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11-01-2008, 14:30

Kurt

I'm more convinced now that 5" is the standard trucking muffler

size cause they run dual stacks. Donaldson doesn't make a

muffler that's suitable for the 14L Series 60, in this case you have

to use dual 5 inchers if you buy from Donaldson. Again, it would

be interesting to take a look at your typical late model 14L Series

60 equipped Prevost. I know their mufflers exit below the bumper,

but it would be interesting nonetheless. I'm interested in all this
cause

I'll be needing a muffler change in the near future, so let's work
together

to arrive at a good solution. I want more horsepower. Let's figure

out how to improve the breathing. Assuming that the intake is not the

limiting factor, and I don't think it is, enhancing the exhaust should

improve performance and engine life, less heat, higher manifold

pressures, better fuel mileage and longer piston and ring life. Not

trying to get under your skin, just looking for a suitable improvement
in

my engine. Your the lucky guy who's gotta travel down this road

first.

David

'02 LXi, NC

Kurt Horvath wrote:

> But Kurt, it's only 5 inches, correct? The turbo dumps into

> 5 inches but the gases are hot, low density, low pressure and

> moving fast. As the exhaust progresses down the exhaust

> system the air cools, becomes more dense, and back pressure

Ø increases.

Ø

Ø CORRECT, THAT IS WHY YOU USE EXHAUST BLANKETS ON THE, MANIFOLD,

TURBO, PIPES, AND STACK TO KEEP THE HEAT INSIDE THE PIPES FROM

COOLING THUS MAINTAINIG THE VELOCITY OF THE ESCAPING EXHAUST

Ø

Ø If way down the exhaust you go from 6 to 5 your

Ø increasing the backpressure.

Ø

Ø THE EXHAUST DOES NOT REDUCE DOWN TO 5" FROM 6" IT IS 5" FROM TURBO

TO THE END OF THE STACK DICHARGE. A 6" STACK CAN BE BUILT AS I

DECRIBED BEFOR BUT COSTS ARE DOUBLED. 5' SS TUBE $20 A FOOT, 6" SS

TUBE $50 A FOOT

Ø

Ø This will make the exhaust run

> hotter at the turbo, high turbo pyrometer, less turbo velocity,

> and a reduction in performance. 5 inches is 20 square inches,

> while 6 provides 30, a whopping 50% improvement. I'm gonna

> stick with the 6 or figure out a way to stuff 2 five inch stacks

Ø in the corner of the bus.

Ø

Ø I'M SURE THIS GUY COULD BUILD 2-5" STACKS AND HOOK THEM TOGETHER

WITH A COLLECTOR AT THE START LIKE HEADERS

Ø

Ø If you take it down to 5 inches, let

> us know if your turbo pyrometer shows excessive temps on

> those long 6% grades. I think the key is eliminating/reducing

> back pressure.

>

> Do you have a web page for the 5" stack that you'd like to

Ø use?

NO THEY DO NOT LIST THE STACK IT IS CUSTOM BUILT

>

Ø Check this out: http://dieselinjection.net/BRUCE/articles.html

IT WILL TAKE SOME TIME TO ASSIMULATE ALL THAT

>

>

> David

> '02 LXi, NC

>

> David

> '02 LXi, NC

--- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com",
David Brady "dmb993@..."

wrote:

>

> But Kurt, it's only 5 inches, correct? The turbo dumps into

> 5 inches but the gases are hot, low density, low pressure and

> moving fast. As the exhaust progresses down the exhaust

> system the air cools, becomes more dense, and back pressure

> increases. If way down the exhaust you go from 6 to 5 your

> increasing the backpressure. This will make the exhaust run

> hotter at the turbo, high turbo pyrometer, less turbo velocity,

> and a reduction in performance. 5 inches is 20 square inches,

> while 6 provides 30, a whopping 50% improvement. I'm gonna

> stick with the 6 or figure out a way to stuff 2 five inch stacks

> in the corner of the bus. If you take it down to 5 inches, let

> us know if your turbo pyrometer shows excessive temps on

> those long 6% grades. I think the key is eliminating/reducing

> back pressure.

>

> Do you have a web page for the 5" stack that you'd like to

> use?

>

> Check this out: http://dieselinjection.net/BRUCE/articles.html

>

>

> David

> '02 LXi, NC

>

> Kurt Horvath wrote:

> >

> > Gregg,

> >

> > Yea, ALL SHOW AND NO GO!-

> >

> > David,

> >

> > I know what you're after but the pipes I described are
basically

> > straight pipes with a very well designed sound surprising
ceramic

> > coating that does not restrict flow. But won't be as harsh as
a

> > straight pipe. Cost is nominal at $250.00 Vs $200 for a
straight

pipe

> >

> > Kurt Horvath

> > 95 PT 42

> > 10AC

> >

> > @yahoogroups.com, "Gregory OConnor"
wrote:

> > >

> > > Kurt, I dont think big thick straight pipes were mounted
on

those

> > > rigs for performance or efficiency. its all looks and

compensation.

> > > Bet every trucker with 8 inch stacks also drive a 4x4
requiring

a

> > > step latter to get into.

