Wet sleeve explained

[Curt Sprenger]

Greg,

Rob is right in telling us to test the coolant. It should be done at least twice a year, and only after the summer/winter pumps, etc. have been turned on to high coolant flow for a good period of time. Probable best to test in late fall and again April. Test strips should tell the story, or take a sample to a shop that can test the coolant. That is one reason I added the coolant filter in our coach coolant system. The filter additives should help. Just hope I'm not too late. I'm in agreement with what you said, the water heater adds a foreign metal and un-calculated variable to the longevity of the r fluid.

On Sun, Sep 28, 2008 at 6:31 PM, Gregory OConnor <"Gregoryoc@aol.com"> wrote:

test the r fluid. and run the bus often. I wonder if the loop to the waterheater adds a foreign metal and uncalculated variable to the longevity of the r fluid. the harmonic cadence of the engine in operation and things as simple as a 12 volt e'short can cause metal damage in the engine. all you need is to screw up enough metal at one area near a seal and a sleve lets loose.

trucker gets a short then takes it in the shorts

RobRalways talks about R fluid maintenance, Kinda annoying untill now. Time for me to step up my game .

Greg94pt

--- In "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com", "Scott Forman" <scottforman75@...> wrote:
>
> So the big question is...is there something, anything, that can be

> done to prevent this failure?
>
> Scott Forman
> 86 PT38
> Can't afford a $30k rebuild
> Memphis
>
> --- In "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com", "Bob Lawrence"

> bobandarlene@ wrote:
> >
> > Hi Ron,
> > Sorry for the trouble. We were parked next to you in Q last year.
> > Have you considered getting a lowboy to take the bus south to a
> > better dealer and maybe a lower price? It would get you out of the

> > weather.
> > Bob Lawrence
> > 84 PT36
> > Branson, Mo.
> >
> > > Up there, it would be close to the same and be 10 to 12 weeks out,
> > > putting me in the winter and probably hard to get home.

> > >
> > > R.E. (Ron) Marabito, Dallas, TX 92WB40
> > >
> > > --- In "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com", "mbulriss" <mbulriss@>

> > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Good grief Ron! Sorry!
> > > > $25-30K for an in-frame?
> > > > How much for a reman replacement with a nationwide warranty?

> > > >
> > > > Mike Bulriss
> > > > 1991 WB40 "Texas Minivan"
> > > > San Antonio, TX
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >

> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --- In "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com", "ronmarabito2002"
> > > > wrote:

> > > > >
> > > > > Kurt: You got off lightly. I am looking at 5 to 6 times
> that
> > amount.
> > > > >
> > > > > R.E. (Ron) Marabito, Dallas, TX 92WB40

> > > > >
> > > > > --- In "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com", "Kurt Horvath"
> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > >
> > > > > > Ron,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sorry that you are grounded. Words can't begin to console a
> > coach

> > > > > > owner with a broke motor. Been there done that, three
> months
> > after
> > > > > > buying my coach. New cam & stuff $5K. Best you can hope for

> > is they
> > > > > > do a good job and you get the warranty. Anytime this
> happens
> > I just
> > > > > > tell them fix it like it was yours and walk away. Say a

> little
> > > prayer
> > > > > > that it works out. When they are done with it go back up
> > there, get
> > > > > > your coach and DRIVE BABY DRIVE! It's your only good option.

> > > > > >
> > > > > > Kurt Horvath
> > > > > > 95 PT-42
> > > > > > 10AC
> > > > > >
> > > > > >

> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- In "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com", "ronmarabito2002"
> > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > They already have it torn down. It would cost a bundle to
> > > just put
> > > > > > it
> > > > > > > back together to get it back. Heads overheated, but I

> have
> > no
> > > way
> > > > > > of
> > > > > > > knowing if they are really damaged or not. Overheat
> plugs
> > did
> > > melt.

> > > > > > > I'm pretty much at their mercy. If they only replaced
> the
> > two
> > > > > > damaged
> > > > > > > sleeves that are obvious and the engine failed again on

> the
> > return
> > > > > > > trip, I would not have any warranty at all. Most of the
> > overheat
> > > > > > > happened after the shut down because most of the coolant

> was
> > > dumped.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > R.E. (Ron) Marabito, Dallas, TX 92WB40
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --- In "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com", "Gregory OConnor"
> > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I posted that for you to have some insight info when
> the
> > shop
> > > > > > > > called. Kinda thought it was a sleeve seal when you

> said
> > it
> > > > > > emptied
> > > > > > > > quick. a cracked head and waterpump gasket would take
> some
> > > time.
> > > > > > you

> > > > > > > > can always only drop in a sleeve to repair the bad one
> if
> > you
> > > > > > didnt
> > > > > > > > get things too hot. the garage is gonna sell you the

> > works
> > > > > > because
> > > > > > > > they can and it is sure to get any other issue that may
> or
> > > maynot
> > > > > > > > exist delt with.

> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > get a price on dropping in some sleves or just the one
> to
> > bring
> > > > > > it
> > > > > > > > to a local with better US craftsmanship. a trap door in

> > the
> > > > > > bedroom
> > > > > > > > closet would speed a rebuild up and reduce labor cost.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I hope you get it going for Quartzsite,

> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Greg
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > In "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com", "ronmarabito2002"

> > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Greg: I can tell you first hand now, that a sleeved
> > > engine is

> > > > > > > > flawed
> > > > > > > > > and the failure of any seal, unless it is idling,
> will
> > cause
> > > > > > > > > catastrophic failure and total rebuild. This is true

> > > > > > especially if
> > > > > > > > > you expect any kind of warranty on the work. Your
> > > warranty for
> > > > > > a
> > > > > > > > > partial is only 30 days. BIG DEAL!.

> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I just lost my engine in less than 1.5 minutes
> from
> > first
> > > > > > > > > indication of a problem.

> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I'm sure the whole purpose behind the sleeved
> engine
> > > is less
> > > > > > > > > weight and cost in manufacture, but it makes the user

> > the
> > > > > > > > scapegoat in
> > > > > > > > > the case of any failure. To make matters worse, the
> > warranty
> > > > > > for a

> > > > > > > > > re-build is awful as it related to motorhome use. The
> > > factory
> > > > > > only
> > > > > > > > > gives you 12 months and unlimited mileage. A

> > commercial
> > > > > > vehicle
> > > > > > > > such
> > > > > > > > > as a long-haul truck can log up to 50,000 miles in
> that

> > 12
> > > > > > months
> > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > it is a good warranty. The average motorhome owner
> only
> > > puts on

> > > > > > > > > around 10,000 miles in the same period and usually
> less
> > than
> > > > > > that.
> > > > > > > > > Not much of a warranty under those conditions.

> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I could purchase a used FC for the price of one
> > engine
> > > > > > > > failure in

> > > > > > > > > a Detroit 8V92.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Detroit gives much better warranties on the
> Series

> > > 60, but
> > > > > > it
> > > > > > > > too
> > > > > > > > > is a sleeved engine. I wonder what the failure
> record

> > is on
> > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > one?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > R.E. (Ron) Marabito, Dallas, TX 92WB40

> > > > > > > > > Currently sitting in Calgary, Alberta (Broken)
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > --- In "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com", "Gregory

> > OConnor"
> > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > here is a video on wet sleeve vs dry. it also

> depicts
> > the
> > > > > > > > importance on
> > > > > > > > > > maintaining coolant integrity. 8v92 6v92 and series
> > 60 are
> > > > > > wet

> > > > > > > > sleeve
> > > > > > > > > > the kubota gensets are drySleeved.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > the two stroke V92's have intake/exhaust ports on

> > the
> > > side
> > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > sleeve and require more sealing surface . minor

> > pitting
> > > near
> > > > > > a
> > > > > > > > seal on
> > > > > > > > > > the waterside can let the seal go. and dump coolant

> > in the
> > > > > > oil.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > cylinder sleeve video
> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > <http://video.google.com/videosearch?gbv=...off&q=wet%

> > > > > > > > 20sleeve\
> > > > > > > > > > %20cross&ndsp=20&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=iv#q=wet%
> 20sleeve%
> > > > > > > > 20&hl=en&emb=0> The

> > > > > > > > > > FC and SP 3208's have not a sleeve so a single
> > cylinder
> > > > > > > > inframe is not
> > > > > > > > > > possible. some call the 3208 'throwaway engines'

> > > because it
> > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > always
> > > > > > > > > > completly rebuilt at the failure of one cylinder
> wall

> > > (3208's
> > > > > > are
> > > > > > > > > > notorious for waterjacket issues at one cylinder so
> > coolant
> > > > > > > > integrity is

> > > > > > > > > > as important). problem with a sleeved engine is
> > once your
> > > > > > > > engine
> > > > > > > > > > looses coolant you cant tell how compramise all the

> > other
> > > > > > seals
> > > > > > > > are and
> > > > > > > > > > a total rebuild is prudent. kinda think that is why
> > private

> > > > > > > > coaches are
> > > > > > > > > > rebuilt more often than just repaired
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Greg
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

--
Curt Sprenger
1987 PT38 8V92 "MacAttack Racing"
Anaheim Hills, CA