Home again

[gpaulcarver]

First we'd like to thank all who responded to our distress and
especially Liz who posted our predicament when we couldn't. Leaving all
to chance, we departed the last Lone Star Bird rally in balmy Texas to
venture north to Colorado to relocate an aging Aunt to a nursing
facility. That said, the "chance" portion was more than expected in
late Oct. Our intended stay was 3-5 days (just before the unscheduled
weather) and got extended to 14 days to accomplish all that needed done.
Well the weather added some of those days to correct problems created by
15 degree temps. at night and 2 feet of snow making corrections
difficult in windy Royal Gourge. First our Primus system wasn't working
properly so basement heat was not on. Subsequently our water pumps
froze and cracked and the parks water system was turned off for the
season. Next a heavy snow took out the common on our 50 amp electric
circut. This caused a chain of events to include frying our shorepower
transfer switch, the microwave, a TV, one charger, a circut on the
inverter, and two GFI's. We were ill prepared to address many of the
issues in the weather and limited tooling let alone no supply source.
Luckily the zap spared our refrigerator and the other half of the
transfer switch. So our generator saved the remaining days and provided
heat till we could drive up to Colorado Springs to a great shop that
corrected most of our problems. We'll post later on that shops name and
address. Needless to say we're glad to be home and express again our
appreciation for the support offered from this group.

Paul & Jo Carver

'93 pt40 "Teri" Seven Points TX.

[Ernie Ekberg]

Wow, you guys had a time. Glad you are home. Ernie- Mojave Valley, Az Ernie Ekberg 83PT40 Wanderlodge Weatherford, Tx 817-475-3991 http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/erni...gandrepair --- On Sat, 11/14/09, gpaulcarver wrote: From: gpaulcarver Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Home again To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, November 14, 2009, 12:12 AM First we'd like to thank all who responded to our distress and especially Liz who posted our predicament when we couldn't. Leaving all to chance, we departed the last Lone Star Bird rally in balmy Texas to venture north to Colorado to relocate an aging Aunt to a nursing facility. That said, the "chance" portion was more than expected in late Oct. Our intended stay was 3-5 days (just before the unscheduled weather) and got extended to 14 days to accomplish all that needed done. Well the weather added some of those days to correct problems created by 15 degree temps. at night and 2 feet of snow making corrections difficult in windy Royal Gourge. First our Primus system wasn't working properly so basement heat was not on. Subsequently our water pumps froze and cracked and the parks water system was turned off for the season. Next a heavy snow took out the common on our 50 amp electric circut. This caused a chain of events to include frying our shorepower transfer switch, the microwave, a TV, one charger, a circut on the inverter, and two GFI's. We were ill prepared to address many of the issues in the weather and limited tooling let alone no supply source. Luckily the zap spared our refrigerator and the other half of the transfer switch. So our generator saved the remaining days and provided heat till we could drive up to Colorado Springs to a great shop that corrected most of our problems. We'll post later on that shops name and address. Needless to say we're glad to be home and express again our appreciation for the support offered from this group. Paul & Jo Carver '93 pt40 "Teri" Seven Points TX.

[Ralph Fullenwider]

So glad to hear your home safe and sound.

Safe travels,

Ralph & Charolette Fullenwider
'84 FC 35 "Ruff Diamond"
Duncan, Oklahoma

At 06:12 AM 11/14/2009 +0000, you wrote:

>First we'd like to thank all who responded to our distress and
>especially Liz who posted our predicament when we couldn't. Leaving all
>to chance, we departed the last Lone Star Bird rally in balmy Texas to
>venture north to Colorado to relocate an aging Aunt to a nursing
>facility. That said, the "chance" portion was more than expected in
>late Oct. Our intended stay was 3-5 days (just before the unscheduled
>weather) and got extended to 14 days to accomplish all that needed done.
>Well the weather added some of those days to correct problems created by
>15 degree temps. at night and 2 feet of snow making corrections
>difficult in windy Royal Gourge. First our Primus system wasn't working
>properly so basement heat was not on. Subsequently our water pumps
>froze and cracked and the parks water system was turned off for the
>season. Next a heavy snow took out the common on our 50 amp electric
>circut. This caused a chain of events to include frying our shorepower
>transfer switch, the microwave, a TV, one charger, a circut on the
>inverter, and two GFI's. We were ill prepared to address many of the
>issues in the weather and limited tooling let alone no supply source.
>Luckily the zap spared our refrigerator and the other half of the
>transfer switch. So our generator saved the remaining days and provided
>heat till we could drive up to Colorado Springs to a great shop that
>corrected most of our problems. We'll post later on that shops name and
>address. Needless to say we're glad to be home and express again our
>appreciation for the support offered from this group.
>
>Paul & Jo Carver
>
>'93 pt40 "Teri" Seven Points TX.
>
>

[Rick Davis]

Wow, glad your back Paul and Jo to warmer climes.

