Pricey repairs

[ronmarabito2002]

Unfortunately on that $3500 brake repair. You were ripped off.
Probably nothing buy an air leak and the emergency brakes set. You
should have gotten an entire brake job.

R.E. (Ron) Marabito, Dallas, TX 92WB40




--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Jack & Donna Smith"
wrote:
>
> ALL: Though I didn't plan it this way, I seem to be getting an
idea
> on the price of reparing a "Vintage" Coach.
> The first 'Mistake' was that we got it at a great price.. Then we
> took it to San Diego for a weekend. Brakes locked up and wouldnt
> move, so we took it to Holland Motors, feeling they knew something
> about Birds. They simply farmed the job out and hit us with a
$3500+
> bill. (Felt we were ripped off).
> Later that year, we drove it to Seattle, via Utah. Had to replace
a
> couple of chassis heater hoses along the way. In Grants Pass, we
> spent just under $2K to replace a cracked cylender head.
> The next spring, we replaced the refigerator, Shore Power cord, and
> receptical and re-upgraded to 50A. (someone had installed 30A
stuff)!
> Then we had some front end maintenance done, (rutine), and they
> discovered the brake wheel cylenders had to be replaced. More$$$.
> Now with the addition of new tires and carpet we should be done. I
> thank the members of the Board that have helped me so much.
> Oh, yeah, a few months after we got the coach we layed out #3K for
a
> paint job.
> Well, as Jeff Miller commented, "Pay Now Or Pay Later".
> A minor note: The latches on both closet doors and the barhroom
need
> replacment. Went down to the local marine supply store, and WOW,
$97
> each for these items.. Lowes must have something I can use!!!!
> West Marine makes Camp World look cheap!!
> Jack & Donna Smith
> 1973FC31
> SoCal
>
> ===================================================================
>
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Tom Warner
wrote:
> >
> > Mike this is scary.........you and I agree. I believe this
issue of
> > what it costs to upgrade and maintain an older Bluebird is very
> > important here, and for the most part misunderstood. Time after
time
> > I have seen people buy these older coaches and then are stunned
when
> > they get their first bill for redoing the brakes for instance.
One
> > fellow sent me an email off net asking if $3500 was out of line
for
> > replacing the front brakes, rear drums, S cams, brake shoes etc.
What
> > could I say? In my case I have been working on and off pretty
> > steadily for 4 years repairing and replacing parts and upgrading
my
> > 1982 FC35. Mike I believe you have spent even more money and
time on
> > yours havent you?
> >
> > The bottom line is if you want to have a reliable coach then
expect
> > to spend either some major time if you are mechanically
inclined, or
> > some major bucks to get a used one up to snuff and reliable when
> > travelling. For instance I have my generator control box out now
and
> > am completely rebuilding it. The ITS relay for it( should cost
about
> > $5.00 its so simple) costs $200.00 by the time I pay shipping
from
> > Kinsley Power a Kohler dealer.
> >
> > But there is good news for anyone buying an older Bluebird. Most
of
> > the parts are available from Bluebird, truck repair shops,
and/or
> > NAPA. And members on this forum will help with the information
you
> > need if you chose to do it yourself and are mechanically adept.
> >
> > tom
> > 1982 FC35
> > Vernon Center,NY
> >
> >
> > At 09:29 AM 10/20/2005, you wrote:
> > >yeah, mebbe, but you have to have "issues" to take on the
> > >stewardship of a vintage Wanderlodge.
> > >Most wannabes would be advised to buy a late model used type C,
more
> > >in sync with their "consumer mentality.
> > >In broad strokes: if you subscribe to "Consumer Reports", GET
OUTA
> HERE!!!!
> > >Mike Hohnstein
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Winston
> > > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > Sent: Thursday, October 20, 2005 8:18 AM
> > > Subject: RE: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Pricey repairs
> > >
> > >
> > > Scott, you might want to lay off the caffeine for awhile.
> > >
> > > -Winston
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _____
> > >
> > > From: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > [mailto:WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Scott
> > > Sent: Wednesday, October 19, 2005 11:37 PM
> > > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Pricey repairs
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Tom, your thoughts on the purchase of a coach are just a tad
off the
> > > mark! Sorry.. You own a coach that is almost 10yrs older than
> what he
> > > is looking at..and how long have you owned your coach..and
when was
> > > the last time you entered the buying market?? I think the
market has
> > > changed since then. For you to make that comment/conclusion
from the
> > > posts from Wallace and Mike is kinda wayyyy off base. You
have no
> > > clue the condition of that coach. I believe that he
(Wallace) is
> > > somewhat of a seasoned BB owner and certainly has a VERY
> > > QUALIFIED "consultant" with him to make that decision. Don't
you
> > > think they evaluated the price vs repairs..hence
value..Maybe just
> > > maybe..there were some "other" things and given they BOTH
have been
> > > around BB for years that they could make this decision?? As
you
> > > said "you have no idea what his standards are" ...it is not
always
> > > black and white..Price deduct all the "things" YOU expect to
be in
> > > order. Sheesh you don't even know what the price was...gimme
a
> > > break..and by the way "what exactly is a high standard"
seems like
> > > mebbe your level and someone elses may just be a little
> different. So
> > > please refrain...Actually are you screwing up the wannabes???
> > > hmmm...marketing vs engineering..the debate continues!!
> > >
> > > Scott B
> > > 86FC35
> > > SC
> > >
> > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Tom Warner

> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Wallace I have no idea what your standards are when
selecting a
> > > > coach. I suppose it depends a lot on how much of the
maintenance
> > > and
> > > > repair you are capable of doing. But I noticed that you
said there
> > > > were far to many problems including tires and batteries.
> Those two
> > > > items would not bother me in the least however I would
reduce the
> > > > price I would pay for the coach by the amount to replace
both of
> > > > those items. Same with other things that Ralph found.
> > > >
> > > > I would guess there are others on this forum that are
either
> > > > considering upgrading to a newer Bluebird or becoming
first time
> > > > buyers. I would not want them to get the impression that
anything
> > > > should be a show stopper when considering a coach. In my
case when
> > > > looking for a Bluebird I would not consider any coach that
had
> rust
> > > > on the chassis or body panels unless it was something that
my
> local
> > > > Bluebird school bus dealer could not repair at an
attractive
> price.
> > > >
> > > > Bottom line in my opinion is to get a coach that either
has been
> > > > maintained to a high standard or is offered at a price
where
> it can
> > > > be upgraded to that level.
> > > >
> > > > tom
> > > > 1982 FC35
> > > > Vernon Center,NY
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > At 09:29 PM 10/19/2005, you wrote:
> > > > >Mike, saw your post so thought I would add my 2 cents.
We (Ralph
> > > &
> > > > >I) looked at the 91 today and decided to pass. Won't
bore you
> > > with
> > > > >details, but far too many problems to correct including
new tires
> > > > >and probably batteries. Will keep the ear open for other
deals.
> > > > >Regards;
> > > > >Wallace & Faye Craig
> > > > >
> > > > >mbulriss <mbulriss@y...> wrote:
> > > > >Winston,
> > > > >
> > > > >Now that we see this, no wonder that owner scared you
with his
> > > tales
> > > > >of expensive repairs! Interesting sales strategy on his
part!
> > > > >
> > > > >As Scott and Ralph pointed out, we all need to be educated
> > > consumers
> > > > >and shop around if a quote seems to peg our BS sniffer
meter. I
> > > hope
> > > > >that first guy you ran into is still holding the rusty
exhaust
> > > > >pipe also!>
> > > > >
> > > > >Buddy Gregg service..... that explains a lot. I'll let
Ralph
> > > comment
> > > > >further on that when he gets back into town, but if
there's a way
> > > to
> > > > >make it expensive, Buddy's guys can do it. I asked them
to check
> > > for
> > > > >a suspected air bag leak in a specific bag. Their
response was
> > > > >$4,500-5,000 to replace all the air bags. They "wouldn't
just
> > > replace
> > > > >one bag". Of course they never bothered to evn look at it
either!
> > > > >Ralph freed up the sticky air valve for me at a Lone Star
> > > > >Birds rally with a $3 can of PB Blaster (I think it was).
An air
> > > > >dryer filter R&R at Buddy's was I think a $600 or 700
quote (3-4
> > > hours
> > > > >labor plus $100+ parts); versus the $32 filter and the
hour and a
> > > half
> > > > >I took to do it myself! I work slow.....
> > > > >
> > > > >Since the owner mentioned Cat, I will assume that the 91
in
> > > question
> > > > >was an SP model. Can't speak to that model specifically;
> maybe Hank
> > > > >or someone else can comment on the $1500 of labor to
change an
> > > > >alternator. I still can't fathom having to R&R the bumper
to
> get to
> > > > >the alternator, nor can I see it taking more than 2 hours
> total to
> > > get
> > > > >that done. Makes the PT Detroits seem much easier to work
on now!
> > > > >
> > > > >The comment about the Caterpiller shop having
to "fabricate tools
> > > > >because they do not generally work on Bluebirds and their
tools
> > > don't
> > > > >work" cracked me up. That's hilarious! Now I know
Harley's have
> > > some
> > > > >special "factory only" tools, but I've never found
anything
> on the
> > > > >Bird that wasn't readily available in my own set of "non-
> > > professional"
> > > > >tools, much less at a professional repair facility or
dealer
> shop.
> > > > >
> > > > >While the prior owner seems to have delighted in throwing
money
> > > away,
> > > > >you *can* find "competent" service facilities for more
reasonable
> > > > >prices. Some people only go to their auto dealers for oil
> changes.
> > > > >Some people enjoy bragging about how much things cost
them as
> > > > >a badge of their affulence. Most folks on these forums
are more
> > > > >concerned with doing things a little more economically,
and
> having
> > > it
> > > > >done right the first time.
