CA Bus Smoking Issue

[Joyce and Richard Hayden]

Greg or any California forum member,

I have a question for you. Every two years, we in some areas of Washington State,are required to pass the "Emission Check Program".It tests factory-installed emission control systems on gasoline and diesel vehicles 5-25 years old, and will identify vehicles whose systems are not working properly. If your vehicle does not pass the test you can not renew it's license unless you get the problem fixed. If your vehicle passes the test you will receive a certificate stating that it does and all is good.

I'm a bit concerned about driving in California sincemy bus does smoke some when accelerating and I know that California is cracking down on that. Not anymore thanmost all big dieselrigs but it does smoke.So here's my question: Do you know if the state of California will except another states current emission certificate when it comes to the smoking problem that these busses typically have, especially just after starting to move away from a stop light?

Regards,

Dick Hayden

'87 PT 38 - Lake Stevens, WA

[Don Bradner]

I do not think that California will accept another state's certificate in these
matters, but so far private diesel RVs are exempt from the newer stringent
rules.

On 10/26/2009 at 9:14 AM Joyce and Richard Hayden wrote:

>Greg or any California forum member,
>
>I have a question for you. Every two years, we in some areas of
>Washington State, are required to pass the "Emission Check Program". It
>tests factory-installed emission control systems on gasoline and diesel
>vehicles 5-25 years old, and will identify vehicles whose systems are not
>working properly. If your vehicle does not pass the test you can not
>renew it's license unless you get the problem fixed. If your vehicle
>passes the test you will receive a certificate stating that it does and
>all is good.
>
>I'm a bit concerned about driving in California since my bus does smoke
>some when accelerating and I know that California is cracking down on
>that. Not any more than most all big diesel rigs but it does smoke. So
>here's my question: Do you know if the state of California will except
>another states current emission certificate when it comes to the smoking
>problem that these busses typically have, especially just after starting
>to move away from a stop light?
>
>Regards,
>
>Dick Hayden
>'87 PT 38 - Lake Stevens, WA

[Joyce and Richard Hayden]

Thanx Don. Why am I not surprised that

CAwill not accept another states cert. Oh Well.

Dick Hayden - '87 PT 38 - Lake Stevens, WA - about to be on-the-road SOUTH in day or so

----- Original Message -----

From: "bluethunder@arcatapet.com"

To: "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com"

Sent: Monday, October 26, 2009 9:24 AM

Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] CA Bus Smoking Issue

I do not think that California will accept another state's certificate in these matters, but so far private diesel RVs are exempt from the newer stringent rules.

On 10/26/2009 at 9:14 AM Joyce and Richard Hayden wrote:

>Greg or any California forum member,
>
>I have a question for you. Every two years, we in some areas of
>Washington State, are required to pass the "Emission Check Program". It
>tests factory-installed emission control systems on gasoline and diesel
>vehicles 5-25 years old, and will identify vehicles whose systems are not
>working properly. If your vehicle does not pass the test you can not
>renew it's license unless you get the problem fixed. If your vehicle
>passes the test you will receive a certificate stating that it does and
>all is good.
>
>I'm a bit concerned about driving in California since my bus does smoke
>some when accelerating and I know that California is cracking down on
>that. Not any more than most all big diesel rigs but it does smoke. So
>here's my question: Do you know if the state of California will except
>another states current emission certificate when it comes to the smoking
>problem that these busses typically have, especially just after starting
>to move away from a stop light?
>
>Regards,
>
>Dick Hayden
>'87 PT 38 - Lake Stevens, WA

[Ernie Ekberg]