After that story, I'm now sorry I bitched about a little "cool" early AM interior coach tempswhile we were in Iowa and WI due to our Primus not working.

Rick and Marilyn Davis

1993 "freeNeasy"

Loudon, TN

(in warmer Jonesboro, AR this morning)

---

From: gpaulcarver
To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sat, November 14, 2009 1:12:50 AM
Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Home again

First we'd like to thank all who responded to our distress and
especially Liz who posted our predicament when we couldn't. Leaving all
to chance, we departed the last Lone Star Bird rally in balmy Texas to
venture north to Colorado to relocate an aging Aunt to a nursing
facility. That said, the "chance" portion was more than expected in
late Oct. Our intended stay was 3-5 days (just before the unscheduled
weather) and got extended to 14 days to accomplish all that needed done.
Well the weather added some of those days to correct problems created by
15 degree temps. at night and 2 feet of snow making corrections
difficult in windy Royal Gourge. First our Primus system wasn't working
properly so basement heat was not on. Subsequently our water pumps
froze and cracked and the parks water system was turned off for the
season. Next a heavy snow took out the common on our 50 amp electric
circut. This caused a chain
of events to include frying our shorepower
transfer switch, the microwave, a TV, one charger, a circut on the
inverter, and two GFI's. We were ill prepared to address many of the
issues in the weather and limited tooling let alone no supply source.
Luckily the zap spared our refrigerator and the other half of the
transfer switch. So our generator saved the remaining days and provided
heat till we could drive up to Colorado Springs to a great shop that
corrected most of our problems. We'll post later on that shops name and
address. Needless to say we're glad to be home and express again our
appreciation for the support offered from this group.

Paul & Jo Carver

'93 pt40 "Teri" Seven Points TX.

[Fred Hulse]



Paul & Jo

I have been following your experience with interest and am grateful you got away to your warm home base.

While I am writing this,I thought I would ask if you folks previously owned a silver & blue SP36 before your 93 PT40?

Fred & Jeanne Hulse
Morristown Arizona
1997 Wanderlodge WLWB41

[gregory O]

the condition is called lost neutral or open neutral. to call it a common would
imply dc current. I believe???the transfer switch removes the neutral along
with the two hot lines otherwise the shorepower neutral which is earth ground
will ground out all the genset ac current???. if the transfer switch was the
problem that caused the other resulting issues, replacing the resulting issues
and the causing problem (transfer switch) will keep it from happening again. it
may well be that the neutral was lost some other place like in your shore cord
or in the campground pedistal and the issue is doomed to repeat its self again.

I can not understand how the ac current transfers voltage to the other leg when
the neutral is lost but I realize that electrical code properly followed will
prevent the damage.
Here is a rv related lost neutral article
http://www.myrv.us/electric/Pg/open_neutral.htm

One of the gals in our rv club had a recent lost neutral when her plug fell out
of the reseptical on an angle. the ground and center two hot prongs stayed
connected. I can also see where carbon stained prongs on the plug can cause a
lost neutral. I now always make the effort to shut down the breaker prior to
connecting and use duct tape or a copper wire tie (10 ga single strand
irrigation wire)to keep the pedistal connection inplace

Greg 94ptca

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "gpaulcarver" wrote:
>
>
> First we'd like to thank all who responded to our distress and
> especially Liz who posted our predicament when we couldn't. Leaving all
> to chance, we departed the last Lone Star Bird rally in balmy Texas to
> venture north to Colorado to relocate an aging Aunt to a nursing
> facility. That said, the "chance" portion was more than expected in
> late Oct. Our intended stay was 3-5 days (just before the unscheduled
> weather) and got extended to 14 days to accomplish all that needed done.
> Well the weather added some of those days to correct problems created by
> 15 degree temps. at night and 2 feet of snow making corrections
> difficult in windy Royal Gourge. First our Primus system wasn't working
> properly so basement heat was not on. Subsequently our water pumps
> froze and cracked and the parks water system was turned off for the
> season. Next a heavy snow took out the common on our 50 amp electric
> circut. This caused a chain of events to include frying our shorepower
> transfer switch, the microwave, a TV, one charger, a circut on the
> inverter, and two GFI's. We were ill prepared to address many of the
> issues in the weather and limited tooling let alone no supply source.
> Luckily the zap spared our refrigerator and the other half of the
> transfer switch. So our generator saved the remaining days and provided
> heat till we could drive up to Colorado Springs to a great shop that
> corrected most of our problems. We'll post later on that shops name and
> address. Needless to say we're glad to be home and express again our
> appreciation for the support offered from this group.
>
> Paul & Jo Carver
>
> '93 pt40 "Teri" Seven Points TX.
>

