SP's and Baby Birds

[brad barton]

Ralph and Hank,
I agree. The SP36 was a real Bird. Many of us would like to have coaches
under 40 or 43 feet for vacationing and party coaching. But who wants to
buy a short Bird of lower quality? And as a former Newell owner, I can
testify to the many advantages of a mid-entry coach; parking flexibility,
less ground to cover when loading the coach, more frontal-crash strength and
a co-pilot seat that's even with the driver and easier on the neck for
conversation.
Brad Barton


>From: "Ralph L. Fullenwider"
>Reply-To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
>To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] SP's and Baby Birds
>Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2007 12:06:59 -0600
>
>Ah Hank no argument on that at all, the mid door like the SP's would be
>great. But then BB would make a killing if they put out Baby Birds too. 450
>HP in a 28 or 30 footer! Talk scoot and get it! Now there would be a
>Bird to run at Maxton hey?
>
>Safe travels,
>
>Ralph and Charolette Fullenwider
> '84 FC35 Duncan, Oklahoma
>Ralph's RV Solutions
>
>At 04:48 PM 3/14/2007 +0000, you wrote:
> >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph L. Fullenwider"
> > wrote:
> > >RALPH:
> >I've had a few BIRDS.....This 1990SP36 is probably the BEST BIRD
> >they ever made.....Mid door..all the trimmings etc. I call it my
> >M380 without the problems....except I would like it to go over the
> >mountains a little faster!
> >If Bluebird would make some 2008 SP38's with a mid-door and a 450hp
> >diesel engine they would sell a TON of them!!!
> >That's my two cents from VEGAS and I am confident that my comments
> >will get something started!!!
> >LOL
> >Hank Hannigan
> >1990SP36 in Vegas just "lovin it!"
> > >
> > >
> > > Interesting analogy with some truths but fiberglass bodies? no.
> > >
> > > Truth, the Wanderlodge II was a striped down model that what once
> >was OE
> > > became options. things like HWH jacks and many others.
> > >
> > > Starting in '88 with the advent of wide body, the front and rear
> >caps were
> > > fiberglass but the side and roof were steel.
> > >
> > > The BMC, true is not a Wanderlodge, however the sides and roof are
> >steel,
> > > though I think, not sure, that the compartment doors were fiber
> >glass.
> > >
> > > The LX, fiberglass caps that started in '88 but sides and roof are
> >steel,
> > > as are the LXI.
> > >
> > > The M 380 was not fiberglass but a composite aluminium, 2 sheets
> >of
> > > aluminium with a composite center. The main problem with the 380
> >was the
> > > skin would grow and shrink with heat and cold, thus the sides
> >would
> > > wrinkle. Yes there were a few problems with the electrical but the
> >lay out
> > > of the panel was done right for a change. The main problem with
> >the
> > > electrical we the marriage between the slide and HWH jack system
> >via the
> > > micro p[rocesser. If the Coach was not level, the microprocessor
> >would not
> > > allow the slide to move, so the computer had to be reset, jacks
> >retracted
> > > and start the system again. There was also a problem of the slide
> >locks
> > > pulling, going down the road, this was usually caused by a mis
> >adjusted
> > > micro switch.
> > >
> > > The LX 450 got away form most of that and went to stainless steel
> >and
> > > introduced multiplexing of systems with a beefed up microprocessor.
> > >
> > > The myth of the LX model being fiberglass came from the mid year
> >change in,
> > > what? 2002 or 2003 where the skin was taken to the composite used
> >on the M
> > > 380 and was the test bed for the 380.
> > >
> > > There was nothing cheap about all of this, the R&D alone had to
> >cost a
> > > bundle because of the change, it is just too bad that the skin
> >problems on
> > > the 380 were not better thought out.
> > >
> > > Also with the 380 the signature of the Wanderlodge took it's major
> >hit, the
> > > "goat rails" were missing, and to my thinking, this was and is the
> >largest
> > > mistake BB could have made. Now they look like the Monaco's and
> >various
> > > other Manufacturers Coaches.
> > >
> > > No, the LX and LXI models are good stable units, though a bit too
> >glitzy
> > > inside for my taste. I don't go camping to clean mirrors on the
> >ceilings.
> > >
> > >
> > > Just my 2 cents
> > >
> > > Safe travels,
> > >
> > > Ralph and Charolette Fullenwider
> > > 84FC35
> > > Ralph's RV Solutions, Duncan, Oklahoma
> > >
> > > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "brad barton"
> > > > ><bbartonwx@> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Damien,
> > > > > > I'm new to the group, but a longtime Blue Bird fan. I think
> >the
> > > > >coach you
> > > > > > are looking at is a black and silver coach with modern
> >decor..and
> > > > >it's at a
> > > > > > truck dealer. We were considering an LX but cooled off. A
> >retired
> > > > >dealer
> > > > > > with whom we did business twice (for our first 84-35FC and a
> >1986
> > > > >Newell
