Keeping Warm

[martingregg598]

Do 95-97 wanderlodges with A/H stay warmer while driving down the road
with the ambient temp below 25 deg. than 93 or 94's with Primis. Do the
93-94's run engine coolant throughout the hydronic house system? In my
95 BMC 37 I have to run the A/H (consuming $ 3.00 plus a gallon diesel)
and the dash heat to keep it in the 60's when it's 20 deg or less and I
am driving down the highway.
Marty Gregg
95 BMC 37
Kennewick WA.

[Mike Hohnstein]

I suppose you could install some roof mount solar heat exchangers to help out the A/H.

MH

----- Original Message -----

From: "martingregg598@msn.com"

To: "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com"

Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 10:25 AM

Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Keeping Warm

Do 95-97 wanderlodges with A/H stay warmer while driving down the road
with the ambient temp below 25 deg. than 93 or 94's with Primis. Do the
93-94's run engine coolant throughout the hydronic house system? In my
95 BMC 37 I have to run the A/H (consuming $ 3.00 plus a gallon diesel)
and the dash heat to keep it in the 60's when it's 20 deg or less and I
am driving down the highway.
Marty Gregg
95 BMC 37
Kennewick WA.

[Pete Masterson]

When on the road, the A/H is supposed to get its heat from the engine cooling water. In most cases, the burner doesn't (shouldn't) be operating.

My coach doesn't put out an impressive amount of heat through the chassis system -- the under-dash radiator seems smallish, and the 40' hose/pipe run (with not-very-large hose) from the engine has some heat loss as well. It only seems adequate down to about 30-40 degrees ambient temperature while going over the road.

When the A/H system is activated, the number of radiators actively supplying heat can overcome the heat-loss through the coach body. The heat is transferred from the engine cooling system (with some efficiency losses) but with 180 degree water passing through the heat-transfer coils of the A/H, it is usually adequate to supply interior heat without the burner running. 

You can ensure that the burner doesn't come on by switching off the "hydronic heat" switch on the dashboard. (This may be the key piece of information you need.) This switch doesn't seem to stop the pumps from operating.

However, even if the burner is operating in very cold conditions, it really doesn't use all that much fuel. It's rated at about 1/4 gallon per hour of operation -- but the burner actually may only operate 20 or 30 minutes of every hour, so that's less than a pint per hour. (When parked, I've had the A/H on for days... and I couldn't tell, from the MPG figures I track, that any significant amount of fuel had been used. The generator is -much- more noticeable.

If the over-the-road heat isn't sufficient (in really cold conditions), then start your generator and run some of the electric heat, too. That will use extra diesel for sure, but the alternative of freezing to death is better avoided.

Be sure you've checked the seals and caulking around vents, etc. in your coach. You might also be losing heat through the AC units (they're far from perfectly sealed). You may be able to cover the AC openings with foam, somehow. (I haven't done this-- at least not yet.) It's not so much the amount of heat coming in being inadequate, but the amount of heat being lost. If you travel in cold weather frequently, you may want to figure out how to better seal or insulate the vents and windows. (Some newer RVs have dual pane glass -- but that's a pretty expensive upgrade.)

I note, too, that my basement compartment door weather stripping was quite worn. (I noticed an intrusion of exhaust soot past the adjacent compartment door when I was having a problem with my generator.) I replaced the weather seal on all the compartment doors. Keeping the cold air out (as much as possible) benefits keeping the coach interior warm. The many holes between the interior and the basement _should_ be well sealed, but even so, heat is lost through the floor to the colder basement below.

Note: I've driven in temperatures as low as 17 degrees, as recently as last December in Colorado, NM, and AZ.

Since I only have a '95 and haven't driven/ridden in an earlier 'bird with the Primus, I can't say if it's more or less efficient.

Pete Masterson

'95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42

El Sobrante CA

"aeonix1@mac.com"

On Feb 19, 2008, at 8:25 AM, martingregg598 wrote:

Do 95-97 wanderlodges with A/H stay warmer while driving down the road 

with the ambient temp below 25 deg. than 93 or 94's with Primis. Do the 

93-94's run engine coolant throughout the hydronic house system? In my 

95 BMC 37 I have to run the A/H (consuming $ 3.00 plus a gallon diesel) 

and the dash heat to keep it in the 60's when it's 20 deg or less and I 

am driving down the highway. 

Marty Gregg

95 BMC 37

Kennewick WA.

[Fred Hulse]

Marty

As you already know,we aren't exposed to those temps,but the Aqua-Hot gets heat from the engine coolant loop when traveling,so you just set your thermostats to a comfortable number and cruise down the road and the engine loop will heat up the Aqua Hot coach zones.