[gpaulcarver]

Fred & Jeanne

Ineed we did own that described '91 SP36 and are aware of it being sold
by Holland to someone in AZ. Was that you, or do you know of it's
disposition today? We learned a lot about Birds from the experiences of
owning that one and enjoyed most of them. Without getting too verbose
I'll leave the history brief, but I'll bet it's the only SP with a
stainless steel fresh water tank. Since our departure to the present
40' we've learned a lot more and relocated "home base" from So. Cal. to
Texas where the Pteradactyl is garaged outside of travels. Thanks for
your expressed interest in our experiences.

Paul & Jo Carver

'93 PT40 "Teri" in Seven Points, TX.


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Fred Hulse"
wrote:
>
> Paul & Jo
> I have been following your experience with interest and am grateful
you got away to your warm home base.
>
> While I am writing this,I thought I would ask if you folks previously
owned a silver & blue SP36 before your 93 PT40?
>
> Fred & Jeanne Hulse
> Morristown Arizona
> 1997 Wanderlodge WLWB41
>

[gpaulcarver]

Greg
I was just repeating what I was told from the diagnosing technition in the use
of "common" as there is also an "earth ground" as the forth connector on the
plug. No problems with the plug or continuity of the coach's cord and the
transfer switch has been replaced as no parts were available for the old one. I
did save the old one as the gen.'s side was still good. They are interchangable
but very difficult to get to on our bus. Anyone needing parts for the old
transfer switch are welcome to what I have and aside from shipping I'll bet it
could save 4-5 hundred dollars as well as some grief of wire lengths to fit the
replacement (larger box)
I suspect relay failures may be rare and others may not have an after-market
compressor installed in front of the transfer switch & junction box. Ours works
fine now as we've been hooked up to at least four other sources since the
repair/replacement and everything we've replaced works as expected. All that's
left to buy are a couple of TV's which were slated for updating any way. Jo
also likes the new convection/microwave better than the old one which is
obsolete for support parts. (GE vs. Sharp)
I'd hate to think of what it cost to build your shoe if all the man hours had to
be purchased in a remote place. $$$$$$$$$$$$$
Paul & Jo
'93 PT 40 "Teri" in Seven Points, TX.

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "gregory O" wrote:
>
>
> the condition is called lost neutral or open neutral. to call it a common
would imply dc current. I believe???the transfer switch removes the neutral
along with the two hot lines otherwise the shorepower neutral which is earth
ground will ground out all the genset ac current???. if the transfer switch was
the problem that caused the other resulting issues, replacing the resulting
issues and the causing problem (transfer switch) will keep it from happening
again. it may well be that the neutral was lost some other place like in your
shore cord or in the campground pedistal and the issue is doomed to repeat its
self again.
>
> I can not understand how the ac current transfers voltage to the other leg
when the neutral is lost but I realize that electrical code properly followed
will prevent the damage.
> Here is a rv related lost neutral article
> http://www.myrv.us/electric/Pg/open_neutral.htm
>
> One of the gals in our rv club had a recent lost neutral when her plug fell
out of the reseptical on an angle. the ground and center two hot prongs stayed
connected. I can also see where carbon stained prongs on the plug can cause a
lost neutral. I now always make the effort to shut down the breaker prior to
connecting and use duct tape or a copper wire tie (10 ga single strand
irrigation wire)to keep the pedistal connection inplace
>
> Greg 94ptca
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "gpaulcarver" wrote:
> >
> >
> > First we'd like to thank all who responded to our distress and
> > especially Liz who posted our predicament when we couldn't. Leaving all
> > to chance, we departed the last Lone Star Bird rally in balmy Texas to
> > venture north to Colorado to relocate an aging Aunt to a nursing
> > facility. That said, the "chance" portion was more than expected in
> > late Oct. Our intended stay was 3-5 days (just before the unscheduled
> > weather) and got extended to 14 days to accomplish all that needed done.
> > Well the weather added some of those days to correct problems created by
> > 15 degree temps. at night and 2 feet of snow making corrections
> > difficult in windy Royal Gourge. First our Primus system wasn't working
> > properly so basement heat was not on. Subsequently our water pumps
> > froze and cracked and the parks water system was turned off for the
> > season. Next a heavy snow took out the common on our 50 amp electric
> > circut. This caused a chain of events to include frying our shorepower
> > transfer switch, the microwave, a TV, one charger, a circut on the
> > inverter, and two GFI's. We were ill prepared to address many of the
> > issues in the weather and limited tooling let alone no supply source.
> > Luckily the zap spared our refrigerator and the other half of the
> > transfer switch. So our generator saved the remaining days and provided
> > heat till we could drive up to Colorado Springs to a great shop that
> > corrected most of our problems. We'll post later on that shops name and
> > address. Needless to say we're glad to be home and express again our
> > appreciation for the support offered from this group.
> >
> > Paul & Jo Carver
> >
> > '93 pt40 "Teri" Seven Points TX.
> >
>