> > > > > > Classic) nearly came unglued when I brought it up. He was a
> > > > >longtime Blue
> > > > > > Bird dealer in the 70s and 80s. I have since found out some
> >things
> > > > >about
> > > > > > the LX. You're free to accept or reject all of this but I
> >believe
> > > > >it is
> > > > > > true. Most of it came from a Blue Bird rep I spoke to just
> >weeks
> > > > >ago.
> > > > > > Blue Bird has constantly searched for ways to a lower price
> >point.
> > > > >The
> > > > > > WanderlodgeII was the first attempt..and pretty sad. Then as
> > > > >Wanderlodges
> > > > > > got more expensive, Blue Bird looked for a new approach.
> >Their
> > > > >engineers
> > > > > > said it would take two years to come up with a less
> >expensive 37-
> > > > >40'
> > > > > > chassis, so they bought Spartan chassis with Cummins M11
> >engines.
> > > > >They were
> > > > > > known as a Blue Bird Motor Coach..or a BMC. The only thing
> >Blue
> > > > >Bird on it
> > > > > > was the dash and the label. The BMC is NOT a Wanderlodge.
> >Not
> > > > >bad, just
> > > > > > cheap. By the time those chassis ran out, the engineers had
> >a new
> > > > >40'
> > > > > > platform. They kept the fiberglass body, put new caps on
> >front and
> > > > >rear,
> > > > > > kept the Cummins engine but used their own superior Blue Bird
> > > > >chassis with
> > > > > > Ridewell air suspension. Of all the "cheep" Birds, the LX is
> > > > >probably the
> > > > > > best. But it's still fiberglass outside, virtually no
> >chrome,
> > > > >ultraleather
> > > > > > vinyl inside, smaller in tank capacity, lacking in design,
> > > > >especially around
> > > > > > the windows and roughly $150,000 in overall quality, fit and
> > > > >finish. We bit
> > > > > > the bullet and moved on to the LXi and we're very glad we
> >did.
> > > > > > LX owners asking 165K and up don't like to hear their coach
> >is only
> > > > >little
> > > > > > more than "half" bird, but the truth hurts. NADA book
> >prices on
> > > > >the 2000 LX
> > > > > > are very harsh..upper 90's to 110's. LX owners have every
> >right to
> > > > >feel
> > > > > > bitter, but as a buyer, I asked several dealers (who had
> >nothing to
> > > > >gain
> > > > > > from me) what they would offer. One said 95K, one said 110K
> >and
> > > > >the one
> > > > > > whole actually knew the actual coach said 150K was a serious
> > > > >stretch. Not
> > > > > > only are LX owners unhappy, but WBPT and LXi owners are mad,
> >too
> > > > >because
> > > > > > their own manufacturer made it harder for them to sell their
> >high-
> > > > >dollar
> > > > > > coaches. And Blue Bird has done it again..most recently
> >wiith the
> > > > >M380
> > > > > > which was a disaster (Blue Bird rep's word). I can't
> >confirm it,
> > > > >but I
> > > > > > heard every one of them was recalled for various problems,
> >mainly
> > > > >electrical
> > > > > > and wiring. They are not made any longer except by special
> >order.
> > > > > > All that being said, there's nothing wrong with a Cummins M-
> >11 or
> > > > >Allison
> > > > > > 4060, or Ultraleather or fiberglass, for that matter. Just
> >make
> > > > >sure you
> > > > > > understand it's not the steel-bodied full-fledged
> >Wanderlodge most
> > > > >of us
> > > > > > think of. A poor man's Wanderlodge LX is probably still a
> >lot
> > > > >better than
> > > > > > most coaches, new or used. If you want the best LX
> >currently on
> > > > >the market,
> > > > > > look at this coach. It's garaged in Michigan and virtually
> > > > >pristine. Nice
> > > > > > people, too.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > http://www.rvtrader.com/rvdetail519280.htm
> > > > > >
> > > > > > BBarton in Dallas
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >From: "remiksjewelry"
> > > > > > >Reply-To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > > >To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > > >Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Thinking of joining the birders!
> > > > > > >Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2007 22:33:14 -0000
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >Hello -
> > > > > > >Thanks for having this group! We currently have a Safari
> >Trek and
> > > > >are
> > > > > > >looking into upgrading to a Bluebird. We found one we
> >like - it
> > > > >is a
> > > > > > >2000 LX Millenium edition. It is for sale in Maryland.
> >Does any
> > > > >know
> > > > > > >anything about this particular coach? The price seems
> >right, but
> > > > >we
> > > > > > >would have to travel quite a distance to see it for
> >ourselves.
> > > > >Also,
> > > > > > >would love to know about the ride and handling of a bird.
> > > > > > >Is the M11 450 cummings a reliable engine?
> > > > > > >Any comments or advice will be greatly appreciated.
> > > > > > >Thanks!
> > > > > > >Damien
> > > > > > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
With tax season right around the corner, make sure to follow these few
simple tips.
http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Tax...aspx?\
icid=HMFebtagline