Dick, to stop the smoke, I let the turbo spool up a bit before hard acceleration. Ernie Ekberg 83PT40 Wanderlodge Weatherford, Tx 817-475-3991 http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/erni...gandrepair --- On Mon, 10/26/09, Joyce and Richard Hayden wrote: From: Joyce and Richard Hayden Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] CA Bus Smoking Issue To: "WanderlodgeForum" Date: Monday, October 26, 2009, 11:14 AM Greg or any California forum member, I have a question for you. Every two years, we in some areas of Washington State,are required to pass the "Emission Check Program".It tests factory-installed emission control systems on gasoline and diesel vehicles 5-25 years old, and will identify vehicles whose systems are not working properly. If your vehicle does not pass the test you can not renew it's license unless you get the problem fixed. If your vehicle passes the test you will receive a certificate stating that it does and all is good. I'm a bit concerned about driving in California sincemy bus does smoke some when accelerating and I know that California is cracking down on that. Not anymore thanmost all big dieselrigs but it does smoke.So here's my question: Do you know if the state of California will except another states current emission certificate when it comes to the smoking problem that these busses typically have, especially just after starting to move away from a stop light? Regards, Dick Hayden '87 PT 38 - Lake Stevens, WA

[freewill2008]

Dick - From talking with Greg (he will likely join this discussion), the issue
is not whether you are certified but whether you smoke. No vehicle is supposed
to smoke on Cal. roads, and even if you have a "certified" vehicle you can still
get busted for blowing smoke.

On the FC, I can see the exhaust in the mirror. If it smokes, I get outa the
pedal. Black smoke is just unburned fuel, the result of the right foot asking
for power the engine couldn't make. The smoke always quits if I stop asking for
power that isn't available; worst case I might hafta gear down. In any case,
black smoke is extra money blowing out the exhaust.

Some good DD info here: http://www.tejascoach.com/tejasoil.html Scroll down to
"Tips for Driving the 2 Stroke Detroit Diesel Engine".

Bob Griesel '84 FC31 WLII WA


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Joyce and Richard Hayden"
wrote:
>
> Thanx Don. Why am I not surprised that
> CA will not accept another states cert. Oh Well.
>
> Dick Hayden - '87 PT 38 - Lake Stevens, WA - about to be on-the-road SOUTH in
day or so
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Don Bradner
> To:
WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Monday, October 26, 2009 9:24 AM
> Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] CA Bus Smoking Issue
>
>
> I do not think that California will accept another state's certificate in
these matters, but so far private diesel RVs are exempt from the newer stringent
rules.
>
> On 10/26/2009 at 9:14 AM Joyce and Richard Hayden wrote:
>
> >Greg or any California forum member,
> >
> >I have a question for you. Every two years, we in some areas of
> >Washington State, are required to pass the "Emission Check Program". It
> >tests factory-installed emission control systems on gasoline and diesel
> >vehicles 5-25 years old, and will identify vehicles whose systems are not
> >working properly. If your vehicle does not pass the test you can not
> >renew it's license unless you get the problem fixed. If your vehicle
> >passes the test you will receive a certificate stating that it does and
> >all is good.
> >
> >I'm a bit concerned about driving in California since my bus does smoke
> >some when accelerating and I know that California is cracking down on
> >that. Not any more than most all big diesel rigs but it does smoke. So
> >here's my question: Do you know if the state of California will except
> >another states current emission certificate when it comes to the smoking
> >problem that these busses typically have, especially just after starting
> >to move away from a stop light?
> >
> >Regards,
> >
> >Dick Hayden
> >'87 PT 38 - Lake Stevens, WA
>

[Pete Masterson]

To the best of my knowledge, California is not spending any effort on private-owned RVs. Indeed, when I registered/renewed my coach, the smog status is "diesel-exempt" ... no test or certificate is required. Commercial operators of trucks and busses, however, are required to retrofit many vehicles and are subject to being pulled over by the highway patrol if the exhaust doesn't "look right."

Now, my 16 year old toad is considered a potential "gross polluter," so not only is a test required before renewal (every other year), it must be given at a special "test only" service using computerized equipment that makes evasion of the system difficult. So far, my old Toyota Camry has passed each test with flying colors... so it's a gross polluter in name only. (Although it looks pretty gross after a thousand miles in tow behind the coach.)

Pete Masterson

(former) '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42

El Sobrante CA

"aeonix1@mac.com"

On Oct 26, 2009, at 9:24 AM, Don Bradner wrote:

I do not think that California will accept another state's certificate in these matters, but so far private diesel RVs are exempt from the newer stringent rules.