[Chuck Wheeler]

When a neutral is lost the current then
flows from one hot leg through what ever is turned on to the neutral then from
neutral through the other leg to the other hot side. One hot to the other
will measure 220-240 vac so you would normally observe 110-120 from one hot
side to neutral. So with a “floating” neural the voltage
divides in proportion to the resistance of the loads. For example it one
side was 100ohms and the other was 50 ohms you would have 73 volts across the
50 ohm load and 147 across the 100 ohm load. This is a simple explanation
as there is impedance, power factors and other things that enter into it with
ac, but it is close. This incorrect voltage for the connected devices is
what causes problems. If you are using a cheater to plug into a 20 amp or
30 amp source the two hot sides are connected together so there is 0 volts
between them, but 110-120vac form either side to the neutral.

- Chuck
Wheeler-

1982 FC 31SB Fort Worth TX

---

From: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com [mailto:WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of gregory O

Sent: Saturday, November 14, 2009
1:09 PM

To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com

Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re:
Home again

the condition is called lost neutral or open neutral. to call it a common would
imply dc current. I believe???the transfer switch removes the neutral along
with the two hot lines otherwise the shorepower neutral which is earth ground
will ground out all the genset ac current???. if the transfer switch was the
problem that caused the other resulting issues, replacing the resulting issues
and the causing problem (transfer switch) will keep it from happening again. it
may well be that the neutral was lost some other place like in your shore cord
or in the campground pedistal and the issue is doomed to repeat its self again.




I can not understand how the ac current transfers voltage to the other leg when
the neutral is lost but I realize that electrical code properly followed will
prevent the damage.

Here is a rv related lost neutral article

http://www.myrv.us/electric/Pg/open_neutral.htm



One of the gals in our rv club had a recent lost neutral when her plug fell out
of the reseptical on an angle. the ground and center two hot prongs stayed connected.
I can also see where carbon stained prongs on the plug can cause a lost
neutral. I now always make the effort to shut down the breaker prior to
connecting and use duct tape or a copper wire tie (10 ga single strand
irrigation wire)to keep the pedistal connection inplace



Greg 94ptca



--- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com",
"gpaulcarver" .> wrote:

>

>

> First we'd like to thank all who responded to our distress and

> especially Liz who posted our predicament when we couldn't. Leaving all

> to chance, we departed the last Lone Star Bird rally in balmy Texas to

> venture north to Colorado
to relocate an aging Aunt to a nursing

> facility. That said, the "chance" portion was more than expected
in

> late Oct. Our intended stay was 3-5 days (just before the unscheduled

> weather) and got extended to 14 days to accomplish all that needed done.

> Well the weather added some of those days to correct problems created by

> 15 degree temps. at night and 2 feet of snow making corrections

> difficult in windy Royal Gourge. First our Primus system wasn't working

> properly so basement heat was not on. Subsequently our water pumps

> froze and cracked and the parks water system was turned off for the

> season. Next a heavy snow took out the common on our 50 amp electric

> circut. This caused a chain of events to include frying our shorepower

> transfer switch, the microwave, a TV, one charger, a circut on the

> inverter, and two GFI's. We were ill prepared to address many of the

> issues in the weather and limited tooling let alone no supply source.

> Luckily the zap spared our refrigerator and the other half of the

> transfer switch. So our generator saved the remaining days and provided

> heat till we could drive up to Colorado
Springs to a great shop that

> corrected most of our problems. We'll post later on that shops name and

> address. Needless to say we're glad to be home and express again our

> appreciation for the support offered from this group.

>

> Paul & Jo Carver

>

> '93 pt40 "Teri" Seven Points TX.

>

[Fred Hulse]

Paul & Jo

Yes,we owned the SP36 for about 3 years and it ended up back at Holland when we got this current 97.

I recall the water tank very well because it sprung a leak in a corner and I removed it and repaired in the kitchen area in the middle of July here at home.

I don't know where it went from Holland other than a couple bought it that lived up in Sacramento area.

That was a wonderful and remarkable coach and it taught me an awful lot about Blue Birds also.

We hope to see you soon.

Fred & Jeanne Hulse
Morristown Arizona
1997 Wanderlodge WLWB41