[Henry Jay Hannigan]

--- RALPH:
450HP in a 2008 SP38 would be great!!!....450HP in a 30 foot middoor
SP Bird would be PRICELESS!!
Maybe someone at Bluebird is listening.
Safe travels to you Too!
Regards,
Hank Hannigan & Naty
1990 SP36 in Vegas









In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph L. Fullenwider"
wrote:
>
> Ah Hank no argument on that at all, the mid door like the SP's
would be
> great. But then BB would make a killing if they put out Baby Birds
too. 450
> HP in a 28 or 30 footer! Talk scoot and get it! Now there
would be a
> Bird to run at Maxton hey?
>
> Safe travels,
>
> Ralph and Charolette Fullenwider
> '84 FC35 Duncan, Oklahoma
> Ralph's RV Solutions
>
> At 04:48 PM 3/14/2007 +0000, you wrote:
> >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph L. Fullenwider"
> > wrote:
> > >RALPH:
> >I've had a few BIRDS.....This 1990SP36 is probably the BEST BIRD
> >they ever made.....Mid door..all the trimmings etc. I call it my
> >M380 without the problems....except I would like it to go over the
> >mountains a little faster!
> >If Bluebird would make some 2008 SP38's with a mid-door and a
450hp
> >diesel engine they would sell a TON of them!!!
> >That's my two cents from VEGAS and I am confident that my comments
> >will get something started!!!
> >LOL
> >Hank Hannigan
> >1990SP36 in Vegas just "lovin it!"
> > >
> > >
> > > Interesting analogy with some truths but fiberglass bodies? no.
> > >
> > > Truth, the Wanderlodge II was a striped down model that what
once
> >was OE
> > > became options. things like HWH jacks and many others.
> > >
> > > Starting in '88 with the advent of wide body, the front and
rear
> >caps were
> > > fiberglass but the side and roof were steel.
> > >
> > > The BMC, true is not a Wanderlodge, however the sides and roof
are
> >steel,
> > > though I think, not sure, that the compartment doors were fiber
> >glass.
> > >
> > > The LX, fiberglass caps that started in '88 but sides and roof
are
> >steel,
> > > as are the LXI.
> > >
> > > The M 380 was not fiberglass but a composite aluminium, 2
sheets
> >of
> > > aluminium with a composite center. The main problem with the
380
> >was the
> > > skin would grow and shrink with heat and cold, thus the sides
> >would
> > > wrinkle. Yes there were a few problems with the electrical but
the
> >lay out
> > > of the panel was done right for a change. The main problem with
> >the
> > > electrical we the marriage between the slide and HWH jack
system
> >via the
> > > micro p[rocesser. If the Coach was not level, the
microprocessor
> >would not
> > > allow the slide to move, so the computer had to be reset, jacks
> >retracted
> > > and start the system again. There was also a problem of the
slide
> >locks
> > > pulling, going down the road, this was usually caused by a mis
> >adjusted
> > > micro switch.
> > >
> > > The LX 450 got away form most of that and went to stainless
steel
> >and
> > > introduced multiplexing of systems with a beefed up
microprocessor.
> > >
> > > The myth of the LX model being fiberglass came from the mid
year
> >change in,
> > > what? 2002 or 2003 where the skin was taken to the composite
used
> >on the M
> > > 380 and was the test bed for the 380.
> > >
> > > There was nothing cheap about all of this, the R&D alone had to
> >cost a
> > > bundle because of the change, it is just too bad that the skin
> >problems on
> > > the 380 were not better thought out.
> > >
> > > Also with the 380 the signature of the Wanderlodge took it's
major
> >hit, the
> > > "goat rails" were missing, and to my thinking, this was and is
the
> >largest
> > > mistake BB could have made. Now they look like the Monaco's and
> >various
> > > other Manufacturers Coaches.
> > >
> > > No, the LX and LXI models are good stable units, though a bit
too
> >glitzy
> > > inside for my taste. I don't go camping to clean mirrors on the
> >ceilings.
> > >
> > >
> > > Just my 2 cents
> > >
> > > Safe travels,
> > >
> > > Ralph and Charolette Fullenwider
> > > 84FC35
> > > Ralph's RV Solutions, Duncan, Oklahoma
> > >
> > > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "brad barton"
> > > > ><bbartonwx@> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Damien,
> > > > > > I'm new to the group, but a longtime Blue Bird fan. I
think
> >the
> > > > >coach you
> > > > > > are looking at is a black and silver coach with modern
> >decor..and
> > > > >it's at a
> > > > > > truck dealer. We were considering an LX but cooled
off. A
> >retired
> > > > >dealer
> > > > > > with whom we did business twice (for our first 84-35FC
and a
> >1986
> > > > >Newell
> > > > > > Classic) nearly came unglued when I brought it up. He
was a
> > > > >longtime Blue
> > > > > > Bird dealer in the 70s and 80s. I have since found out