> > > Greg 94pt,toyota pickup

> > >

> > > --- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com"

> > <"Wanderlodge"Forum%40yahoogroups.com>,
"Rob Robinson"

> > > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Kurt two years ago up here in BC I saw a millenium
Bluebird

> > parked

> > > across

> > > > from me at my home RV park that had two stacks. The
owners

were

> > only

> > > > visiting and must have been out sight seeing most
of the time

> > > because I

> > > > never did see them. I sure would have like to see
behind their

> > > engine bay.

> > > >

> > > > 2008/11/1 Kurt Horvath

> > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > I guess you could or go to a large 8" single ,
bit the

chrome

> > > shops

> > > > > sell them for outrageous prices---$692.00

> > > > >

http://www.iowa80.com/DirectionsWEB/webcart_productDisplay.php?

> > <http://www.iowa80.com/DirectionsWEB/webcart_productDisplay.php?>

> > > > > itemid=74151

> > > > > Kurt Horvath

> > > > > 95 PT 42

> > > > > 10AC

> > > > >

> > > > > In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com"

> > <"Wanderlodge"Forum%40yahoogroups.com>

> > > 40yahoogroups.com>,

> > > > > David Brady wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Now we're talking. Can you fit two stacks
back there? I'm

> > > > > > serious. This will be an improvement in
performance. Two

> > stacks

> > > > > > will dramatically reduce backpressure,
which will result

in

> > > > > > lower turbo pyrometer temps, and will
allow more boost and

> > > > > > more power. A single 5 inch, as compared
to the stock 6"

> > > > > > will do the reverse.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > David

> > > > > > '02 LXi, NC

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Kurt Horvath wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > One pipe from the turbo then splits
to two stacks.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Kurt Horvath

> > > > > > > 95 PT 42

> > > > > > > 10AC

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > --- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com"

> > <"Wanderlodge"Forum%40yahoogroups.com><WanderlodgeForum%

> > > 40yahoogroups.com>

> > > > > > > <"Wanderlodge"Forum%

40yahoogroups.comorum%

> > > 2540yahoogroups.com>>,

> > > > > David Brady

> > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > But doesn't the trucking
industry run dual exhausts?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > David Brady

> > > > > > > > '02 LXi, NC

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Pete Masterson wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Having recently replaced
my muffler (at great

expense) -

> > -

> > > had

> > > > > I

> > > > > > > to do

> > > > > > > > > it over again, I'd have
switched over to a 5" system

> > from

> > > > > turbo to

> > > > > > > > > stack. As others have
stated, it's 5" at the turbo

> > outlet

> > > and

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > standard in the heavy
truck industry is 5".

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > The only performance
difference I notice (between

the

> > old

> > > > > blown

> > > > > > > out

> > > > > > > > > muffler and the new one)
is that the exhaust-type

Jake

> > > brake

> > > > > > > seems to

> > > > > > > > > be slightly less effective.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Pete Masterson

> > > > > > > > > '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge
WBDA 42

> > > > > > > > > aeonix1@
<"aeonix1%"40mac.com
> > 2540mac.com>>

> > > > > > > > > On the road at Hohenwald,
TN (Natchez Trace Parkway)

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > On Oct 31, 2008, at 11:24
PM, Kurt Horvath wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > <snip>

> > > > > > > > > > For the last four
weeks I have queried Detroit

Diesel,

> > > > > Custom

> > > > > > > Exhaust

> > > > > > > > > > Fabricators, Several
OEM Exhaust Mfg.'s, Marine

> > Exhaust

> > > > > > > Engineers &

> > > > > > > > > > Fabricators, My BB
Guru, and anyone else that

would

> > > lend an

> > > > > > > ear, and

> > > > > > > > > > no one has expressed
any apprehension or regard

in the

> > > > > respect

> > > > > > > to a

> > > > > > > > > > 5" exhaust system. In
fact all parties expressed

their

> > > > > surprise

> > > > > > > in

> > > > > > > > > > respect as to why the
system would change size at

the

> > > > > muffler.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Several owners have
modified their systems to 5"

from

> > > end to

> > > > > > > end, and

> > > > > > > > > > have seen no change
in performance. Positive or

> > > negative, In

> > > > > > > general

> > > > > > > > > > it was just a matter
of convenience in acquiring

> > parts,

> > > I

> > > > > won't

> > > > > > > get

> > > > > > > > > > into that. That has
recently been beaten to death

at

> > the

> > > > > > > expense of

> > > > > > > > > > all parties involved

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------

----

> > --

> > > > > > > ------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is
out-of-date.

> > > > > > > > > Checked by AVG.

> > > > > > > > > Version: 7.5.405 / Virus
Database: 270.8.0/1715 -

> > Release

> > > > > Date:

> > > > > > > 10/9/2008 12:00 AM

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------

--

> > > > > ------

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Internal Virus Database is
out-of-date.

> > > > > > > Checked by AVG.

> > > > > > > Version: 7.5.405 / Virus Database:
270.8.0/1715 -

Release

> > > Date:

> > > > > 10/9/2008 12:00 AM

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > --

> > > > Rob, Sue & Merlin Robinson

> > > > 94 WLWB

> > > >

> > >

> >

> >

> > ----------------------------------------------------------

------

> >

> > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > Checked by AVG.

> > Version: 7.5.405 / Virus Database: 270.8.0/1715 - Release
Date:

10/9/2008 12:00 AM

> >

>
Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.405 / Virus Database: 270.8.0/1715 - Release Date: 10/9/2008 12:00 AM