I think some of the coolest temps we have been traveling in is the low 30s.

My SP36 with Primus was also comfortable at those temps when driving.

Fred & Jeanne Hulse
Morristown Arizona
1997 Wanderlodge WLWB41

[Gregory OConnor]

the two systems are independent???

Make sure your fan override is not on. If on, the main radiator
would then be the big heat sink in place of inhouse rad's. If your
engine running makes hot water in the waterheater, it may just be a
switch or valve (winter/summer) that keeps the inhouse rad loop out
of the hot water loop for summer camping????

If your AH will heat the engine, then you have the ability to heat
the interior via the engine only by finding the valve that ties
in????


GregoryO'Connor
94ptRomolandCa

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "martingregg598"
wrote:
>
> Do 95-97 wanderlodges with A/H stay warmer while driving down the
road
> with the ambient temp below 25 deg. than 93 or 94's with Primis.
Do the
> 93-94's run engine coolant throughout the hydronic house system?
In my
> 95 BMC 37 I have to run the A/H (consuming $ 3.00 plus a gallon
diesel)
> and the dash heat to keep it in the 60's when it's 20 deg or less
and I
> am driving down the highway.
> Marty Gregg
> 95 BMC 37
> Kennewick WA.
>

[Pete Masterson]

The A/H on the '95 has no valves to fuss with. It's "on" all the time. Engine heat supplies both domestic hot water and heating water. When the thermostat is 'off' then no heat comes inside the coach. No summer/winter valves or any of that stuff.

Good point about the fan override! Indeed, make sure fan override is off.

Pete Masterson

'95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42

El Sobrante CA

"aeonix1@mac.com"

On Feb 19, 2008, at 12:24 PM, Gregory OConnor wrote:

the two systems are independent???  

Make sure your fan override is not on. If on, the main radiator 

would then be the big heat sink in place of inhouse rad's. If your 

engine running makes hot water in the waterheater, it may just be a 

switch or valve (winter/summer) that keeps the inhouse rad loop out 

of the hot water loop for summer camping????  

If your AH will heat the engine, then you have the ability to heat 

the interior via the engine only by finding the valve that ties 

in????

<snip>

[martingregg598]

Hi Fred. On my coach when it is 20 deg and I am driving down the
highway running the bay heat and the living room zone it is not long
till the air is just lukewarm. It is as if the engine isn't putting
heat in as fast as it is coming out.
Marty Gregg
95 BMC 37
Kennewick WA

[martingregg598]

Hi Pete, thanks for the reply, I do get a good amount of heat out of
the dash system but it can't keep the whole coach warm. On a BMC with
the Cummins there is no fan override. I am hoping that a few of the
folks with the Primus system will chime in on how there systems work.
Marty Gregg
95 BMC 37
Kennewick WA

[ronmarabito2002]

The Primus will handle cool temperatures off the heat exchanger, but I
doubt it will give you what you need at 25 degrees. I've run the
system this way on one full day of one trip. I was disappointed with
the results.

R.E. (Ron) Marabito, Dallas, TX 92WB40

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "martingregg598"
wrote:
>
> Hi Pete, thanks for the reply, I do get a good amount of heat out of
> the dash system but it can't keep the whole coach warm. On a BMC with
> the Cummins there is no fan override. I am hoping that a few of the
> folks with the Primus system will chime in on how there systems work.
> Marty Gregg
> 95 BMC 37
> Kennewick WA
>

[Pete Masterson]

Sounds like you're in need of a troubleshooting check of the A/H system. Similar circumstances, my system provides a comfortable 60-65 (where I keep the thermostat) while traveling over the road. I don't usually turn on the A/H thermostats in the bath or bedroom (where it does get a bit chilly when the temps outside or below 30).

Make sure the fan override is off. Check your engine heat thermometer-- is the engine up to full operating temperature? If it is, and you're not getting sufficient heat without the A/H burner running, then there's some sort of problem between the engine cooling loop and the A/H system. Perhaps an earlier owner made a modification and disconnected the engine coolant loop to the A/H.

Pete Masterson

'95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42

El Sobrante CA

"aeonix1@mac.com"

On Feb 19, 2008, at 7:48 PM, martingregg598 wrote:

Hi Fred. On my coach when it is 20 deg and I am driving down the 

highway running the bay heat and the living room zone it is not long 

till the air is just lukewarm. It is as if the engine isn't putting 

heat in as fast as it is coming out. 

Marty Gregg

95 BMC 37

Kennewick WA