some
> >things
> > > > >about
> > > > > > the LX. You're free to accept or reject all of this but
I
> >believe
> > > > >it is
> > > > > > true. Most of it came from a Blue Bird rep I spoke to
just
> >weeks
> > > > >ago.
> > > > > > Blue Bird has constantly searched for ways to a lower
price
> >point.
> > > > >The
> > > > > > WanderlodgeII was the first attempt..and pretty sad.
Then as
> > > > >Wanderlodges
> > > > > > got more expensive, Blue Bird looked for a new approach.
> >Their
> > > > >engineers
> > > > > > said it would take two years to come up with a less
> >expensive 37-
> > > > >40'
> > > > > > chassis, so they bought Spartan chassis with Cummins M11
> >engines.
> > > > >They were
> > > > > > known as a Blue Bird Motor Coach..or a BMC. The only
thing
> >Blue
> > > > >Bird on it
> > > > > > was the dash and the label. The BMC is NOT a
Wanderlodge.
> >Not
> > > > >bad, just
> > > > > > cheap. By the time those chassis ran out, the engineers
had
> >a new
> > > > >40'
> > > > > > platform. They kept the fiberglass body, put new caps on
> >front and
> > > > >rear,
> > > > > > kept the Cummins engine but used their own superior Blue
Bird
> > > > >chassis with
> > > > > > Ridewell air suspension. Of all the "cheep" Birds, the
LX is
> > > > >probably the
> > > > > > best. But it's still fiberglass outside, virtually no
> >chrome,
> > > > >ultraleather
> > > > > > vinyl inside, smaller in tank capacity, lacking in
design,
> > > > >especially around
> > > > > > the windows and roughly $150,000 in overall quality, fit
and
> > > > >finish. We bit
> > > > > > the bullet and moved on to the LXi and we're very glad we
> >did.
> > > > > > LX owners asking 165K and up don't like to hear their
coach
> >is only
> > > > >little
> > > > > > more than "half" bird, but the truth hurts. NADA book
> >prices on
> > > > >the 2000 LX
> > > > > > are very harsh..upper 90's to 110's. LX owners have
every
> >right to
> > > > >feel
> > > > > > bitter, but as a buyer, I asked several dealers (who had
> >nothing to
> > > > >gain
> > > > > > from me) what they would offer. One said 95K, one said
110K
> >and
> > > > >the one
> > > > > > whole actually knew the actual coach said 150K was a
serious
> > > > >stretch. Not
> > > > > > only are LX owners unhappy, but WBPT and LXi owners are
mad,
> >too
> > > > >because
> > > > > > their own manufacturer made it harder for them to sell
their
> >high-
> > > > >dollar
> > > > > > coaches. And Blue Bird has done it again..most recently
> >wiith the
> > > > >M380
> > > > > > which was a disaster (Blue Bird rep's word). I can't
> >confirm it,
> > > > >but I
> > > > > > heard every one of them was recalled for various
problems,
> >mainly
> > > > >electrical
> > > > > > and wiring. They are not made any longer except by
special
> >order.
> > > > > > All that being said, there's nothing wrong with a
Cummins M-
> >11 or
> > > > >Allison
> > > > > > 4060, or Ultraleather or fiberglass, for that matter.
Just
> >make
> > > > >sure you
> > > > > > understand it's not the steel-bodied full-fledged
> >Wanderlodge most
> > > > >of us
> > > > > > think of. A poor man's Wanderlodge LX is probably still
a
> >lot
> > > > >better than
> > > > > > most coaches, new or used. If you want the best LX
> >currently on
> > > > >the market,
> > > > > > look at this coach. It's garaged in Michigan and
virtually
> > > > >pristine. Nice
> > > > > > people, too.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > http://www.rvtrader.com/rvdetail519280.htm
> > > > > >
> > > > > > BBarton in Dallas
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >From: "remiksjewelry"
> > > > > > >Reply-To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > > >To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > > >Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Thinking of joining the
birders!
> > > > > > >Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2007 22:33:14 -0000
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >Hello -
> > > > > > >Thanks for having this group! We currently have a
Safari
> >Trek and
> > > > >are
> > > > > > >looking into upgrading to a Bluebird. We found one we
> >like - it
> > > > >is a
> > > > > > >2000 LX Millenium edition. It is for sale in Maryland.
> >Does any
> > > > >know
> > > > > > >anything about this particular coach? The price seems
> >right, but
> > > > >we
> > > > > > >would have to travel quite a distance to see it for
> >ourselves.
> > > > >Also,
> > > > > > >would love to know about the ride and handling of a
bird.
> > > > > > >Is the M11 450 cummings a reliable engine?
> > > > > > >Any comments or advice will be greatly appreciated.
> > > > > > >Thanks!
> > > > > > >Damien
> > > > > > >
> > >
> >
> >
>