On 10/26/2009 at 9:14 AM Joyce and Richard Hayden wrote:

Greg or any California forum member,

I have a question for you. Every two years, we in some areas of

Washington State, are required to pass the "Emission Check Program". It

tests factory-installed emission control systems on gasoline and diesel

vehicles 5-25 years old, and will identify vehicles whose systems are not

working properly. If your vehicle does not pass the test you can not

renew it's license unless you get the problem fixed. If your vehicle

passes the test you will receive a certificate stating that it does and

all is good.

I'm a bit concerned about driving in California since my bus does smoke

some when accelerating and I know that California is cracking down on

that. Not any more than most all big diesel rigs but it does smoke. So

here's my question: Do you know if the state of California will except

another states current emission certificate when it comes to the smoking

problem that these busses typically have, especially just after starting

to move away from a stop light?

Regards,

Dick Hayden

'87 PT 38 - Lake Stevens, WA

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[gregory O]

Hi Dick, so far rv registered for personal use are exempt from having proof of
yearly opacity testing and certification but every on road vehicle in state or
out must be compliant to the standards of the test.

Last year I started a service company where my operators perform required
testing and maintain records for the California Air Resources Board compliancy
"Fleet Compliance". MarioP of this forum has been a great help advising me with
the venture.

as far as rv's tested We have tested most of the rv's older than 2005 used by
the motorcross teams and fleet owners who hold their rv's as company property
with their fleet. we tested probably 30 rv's to get smoke tickets reduced from
$800. to $300. 20 or so of the rv's tested were in response to a notice sent to
owners via mail. they were spotted making smoke on the freeway and reported to
CARB by another motorist. I believe the mail notices are not charged anything if
they send in a passed test certification??


dial *SMOG on a cell phone and give the operator a plate number of a smoking
vehicle and a fix-it ticket is sent to the owner. the owner is then required to
pass an opacity test. in your case (1990 or older) you are allowed 55% opacity.

% Opacity is: that percentage of light blocked by particles in the exhaust
smoke. so 55% Opacity will allow only 45% of light to pass from the test light
bulb to the light bulb brightness meter on the other side of the column of
exhaust smoke.

here is a handout with a opacity chart
http://www.arb.ca.gov/enf/hdvip/pamphl1.pdf

we have test equipment that takes a continual reading of the exhaust smoke's
opacity while the test operator makes full throttle accelerations. this is
called SNAP tests. From a rest-idle to immediate full throttle acceleration (to
the mechanical limits of the pedal for 5 seconds at full open) three snaps are
performed with-in a limited period.

the electronic engines may not be built any better but the electronic sensors
limit the amount of fuel dumped to the fire to that amount of fuel the fire can
burn with the given oxygen at that moment.

electronic engines I hind on average to be 25% less opaque.

so for an answer to your question:

Dicks question
<<< Do you know if the state of California will except another states current
emission certificate when it comes to the smoking problem that these busses
typically have>>>>>

Gregs answer
it is not necessary to show an officer a cert nor does it do any good. even in
California if a truck is stopped for smoke, showing the officer a California
PSIP opacity cert offers no relief to the ticket and fix-it re certification
required. Yearly smoke certifcation (PSIP) and smoking vehicles (HDVIP)are two
different programs.
Greg
94ptca




--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Joyce and Richard Hayden"
wrote:
>
> Greg or any California forum member,
>
> I have a question for you. Every two years, we in some areas of Washington
State, are required to pass the "Emission Check Program". It tests
factory-installed emission control systems on gasoline and diesel vehicles 5-25
years old, and will identify vehicles whose systems are not working properly.
If your vehicle does not pass the test you can not renew it's license unless you
get the problem fixed. If your vehicle passes the test you will receive a
certificate stating that it does and all is good.
>
> I'm a bit concerned about driving in California since my bus does smoke some
when accelerating and I know that California is cracking down on that. Not any
more than most all big diesel rigs but it does smoke. So here's my question:
Do you know if the state of California will except another states current
emission certificate when it comes to the smoking problem that these busses
typically have, especially just after starting to move away from a stop light?
>
> Regards,
>
> Dick Hayden
> '87 PT 38 - Lake Stevens, WA
>