Another Bird fire

[Wallace Craig]

Kurt, very wise decision. Be sure your insurance is current and than do the best you can to find and correct the problem. Wallace Craig 95 WLWB 42 Azle, Texas --- On Fri, 11/27/09, bumpersbird wrote: From: bumpersbird Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Another Bird fire To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com Date: Friday, November 27, 2009, 3:55 PM We are up to 3 coach fires, Randy, Rob and R.E. (Ron) Marabito All the coaches are 90 to 95 vintage. If they were Airplanes they would be grounded, until the problem was found. Folks this has gotten to the point where I for one will have my coach wiring inspected from Bumper to Bumper by the Pro's. I've been all thru everything I can get to. So did Rob from what I've heard, and there was still a Gremlin in his coach. I've always had Gremlins in my Bird, just part of the program. I no long consider this just coincidence, So until I can have my coach inspected by not one but two or three different professionals, (Prevost, Whites Creek TN, Hemphill Bros, Nashville TN, Maryville Marine/Xantrex, Whitehouse TN ) Any T-Fuses that I haven't already changed will be replaced with a proper fuse holders, not a the pipe stand off with the fuse wrapped in electricans tape, that BB used to hold the fuse. Any qustionable wires will be replaced. Possibly Fuse the Batteries, anything else that can make my coach safer. It's become obvious that there is a problem with the design. Until then. Indulgance is grounded. Kurt Horvath 95 PT 42 10AC --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "gregory O" wrote: > > probably best to leave things as they were designed by BB and maintain the design. On my bus the design has a proven record of 48,000 miles and 14 years. many things done in the spirit of safety are not obvious.your fuse mod may be plagued with fault > > on a car, crap like lead battery cable ends on the battery post are by design less secure then the other battery cable end connected to the starter so an accident would cause the cable to break away from the battery and not the starter. modifications like slow burn fuses should consider all the variables. I wonder how much heat the slow acting fuse produce.I wonder how many more connections and failure points are created with all the safety mods members will add during this rush for safety. every high amp connection has two soldered ends that need to be secured. > > One big question for me was why did the BB engineers use glass fuses and resettable beakers in different areas. I like the resettable breakers convenience but fear the lesson learned when a function trips a fuse and was reset automaticaly with out alerting my attention is lost. I replaced my brake lght auto reset with glass for this reason. > Greg > 94ptca > > > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete Masterson aeonix1@ wrote: > > > > I think it should be pretty obvious that all high-amperage, unfused > > battery cables ought to be checked carefully. > > That would include the house batteries -- in a '95 those are contained > > in the rear-most curb-side compartment and on a tray by the engine. In > > addition, there are 3 engine batteries above the 2 house batteries > > near the engine. > > > > The house batteries are wired to a general distribution panel on the > > curb side of the firewall. The engine batteries are wired to the > > engine -- but also have a connection to the house batteries (as you > > can tie them together with a switch on the dash). > > > > The Bakersfield fire _might_ have been caused by a short from the > > house batteries and/or the firewall distribution panel. (We await > > further word from the fire inspector and/or insurance adjuster.) > > > > Randy's fire was caused by a dead short in the front most, street side > > compartment, where the battery cable (running 40-some feet from the > > curb-side rear to the street side front-most compartment) that serves > > the generator starter motor. Apparently, from the report of the fire > > inspector and insurance adjuster, it appears that the insulation had > > been compromised where the heavy cable passed over a frame rail. > > > > We all may have been a little complacent over the 12v systems, since > > 12 v current rarely causes much of a fire or electrocution issue. It's > > easy to forget just how much potential amperage that the batteries can > > release in a dead short. > > > > The suggestion to install a high-amperage (slow acting) fuse on the > > batteries makes a lot of sense. A slow acting fuse is required since > > things like the engine and generator starter motor can draw a brief, > > very high amperage burst -- and you don't want to blow the fuse. But a > > short would cause a longer drain, and would blow the fuse. > > > > Of course, a careful inspection of all the high-amperage wires is > > called for. Unfortunately, wires may pass through areas where visible > > inspection is difficult or impossible. (Mirrors mounted to extension > > handles and flashlights would be quite useful.) Even so, it's likely > > that there are places where thorough inspection will prove impossible. > > (Which simply increases the importance of fusing the batteries.) > > > > Another 'wise' modification would be to install a high-amperage switch > > to completely isolate the batteries from the coach. Marine supplies > > sell such switches for boats and they can be adapted to motorhome use > > quite easily. The added advantage of such a switch would be to ensure > > that all phantom loads (which BBs have in abundance) would be cut off, > > allowing longer storage periods without a charger on the batteries. > > > > In the Bakersfield situation, it's hard to discern how the fire might > > have been avoided. The owner reported that he'd inspected the wires > > (as best as he could) after hearing about Randy's fire. It is unlikely > > that any of us would have shut off all the batteries while in a nearby > > restaurant for dinner -- but fuses _might_ have saved the coach, had > > they been installed. (Then, again, pending a final determination of > > the cause of the fire, it might not have been effective.) > > > > Pete Masterson > > (former) '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42 > > El Sobrante CA > > aeonix1@ > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 26, 2009, at 6:31 PM, Ernie Ekberg wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Where I observed was the batteries on the curbside, close to the > > > firewall of the engine compartment > > > > > > Ernie Ekberg > > > 83PT40 > > > Wanderlodge > > > Weatherford, Tx 817-475-3991 > > > http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/erni...gandrepair > > > > > > > > > --- On Thu, 11/26/09, SteveQ smquandt@ wrote: > > > > > > From: SteveQ smquandt@ > > > Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Another Bird fire > > > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com > > > Date: Thursday, November 26, 2009, 8:27 PM > > > > > > Ron, Ernie > > > > > > Are you refering to the house batteries or the three engine > > > batteries when you say main battery bank? I looked at everything > > > after Randy's fire but will give it another CLOSER look when I get > > > back to Texas next month. > > > > > > Steve Quandt > > > 1993 PT-40 > > > Cold in Iron Mountain, Mi > > > Coach enjoying warm weather in Marble Falls TX > > > > > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@ yahoogroups. com, "ronmarabito2002" > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Sorry to hear of the loss of anyones coach. I warned the forum > > > after mine to check these cables and apparently it just went right > > > by everyone. What a shame. I sure hope everyone gets out there and > > > checks these cables now. > > > > > > > > R.E. (Ron) Marabito, Dallas, TX 92WB40 > > > > > > > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@ yahoogroups. com, "Ernie E" > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I am wondering, since there have been 3 fires with the 90s > > > coaches, that if the battery cables are being chaffed behind the > > > main battery bank. Since the coaches involved were 92, 94 and 95 > > > models, those with coaches of this era might want to check the > > > routing of these cables. > > > > > This is too much of a coincidence and may have taken these many > > > years to wear thru. > > > > > Fortunately, nobody in all 3 coaches were hurt. > > > > > Ernie- 83PT40 in New River, Az > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WanderlodgeForum/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WanderlodgeForum/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: WanderlodgeForum-digest@yahoogroups.com WanderlodgeForum-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: WanderlodgeForum-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! 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