[Ralph L. Fullenwider]

Ah Hank no argument on that at all, the mid door like the SP's would be
great. But then BB would make a killing if they put out Baby Birds too. 450
HP in a 28 or 30 footer! Talk scoot and get it! Now there would be a
Bird to run at Maxton hey?

Safe travels,

Ralph and Charolette Fullenwider
'84 FC35 Duncan, Oklahoma
Ralph's RV Solutions

At 04:48 PM 3/14/2007 +0000, you wrote:
>--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph L. Fullenwider"
> wrote:
> >RALPH:
>I've had a few BIRDS.....This 1990SP36 is probably the BEST BIRD
>they ever made.....Mid door..all the trimmings etc. I call it my
>M380 without the problems....except I would like it to go over the
>mountains a little faster!
>If Bluebird would make some 2008 SP38's with a mid-door and a 450hp
>diesel engine they would sell a TON of them!!!
>That's my two cents from VEGAS and I am confident that my comments
>will get something started!!!
>LOL
>Hank Hannigan
>1990SP36 in Vegas just "lovin it!"
> >
> >
> > Interesting analogy with some truths but fiberglass bodies? no.
> >
> > Truth, the Wanderlodge II was a striped down model that what once
>was OE
> > became options. things like HWH jacks and many others.
> >
> > Starting in '88 with the advent of wide body, the front and rear
>caps were
> > fiberglass but the side and roof were steel.
> >
> > The BMC, true is not a Wanderlodge, however the sides and roof are
>steel,
> > though I think, not sure, that the compartment doors were fiber
>glass.
> >
> > The LX, fiberglass caps that started in '88 but sides and roof are
>steel,
> > as are the LXI.
> >
> > The M 380 was not fiberglass but a composite aluminium, 2 sheets
>of
> > aluminium with a composite center. The main problem with the 380
>was the
> > skin would grow and shrink with heat and cold, thus the sides
>would
> > wrinkle. Yes there were a few problems with the electrical but the
>lay out
> > of the panel was done right for a change. The main problem with
>the
> > electrical we the marriage between the slide and HWH jack system
>via the
> > micro p[rocesser. If the Coach was not level, the microprocessor
>would not
> > allow the slide to move, so the computer had to be reset, jacks
>retracted
> > and start the system again. There was also a problem of the slide
>locks
> > pulling, going down the road, this was usually caused by a mis
>adjusted
> > micro switch.
> >
> > The LX 450 got away form most of that and went to stainless steel
>and
> > introduced multiplexing of systems with a beefed up microprocessor.
> >
> > The myth of the LX model being fiberglass came from the mid year
>change in,
> > what? 2002 or 2003 where the skin was taken to the composite used
>on the M
> > 380 and was the test bed for the 380.
> >
> > There was nothing cheap about all of this, the R&D alone had to
>cost a
> > bundle because of the change, it is just too bad that the skin
>problems on
> > the 380 were not better thought out.
> >
> > Also with the 380 the signature of the Wanderlodge took it's major
>hit, the
> > "goat rails" were missing, and to my thinking, this was and is the
>largest
> > mistake BB could have made. Now they look like the Monaco's and
>various
> > other Manufacturers Coaches.
> >
> > No, the LX and LXI models are good stable units, though a bit too
>glitzy
> > inside for my taste. I don't go camping to clean mirrors on the
>ceilings.
> >
> >
> > Just my 2 cents
> >
> > Safe travels,
> >
> > Ralph and Charolette Fullenwider
> > 84FC35
> > Ralph's RV Solutions, Duncan, Oklahoma
> >
> > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "brad barton"
> > > ><bbartonwx@> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Damien,
> > > > > I'm new to the group, but a longtime Blue Bird fan. I think
>the
> > > >coach you
> > > > > are looking at is a black and silver coach with modern
>decor..and
> > > >it's at a
> > > > > truck dealer. We were considering an LX but cooled off. A
>retired
> > > >dealer
> > > > > with whom we did business twice (for our first 84-35FC and a
>1986
> > > >Newell
> > > > > Classic) nearly came unglued when I brought it up. He was a
> > > >longtime Blue
> > > > > Bird dealer in the 70s and 80s. I have since found out some
>things
> > > >about
> > > > > the LX. You're free to accept or reject all of this but I
