Thinking of joining the birders!

[brad barton]

Dan,
You may not have seen my mea culpa to Ralph who corrected me on the steel
bodies.
I didn't take just one man's word for the truth. I spoke with one retired
dealer, three active dealers, one sales manager and a consignment expert.
Some knew Blue Bird from the inside, others from the outside. They all said
roughly the same thing, that Blue Bird never did consistently well in
down-pricing their coaches. If they had found the right formula in
WanderlodgeII, BMC, LX or M380, they'd probably still be doing it. I also
spent some time with a Blue Bird rep a couple weeks ago who went through the
litany of Blue Bird's internal struggles with the engineers, forcing them to
cut corners to lower the cost and expand their market share. I obviously
misunderstood what he told me about body construction. I also forgot the
37's came with the 300 Cummins as well as the larger engines. Please don't
get the idea that I'm down-rating BMC's or LX's. They are what they are and
I'll leave it at that. No offense intended.
Brad


>From: "ac7880"
>Reply-To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
>To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Thinking of joining the birders!
>Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 00:44:52 -0000
>
>I quote: "but cooled off. A retired dealer with whom we did business
>twice (for our first 84-35FC and a 1986 Newell Classic) nearly came
>unglued when I brought it up. He was a longtime Blue Bird dealer in
>the 70s and 80s. I have since found out some things about the LX."
>
>That says it all. You took one man's word, and now spread that as
>the truth. A dealer ALWAYS has a agenda. The real truth lies in
>research, from multiple sources, and experts like you find on this
>and other Bluebird websites.
>
>Dan
>1994 Bluebird BMC 37' steel roof and sides, fiberglass front and rear
>cap, fiberglass storage doors - just like late model wanderlodges,
>and no, it does not have the M11 Cummins (I wish this 37 foot had the
>450 HP you say it has).
>
>Regards,
>
>
>--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "brad barton"
><bbartonwx@...> wrote:
> >
> > Ralph,
> > I bow to your command of detail on the BMC and LX bodies. I know
>the cargo
> > doors were fiberglass, but it was my mistake about the fiberglass
>bodies.
> > As I said, an LX is still better than most coaches, but BB's
>manipulation of
> > quality and amenities among various Wanderlodges makes it hard for
>LX owners
> > to get what they think is a fair price for their coach. Again, the
>coach in
> > Michigan listed on RVTrader is the nicest I've seen.
> > Brad Barton
> >
> >
> > >From: "Ralph L. Fullenwider"
> > >Reply-To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > >To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > >Subject: RE: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Thinking of joining the
>birders!
> > >Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2007 11:28:45 -0600
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Interesting analogy with some truths but fiberglass bodies? no.
> > >
> > >Truth, the Wanderlodge II was a striped down model that what once
>was OE
> > >became options. things like HWH jacks and many others.
> > >
> > >Starting in '88 with the advent of wide body, the front and rear
>caps were
> > >fiberglass but the side and roof were steel.
> > >
> > >The BMC, true is not a Wanderlodge, however the sides and roof are
>steel,
> > >though I think, not sure, that the compartment doors were fiber
>glass.
> > >
> > >The LX, fiberglass caps that started in '88 but sides and roof are
>steel,
> > >as are the LXI.
> > >
> > >The M 380 was not fiberglass but a composite aluminium, 2 sheets of
> > >aluminium with a composite center. The main problem with the 380
>was the
> > >skin would grow and shrink with heat and cold, thus the sides would
> > >wrinkle. Yes there were a few problems with the electrical but the
>lay out
> > >of the panel was done right for a change. The main problem with the
> > >electrical we the marriage between the slide and HWH jack system
>via the
> > >micro p[rocesser. If the Coach was not level, the microprocessor
>would not
> > >allow the slide to move, so the computer had to be reset, jacks
>retracted
> > >and start the system again. There was also a problem of the slide
>locks
> > >pulling, going down the road, this was usually caused by a mis
>adjusted
> > >micro switch.
> > >
> > >The LX 450 got away form most of that and went to stainless steel
>and
> > >introduced multiplexing of systems with a beefed up microprocessor.
> > >
> > >The myth of the LX model being fiberglass came from the mid year
>change in,
> > >what? 2002 or 2003 where the skin was taken to the composite used
>on the M
> > >380 and was the test bed for the 380.
> > >
> > >There was nothing cheap about all of this, the R&D alone had to
>cost a
> > >bundle because of the change, it is just too bad that the skin
>problems on
> > >the 380 were not better thought out.
> > >
> > >Also with the 380 the signature of the Wanderlodge took it's major
>hit, the
> > >"goat rails" were missing, and to my thinking, this was and is the
>largest
> > >mistake BB could have made. Now they look like the Monaco's and
>various
> > >other Manufacturers Coaches.
> > >
> > >No, the LX and LXI models are good stable units, though a bit too
>glitzy
> > >inside for my taste. I don't go camping to clean mirrors on the
>ceilings.
> > >
> > >
> > >Just my 2 cents
> > >
> > >Safe travels,
> > >
> > >Ralph and Charolette Fullenwider
> > >84FC35
> > >Ralph's RV Solutions, Duncan, Oklahoma
> > >
> > > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "brad barton"
> > > > ><bbartonwx@> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Damien,
> > > > > > I'm new to the group, but a longtime Blue Bird fan. I
>think the
> > > > >coach you
> > > > > > are looking at is a black and silver coach with modern
>decor..and
> > > > >it's at a
> > > > > > truck dealer. We were considering an LX but cooled off. A
>retired
> > > > >dealer
> > > > > > with whom we did business twice (for our first 84-35FC and
>a 1986
> > > > >Newell
> > > > > > Classic) nearly came unglued when I brought it up. He was a
> > > > >longtime Blue
> > > > > > Bird dealer in the 70s and 80s. I have since found out
>some things
> > > > >about
> > > > > > the LX. You're free to accept or reject all of this but I
>believe
> > > > >it is
> > > > > > true. Most of it came from a Blue Bird rep I spoke to just
>weeks
> > > > >ago.
> > > > > > Blue Bird has constantly searched for ways to a lower price
>point.
> > > > >The
> > > > > > WanderlodgeII was the first attempt..and pretty sad. Then
>as
> > > > >Wanderlodges
> > > > > > got more expensive, Blue Bird looked for a new approach.
>Their
> > > > >engineers
> > > > > > said it would take two years to come up with a less
>expensive 37-
> > > > >40'
> > > > > > chassis, so they bought Spartan chassis with Cummins M11
>engines.
> > > > >They were
> > > > > > known as a Blue Bird Motor Coach..or a BMC. The only thing
>Blue
> > > > >Bird on it
> > > > > > was the dash and the label. The BMC is NOT a Wanderlodge.
>Not
> > > > >bad, just
> > > > > > cheap. By the time those chassis ran out, the engineers
>had a new
> > > > >40'
> > > > > > platform. They kept the fiberglass body, put new caps on
>front and
> > > > >rear,
> > > > > > kept the Cummins engine but used their own superior Blue
>Bird
> > > > >chassis with
> > > > > > Ridewell air suspension. Of all the "cheep" Birds, the LX
>is
> > > > >probably the
> > > > > > best. But it's still fiberglass outside, virtually no
>chrome,
> > > > >ultraleather
> > > > > > vinyl inside, smaller in tank capacity, lacking in design,
> > > > >especially around
> > > > > > the windows and roughly $150,000 in overall quality, fit and
> > > > >finish. We bit
> > > > > > the bullet and moved on to the LXi and we're very glad we
>did.
> > > > > > LX owners asking 165K and up don't like to hear their coach
>is only
> > > > >little
> > > > > > more than "half" bird, but the truth hurts. NADA book
>prices on
> > > > >the 2000 LX
> > > > > > are very harsh..upper 90's to 110's. LX owners have every
>right to
> > > > >feel
> > > > > > bitter, but as a buyer, I asked several dealers (who had
>nothing to
> > > > >gain
> > > > > > from me) what they would offer. One said 95K, one said
>110K and
> > > > >the one
> > > > > > whole actually knew the actual coach said 150K was a serious
> > > > >stretch. Not
> > > > > > only are LX owners unhappy, but WBPT and LXi owners are
>mad, too
> > > > >because
> > > > > > their own manufacturer made it harder for them to sell
>their high-
> > > > >dollar
> > > > > > coaches. And Blue Bird has done it again..most recently
>wiith the
> > > > >M380
> > > > > > which was a disaster (Blue Bird rep's word). I can't
>confirm it,
> > > > >but I
> > > > > > heard every one of them was recalled for various problems,
>mainly
> > > > >electrical
> > > > > > and wiring. They are not made any longer except by special
>order.
> > > > > > All that being said, there's nothing wrong with a Cummins M-
>11 or
> > > > >Allison
> > > > > > 4060, or Ultraleather or fiberglass, for that matter. Just
>make
> > > > >sure you
> > > > > > understand it's not the steel-bodied full-fledged
>Wanderlodge most
> > > > >of us
> > > > > > think of. A poor man's Wanderlodge LX is probably still a
>lot
> > > > >better than
> > > > > > most coaches, new or used. If you want the best LX
>currently on
> > > > >the market,
> > > > > > look at this coach. It's garaged in Michigan and virtually
> > > > >pristine. Nice
> > > > > > people, too.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > http://www.rvtrader.com/rvdetail519280.htm
> > > > > >
> > > > > > BBarton in Dallas
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >From: "remiksjewelry"
> > > > > > >Reply-To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > > >To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > > >Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Thinking of joining the
>birders!
> > > > > > >Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2007 22:33:14 -0000
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >Hello -
> > > > > > >Thanks for having this group! We currently have a Safari
>Trek and
> > > > >are
> > > > > > >looking into upgrading to a Bluebird. We found one we
>like - it
> > > > >is a
> > > > > > >2000 LX Millenium edition. It is for sale in Maryland.
>Does any
> > > > >know
> > > > > > >anything about this particular coach? The price seems
>right, but
> > > > >we
> > > > > > >would have to travel quite a distance to see it for
>ourselves.
> > > > >Also,
> > > > > > >would love to know about the ride and handling of a bird.
> > > > > > >Is the M11 450 cummings a reliable engine?
> > > > > > >Any comments or advice will be greatly appreciated.
> > > > > > >Thanks!
> > > > > > >Damien
> > > > > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > With tax season right around the corner, make sure to follow these
>few
> > simple tips.
> >
>http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Tax...reparation
>Tips.aspx?icid=HMFebtagline
> >
>
>

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