Winterizing thread

[Tom Warner]

Ralph I respect your expertise but this time I believe both you and
Bob did not hit the nail on the head, but instead may have given some
owners a false security in believing that the BB way of winterizing
the lines by blowing air thru them was foolproof. It is not. But as
always when two people disagree I believe it best to describe why so
it does not become a contest of expertise (for I have little) but
instead can air out the differences so others can make their own
decisions. If blowing air thru the lines ensured that all of the
water was expelled then why are there so many coaches with frozen pipes?

In the case of the 1982 FC35 with a side bath that I had there was
NOT an outside spigot as you describe for the low water point of the
system. Were you perhaps describing a rear bath coach? In my case
the low point was supposed to be a valve under the bathroom sink that
was parallel to the floor and that emptied thru the floor to the
underside of the coach. But even if that were true it would not
alter my disagreement that air is not a fool proof way to remove all
of the water from the lines so that when the cold weather hits for
even a single night you can GUARANTEE that even a single pipe will
not freeze. Bluebird designed the fresh water system when winterizing
with the air pressure method to first empty the hot water heater and
the fresh water tank by flowing out the rear of the coach in the case
of the hot water heater and in the case of the fresh water tank to
flow to the lowest point which in my case was the valve underneath
the bathroom cabinet. But again that point is only the low point if
the coach is on a level surface. Even a slight uphill attitude of
the front of the coach can cause the air to blow by the last of the
water in the long lines which extend from the rear water heater on a
Side bath coach to under the bathroom sink. When the air is shutoff
the small risidual amount of water that is left in the bottom of the
lines as the air blows over it, will flow backwards to the new lowest
point and settles there ready to be frozen. And it will if the inside
temperature falls below freezing.
I have been lucky that my has not frozen and I have taken
extraordinary precautions to ensure it did not. In the future I want
to make it sure and fast when winterizing. I believe if it is
possible that most will chose this method to relieve the doubts. I
know I dont want to replace a copper line in my coach and cause even
more problems with the new PEX line which undoubtably will not be
perfectly straight and cause even more water to be trapped.

With a hotwater bypass and a few other slight changes in the
winterizing method I believe it is possible to completely winterize
the system without the solution coming into contact with the fresh
water or hot water tanks. In addition once winterized I want to be
able to purge the solution by simply turning on the water pump and
pumping fresh water into the system replacing the winterizing
solution into the waste tanks. I did exactly that on my 1976 GMC
motorhome and I will do the same on the 1985 PT 40 that I now own.

If others are interested in doing it that way, and getting rid of the
doubts of whether a pipe will freeze or not, then when mine is
completed I will be glad to show others how to do it. If not then
they may continue doing it the way they chose.

Tom Warner
Vernon Center,NY
1985 PT 40
At 01:22 PM 6/15/2006, you wrote:

>Hello everyone:
>
>Bob's post hit the nail on the head on this subject.
>
> From the 80's Coaches on, a good system was built into the Bird's for
>winterizing, and it works!
>
>Open the low water drain valve, open the out side spigot valve
>usually found in the LP compartment.
>
>Then switch the water heater drain/fill switch to drain and switch on
>the air blow out to supply air to the water heater/water lines/ pump
>and so forth. Leave the air on until only air comes from the out side
>spigot and shut the air switch to the off position. This will leave
>some water in the filter/ice maker/and perhaps the acumulater. This
>risidual water can be drained manually as per the manual in the blue
>box. After that, switch the air drain switch to on one more time to
>get any collected water from the pipes, and switch the air drain
>switch off. Pour 1 quart of pink stuff in the P trap in the sinks and
>shower and add some tot he holding tanks which should have been
>drained first. Keep the pink stuff out of the water heater and you
>really dont want it in your water filter either.
>
>Your done. Now then here is a fact on Birds. After blowing out the
>water heater, there will be 2 quarts of water that remains in it.
>This cannot be drained because the water level is below the drain of
>the water heater. Even though this small amount of water is left in
>the water heater, when it freezes there is expansion room in the
>tank, so no worries there.
>
>All this is in your manuals.
>
>Ralph Fullenwider
>RV Solutions in Oklahoma
>
>