but not critical to the use and enjoyment of the coach. (Indeed, my '95 has a 470 hp DD S-60 and there have been times that I'd sure like to have the 30 extra hp the DD S-60 in the '96 had ...). Other than that, Cummins makes well regarded engines used in a wide variety of heavy equipment. 

Indeed, I recently read a report that stated that DD, owned by Daimler (of Germany) will, in the future, only be used in Daimler produced products. Daimler owns Freightliner (trucks and RV chassis), Orion Bus (transit busses), Setra (highway busses), Sterling (trucks), Thomas (school bus), Western Star Trucks, and Mitsubishi Fuso (outside the US). They will continue to provide service to existing DD engines no matter what installation they may have.

Anyway, I would not be adverse to having a Cummins engine powered vehicle. DD, Cat, and Cummins are  (and have been) very competitive heavy equipment engine manufacturers for many years. Over time, one or another has on top, but all have been competitive. I note that the 2009 Wanderlodge uses a Cummins 600 hp ISX engine. The only downside to the Cummins engine WLs is that there are very few of them so finding list-members with direct experience might prove difficult. (But the many similarities from model to model and year to year will still make the online list/forum beneficial.)

Pete Masterson

'95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42

El Sobrante CA

"aeonix1@mac.com"

On Apr 10, 2008, at 5:52 PM, tumble_weed_ft wrote:

Pete:

Thanks. Great information. Does the LX have the same chassis and 

steel siding / roofing as prior Wanderlodges and the LXi? Other than 

the lower horsepower, is the Cummins engine considered inferior to 

the DD?

Dave

<snip>

[tumble_weed_ft]

Thanks Pete.

Dave

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete Masterson
wrote:
>
> Looking at the photos I've seen of the various LX and LXi units,
they
> appear to be variations of the same chassis. The length difference
> all appears to be behind the rear axle, although that may be an
> optical illusion as I've never seen a longer and shorter coach
side
> by side. (I can assure you that the extra rear overhang of the
longer
> units is not without some annoyances when encountering driveway
dips,
> etc.) I suppose somewhere you might find specifications that list
the
> wheel base of the various models.
>
> The specifications given on the Vintage Birds site, describes near-
> identical running gear for the different models -- but the GVWR
> differences would suggest slightly different components in the
axles,
> etc. The one earlier model, the BMC that used a different chassis,
> had a lot of family resemblance but is still fairly obviously not
the
> same chassis as the 'regular' Wanderlodges built in the same
years.
> The 40, 41, and 43' LX and LXi appear to be near identical in
every
> visible way in the exterior views, so it appears that the chassis
is
> the same. The primary difference in the resale value would appear
to
> be related to the slightly lower hp engine and value difference of
> the variations in fittings.
>
> The "missing" 50 hp in the Cummins engine might be noticeable, but
> not critical to the use and enjoyment of the coach. (Indeed,
my '95
> has a 470 hp DD S-60 and there have been times that I'd sure like
to
> have the 30 extra hp the DD S-60 in the '96 had ...). Other than
> that, Cummins makes well regarded engines used in a wide variety
of
> heavy equipment.
>
> Indeed, I recently read a report that stated that DD, owned by
> Daimler (of Germany) will, in the future, only be used in Daimler
> produced products. Daimler owns Freightliner (trucks and RV
chassis),
> Orion Bus (transit busses), Setra (highway busses), Sterling
> (trucks), Thomas (school bus), Western Star Trucks, and Mitsubishi
> Fuso (outside the US). They will continue to provide service to
> existing DD engines no matter what installation they may have.
>
> Anyway, I would not be adverse to having a Cummins engine powered
> vehicle. DD, Cat, and Cummins are (and have been) very
competitive
> heavy equipment engine manufacturers for many years. Over time,
one
> or another has on top, but all have been competitive. I note that
the
> 2009 Wanderlodge uses a Cummins 600 hp ISX engine. The only
downside
> to the Cummins engine WLs is that there are very few of them so
> finding list-members with direct experience might prove difficult.
> (But the many similarities from model to model and year to year
will
> still make the online list/forum beneficial.)
>
> Pete Masterson
> '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42
> El Sobrante CA
> aeonix1@...
>
>
>
> On Apr 10, 2008, at 5:52 PM, tumble_weed_ft wrote:
>
> > Pete:
> >
> > Thanks. Great information. Does the LX have the same chassis and
> > steel siding / roofing as prior Wanderlodges and the LXi? Other
than
> > the lower horsepower, is the Cummins engine considered inferior to
> > the DD?
> >
> > Dave
> > <snip>
>