>believe
> > > >it is
> > > > > true. Most of it came from a Blue Bird rep I spoke to just
>weeks
> > > >ago.
> > > > > Blue Bird has constantly searched for ways to a lower price
>point.
> > > >The
> > > > > WanderlodgeII was the first attempt..and pretty sad. Then as
> > > >Wanderlodges
> > > > > got more expensive, Blue Bird looked for a new approach.
>Their
> > > >engineers
> > > > > said it would take two years to come up with a less
>expensive 37-
> > > >40'
> > > > > chassis, so they bought Spartan chassis with Cummins M11
>engines.
> > > >They were
> > > > > known as a Blue Bird Motor Coach..or a BMC. The only thing
>Blue
> > > >Bird on it
> > > > > was the dash and the label. The BMC is NOT a Wanderlodge.
>Not
> > > >bad, just
> > > > > cheap. By the time those chassis ran out, the engineers had
>a new
> > > >40'
> > > > > platform. They kept the fiberglass body, put new caps on
>front and
> > > >rear,
> > > > > kept the Cummins engine but used their own superior Blue Bird
> > > >chassis with
> > > > > Ridewell air suspension. Of all the "cheep" Birds, the LX is
> > > >probably the
> > > > > best. But it's still fiberglass outside, virtually no
>chrome,
> > > >ultraleather
> > > > > vinyl inside, smaller in tank capacity, lacking in design,
> > > >especially around
> > > > > the windows and roughly $150,000 in overall quality, fit and
> > > >finish. We bit
> > > > > the bullet and moved on to the LXi and we're very glad we
>did.
> > > > > LX owners asking 165K and up don't like to hear their coach
>is only
> > > >little
> > > > > more than "half" bird, but the truth hurts. NADA book
>prices on
> > > >the 2000 LX
> > > > > are very harsh..upper 90's to 110's. LX owners have every
>right to
> > > >feel
> > > > > bitter, but as a buyer, I asked several dealers (who had
>nothing to
> > > >gain
> > > > > from me) what they would offer. One said 95K, one said 110K
>and
> > > >the one
> > > > > whole actually knew the actual coach said 150K was a serious
> > > >stretch. Not
> > > > > only are LX owners unhappy, but WBPT and LXi owners are mad,
>too
> > > >because
> > > > > their own manufacturer made it harder for them to sell their
>high-
> > > >dollar
> > > > > coaches. And Blue Bird has done it again..most recently
>wiith the
> > > >M380
> > > > > which was a disaster (Blue Bird rep's word). I can't
>confirm it,
> > > >but I
> > > > > heard every one of them was recalled for various problems,
>mainly
> > > >electrical
> > > > > and wiring. They are not made any longer except by special
>order.
> > > > > All that being said, there's nothing wrong with a Cummins M-
>11 or
> > > >Allison
> > > > > 4060, or Ultraleather or fiberglass, for that matter. Just
>make
> > > >sure you
> > > > > understand it's not the steel-bodied full-fledged
>Wanderlodge most
> > > >of us
> > > > > think of. A poor man's Wanderlodge LX is probably still a
>lot
> > > >better than
> > > > > most coaches, new or used. If you want the best LX
>currently on
> > > >the market,
> > > > > look at this coach. It's garaged in Michigan and virtually
> > > >pristine. Nice
> > > > > people, too.
> > > > >
> > > > > http://www.rvtrader.com/rvdetail519280.htm
> > > > >
> > > > > BBarton in Dallas
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >From: "remiksjewelry"
> > > > > >Reply-To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > >To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > >Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Thinking of joining the birders!
> > > > > >Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2007 22:33:14 -0000
> > > > > >
> > > > > >Hello -
> > > > > >Thanks for having this group! We currently have a Safari
>Trek and
> > > >are
> > > > > >looking into upgrading to a Bluebird. We found one we
>like - it
> > > >is a
> > > > > >2000 LX Millenium edition. It is for sale in Maryland.
>Does any
> > > >know
> > > > > >anything about this particular coach? The price seems
>right, but
> > > >we
> > > > > >would have to travel quite a distance to see it for
>ourselves.
> > > >Also,
> > > > > >would love to know about the ride and handling of a bird.
> > > > > >Is the M11 450 cummings a reliable engine?
> > > > > >Any comments or advice will be greatly appreciated.
> > > > > >Thanks!
> > > > > >Damien
> > > > > >
> >
>
>

[Ralph L. Fullenwider]

Brad:

Have you seen Baby Bird or been in it? I have and there is nothing of a
lesser quality about it.

I can think of several reasons for a smaller Bird for some people. Our
world is shrinking, I think that we can agree on that. The urban
communities homes are built closer together, remember the old days when a
20 foot easement between houses were the norm, now it is what? 5 feet?
There are many full timers out on the roads but there are more younger
families out there that are weekenders., or a week at Disney World and so
forth. Those are the ones that live in congested areas, more traffic lower
bridges and lower weight limits.

That is where the rigs like Rialto are making in roads to the present
market share. ( I am not schooled on marketing or case studies)

The word smaller is not hand in hand with less quality, roominess perhaps
but not quality. It was the innovations, quality, and now proven by time,
longevity, that put BB out ahead of all others and had them chasing to
catch up and many still are for that matter. Technology have leveled the
playing field somewhat. I like Newell's and Barth's, too bad the latter did
not have the funding or management that could see past the present dollar
signs and tried to envision a future dream as did BB.

Manufacturers have to plan for the rise of costs of the raw materials that
they need or use. Thank goodness BB has demanded and gotten a better
quality materials at lower costs and have not let quality suffer the
difference. Most important of all, are the quality of the people on the
"line" putting all the parts together. They are the ones who can make or
break a company when the bottom line is added up. You give the people on
the line respect, have training schools and a decent wage so Families do
not suffer and you get the quality because they care. That is why the
owners of BB's don't have to fight things like staples through wiring
behind walls that short out. As a for instance.

No, I am of the opinion that there is room for a smaller, updated Bird in
present day society. This of course is my opinion only and everyone has
one.

Safe travels,

Ralph and Charolette Fullenwider
'84 FC35 Duncan, Oklahoma
Ralph's RV Solutions

At 11:46 AM 3/14/2007 -0600, you wrote:
>Ralph and Hank,
>I agree. The SP36 was a real Bird. Many of us would like to have coaches
>under 40 or 43 feet for vacationing and party coaching. But who wants to
>buy a short Bird of lower quality? And as a former Newell owner, I can
>testify to the many advantages of a mid-entry coach; parking flexibility,
>less ground to cover when loading the coach, more frontal-crash strength and
>a co-pilot seat that's even with the driver and easier on the neck for
>conversation.
>Brad Barton
>
>
> >From: "Ralph L. Fullenwider"
> >Reply-To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> >To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> >Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] SP's and Baby Birds
> >Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2007 12:06:59 -0600
> >
> >Ah Hank no argument on that at all, the mid door like the SP's would be
> >great. But then BB would make a killing if they put out Baby Birds too. 450
> >HP in a 28 or 30 footer! Talk scoot and get it! Now there would be a
> >Bird to run at Maxton hey?
> >
> >Safe travels,
> >
> >Ralph and Charolette Fullenwider
> > '84 FC35 Duncan, Oklahoma
> >Ralph's RV Solutions
> >
> >At 04:48 PM 3/14/2007 +0000, you wrote:
> > >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph L. Fullenwider"
> > > wrote:
> > > >RALPH:
> > >I've had a few BIRDS.....This 1990SP36 is probably the BEST BIRD
> > >they ever made.....Mid door..all the trimmings etc. I call it my
> > >M380 without the problems....except I would like it to go over the
> > >mountains a little faster!
> > >If Bluebird would make some 2008 SP38's with a mid-door and a 450hp
> > >diesel engine they would sell a TON of them!!!
> > >That's my two cents from VEGAS and I am confident that my comments
> > >will get something started!!!
> > >LOL
> > >Hank Hannigan
> > >1990SP36 in Vegas just "lovin it!"
> > > >
>
>

[brad barton]