[David Brady]

The LX has a 247" wheelbase versus the LXi's 259" wheelbase.

Check out http://www.vintagebirds.com/ for additional specs and

differences between the LX and LXi. I think Pete pretty much

summed it up. I might add:



LX: Fresh water: 108 gal, black 75, gray 75; 12R22.5 tires;

175 gal fuel tank; GVWR 48600 lb; 200 Amp alternator;

12.5 KW generator; 3 basement doors per side.



LXi: Fresh water: 120 gal, black 80, gray 90; 315/80/22.5 tires;

300 gal fuel tank; GVWR 52200 lb; 300 Amp alternator;

15 KW generator; 4 basement doors per side; shore power cord

auto spooler.





The interior appointments are a world apart.



David Brady

'02 LXi, NC



Pete Masterson wrote:

Looking at the photos I've seen of the various LX and LXi units,
they appear to be variations of the same chassis. The length difference
all appears to be behind the rear axle, although that may be an optical
illusion as I've never seen a longer and shorter coach side by side. (I
can assure you that the extra rear overhang of the longer units is not
without some annoyances when encountering driveway dips, etc.) I
suppose somewhere you might find specifications that list the wheel
base of the various models.

The specifications given on the Vintage Birds site, describes
near-identical running gear for the different models -- but the GVWR
differences would suggest slightly different components in the axles,
etc. The one earlier model, the BMC that used a different chassis, had
a lot of family resemblance but is still fairly obviously not the same
chassis as the 'regular' Wanderlodges built in the same years. The 40,
41, and 43' LX and LXi appear to be near identical in every visible way
in the exterior views, so it appears that the chassis is the same. The
primary difference in the resale value would appear to be related to
the slightly lower hp engine and value difference of the variations in
fittings.

The "missing" 50 hp in the Cummins engine might be noticeable,
but not critical to the use and enjoyment of the coach. (Indeed, my '95
has a 470 hp DD S-60 and there have been times that I'd sure like to
have the 30 extra hp the DD S-60 in the '96 had ...). Other than that,
Cummins makes well regarded engines used in a wide variety of heavy
equipment.

Indeed, I recently read a report that stated that DD, owned by
Daimler (of Germany) will, in the future, only be used in Daimler
produced products. Daimler owns Freightliner (trucks and RV chassis),
Orion Bus (transit busses), Setra (highway busses), Sterling (trucks),
Thomas (school bus), Western Star Trucks, and Mitsubishi Fuso (outside
the US). They will continue to provide service to existing DD engines
no matter what installation they may have.

Anyway, I would not be adverse to having a Cummins engine
powered vehicle. DD, Cat, and Cummins are (and have been) very
competitive heavy equipment engine manufacturers for many years. Over
time, one or another has on top, but all have been competitive. I note
that the 2009 Wanderlodge uses a Cummins 600 hp ISX engine. The only
downside to the Cummins engine WLs is that there are very few of them
so finding list-members with direct experience might prove difficult.
(But the manysimilaritiesfrom model to model and year to year
will still make the online list/forum beneficial.)

Pete Masterson

'95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42

El Sobrante CA

"aeonix1@mac.com"

On Apr 10, 2008, at 5:52 PM, tumble_weed_ft wrote:

Pete:

Thanks. Great information. Does the LX have the same chassis
and

steel siding / roofing as prior Wanderlodges and the LXi?
Other than

the lower horsepower, is the Cummins engine considered
inferior to

the DD?

Dave

<snip>

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