Ralph,
All good thoughts. You add a lot to our knowledge base.
I have been in M380s and LX's and even a WanderlodgeII.
It's easier to compare them side by side, but there are many quality
differences in those models. A Blue Bird rep pointed out some I didn't
realize; dealers pointed out others although they're glad to sell whatever
they have. Also, note how many M380s are already for sale with less than
20K miles.
The vinyl, upholstery, headliner and carpet on our 84 FC-35 were better than
anything we had in our home. We bought it in 1999 with 65,000 miles on it.
They all looked new when we bought it, and when we sold it, despite two kids
and a dog.
I suppose size and quality will always be linked.
Best wishes.
Brad Barton LXi


>From: "Ralph L. Fullenwider"
>Reply-To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
>To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: RE: [WanderlodgeForum] SP's and Baby Birds
>Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2007 13:58:44 -0600
>
>Brad:
>
>Have you seen Baby Bird or been in it? I have and there is nothing of a
>lesser quality about it.
>
>I can think of several reasons for a smaller Bird for some people. Our
>world is shrinking, I think that we can agree on that. The urban
>communities homes are built closer together, remember the old days when a
>20 foot easement between houses were the norm, now it is what? 5 feet?
>There are many full timers out on the roads but there are more younger
>families out there that are weekenders., or a week at Disney World and so
>forth. Those are the ones that live in congested areas, more traffic lower
>bridges and lower weight limits.
>
>That is where the rigs like Rialto are making in roads to the present
>market share. ( I am not schooled on marketing or case studies)
>
>The word smaller is not hand in hand with less quality, roominess perhaps
>but not quality. It was the innovations, quality, and now proven by time,
>longevity, that put BB out ahead of all others and had them chasing to
>catch up and many still are for that matter. Technology have leveled the
>playing field somewhat. I like Newell's and Barth's, too bad the latter did
>not have the funding or management that could see past the present dollar
>signs and tried to envision a future dream as did BB.
>
>Manufacturers have to plan for the rise of costs of the raw materials that
>they need or use. Thank goodness BB has demanded and gotten a better
>quality materials at lower costs and have not let quality suffer the
>difference. Most important of all, are the quality of the people on the
>"line" putting all the parts together. They are the ones who can make or
>break a company when the bottom line is added up. You give the people on
>the line respect, have training schools and a decent wage so Families do
>not suffer and you get the quality because they care. That is why the
>owners of BB's don't have to fight things like staples through wiring
>behind walls that short out. As a for instance.
>
>No, I am of the opinion that there is room for a smaller, updated Bird in
>present day society. This of course is my opinion only and everyone has
>one.
>
>Safe travels,
>
>Ralph and Charolette Fullenwider
> '84 FC35 Duncan, Oklahoma
>Ralph's RV Solutions
>
>At 11:46 AM 3/14/2007 -0600, you wrote:
> >Ralph and Hank,
> >I agree. The SP36 was a real Bird. Many of us would like to have
>coaches
> >under 40 or 43 feet for vacationing and party coaching. But who wants to
> >buy a short Bird of lower quality? And as a former Newell owner, I can
> >testify to the many advantages of a mid-entry coach; parking flexibility,
> >less ground to cover when loading the coach, more frontal-crash strength
>and
> >a co-pilot seat that's even with the driver and easier on the neck for
> >conversation.
> >Brad Barton
> >
> >
> > >From: "Ralph L. Fullenwider"
> > >Reply-To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > >To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > >Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] SP's and Baby Birds
> > >Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2007 12:06:59 -0600
> > >
> > >Ah Hank no argument on that at all, the mid door like the SP's would be
> > >great. But then BB would make a killing if they put out Baby Birds too.
>450
> > >HP in a 28 or 30 footer! Talk scoot and get it! Now there would
>be a
> > >Bird to run at Maxton hey?
> > >
> > >Safe travels,
> > >
> > >Ralph and Charolette Fullenwider
> > > '84 FC35 Duncan, Oklahoma
> > >Ralph's RV Solutions
> > >
> > >At 04:48 PM 3/14/2007 +0000, you wrote:
> > > >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph L. Fullenwider"
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >RALPH:
> > > >I've had a few BIRDS.....This 1990SP36 is probably the BEST BIRD
> > > >they ever made.....Mid door..all the trimmings etc. I call it my
> > > >M380 without the problems....except I would like it to go over the
> > > >mountains a little faster!
> > > >If Bluebird would make some 2008 SP38's with a mid-door and a 450hp
> > > >diesel engine they would sell a TON of them!!!
> > > >That's my two cents from VEGAS and I am confident that my comments
> > > >will get something started!!!
> > > >LOL
> > > >Hank Hannigan
> > > >1990SP36 in Vegas just "lovin it!"
> > > > >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>

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