> > > > >
> > > > >As was stated by several other members, you just have to
be a
> smart
> > > > >consumer and seek advice when you need it, before you
throw
> > > yourself
> > > > >to the wolves. I think the responses that you are seeing
here
> > > should
> > > > >indicate that there are other ways to be sure things are
fixed
> > > > >properly without just throwing $$$ at it with no
questions asked.
> > > > >Please don't be scared off by this one owner. I hope that
you are
> > > > >seeing by the responses here that the situation you have
here
> > > seems to
> > > > >be an anomoly rather than the rule.
> > > > >
> > > > >Also, before you buy, you might want to consider having
someone
> > > that
> > > > >really knows what they are doing, thoroughly check out the
> > > prospective
> > > > >Bird for you so that there are no expensive surprises.
> > > > >
> > > > >Good luck with your hunt!
> > > > >
> > > > >Mike Bulriss
> > > > >83 PT40 "Stagecoach" - For Sale
> > > > >91 PT40 "Texas Minivan"
> > > > >San Antonio, Texas
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, winston barrows
> > > > >
> > > > >wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > and re
> > > install is
> > > > >maybe 4 hours.>>
> > > > > > Hi, Ralph,
> > > > > > According to the owner, the book is three hours bumper
off and
> > > three
> > > > >hours bumper on for six hours. This is what he writes:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I took my unit to Buddy Gregg, in Knoxville TN for
service.
> > > $115.00
> > > > >per hour. the cost of parts will not be the shock. The
shock is
> > > > >getting something done, done right, and done to the high
> > > expectations
> > > > >that Bluebird owners possess. By way of example, shortly
after
> > > > >purchase, the fuel gauge went to "empty" even though it
was
> clearly
> > > > >full. Buddy Gregg traced the repair to the sensor located
at the
> > > top
> > > > >of the fuel tank. This is accessed through a door on the
floor of
> > > the
> > > > >coach, which was overlayed with 3/4 inch plywood and the
marble
> > > floor.
> > > > >the estimate to fix? $6-700, plus the $10.00 sending unit,
> but they
> > > > >could not replace the marble they would have to chisel
out of the
> > > > >floor. Everything in a Bluebird is like that. I asked
them to
> look
> > > at
> > > > >the alternator/battery system because the green dash light
> > > sometimes
> > > > >came on (which I now know is normal). They replaced the
> alternator.
> > > > >Cost of alternator (which I now do not believe had any
problems)
> > > $350;
> > > > >Cost of labor to replace alternator?
> > > > > > $1,500. why so expensive? because they had to take the
bumper
> > > off,
> > > > >and then take off all the belts and hoses in the engine.
three
> > > hours
> > > > >off, and three hours on ( that is just the labor for the
bumper).
> > > You
> > > > >don't even want to know what Caterpiller charges to look
at
> > > Bluebirds.
> > > > >Caterpiller likes dealing with businesses that own
tractors. Hell
> > > if
> > > > >you bill your tractor out for 2 or three hundred per hour,
> you can
> > > > >afford thousands to have a GED trained technician tell
you you
> > > need a
> > > > >fuel filter, and then hand you a bill for $2,000, (labor
at $130
> > > per
> > > > >hour) plus materials (a $75.00 filter which should have
been what
> > > was
> > > > >checked within the first hour). Of course, they have to
bill 2 to
> > > > >three hours to put paper on the floor of the coach so
they don't
> > > track
> > > > >in sludge, and then fabricate tools because they do not
generally
> > > work
> > > > >on Bluebirds and their tools don't work.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The original price you pay for a Bluebird doesn't
really
> matter
> > > > >much. It is the beginning of a process that is akin to
placing a
> > > > >vacuum cleaner on you wallet and watching the money
> dissapear. End
> > > of
> > > > >owner email text.
> > > > > > It seems to me that part of the responsibility of this
forum
> > > should
> > > > >be to educate folks on the scale of economy of Wanderlodge
> > > ownership.
> > > > >A lot of people think Buddy Gregg is a reputable
dealership
> and I'm
> > > > >not saying they aren't (especially since I've had no
experience
> > > with
> > > > >them). So my logic is if such a competent repair shop
costs so
> > > much,
> > > > >then what's it going to cost to go to the guy you'll
educate?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > "Ralph L. Fullenwider" wrote:
> > > > > > Hello Winston:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Mike B gave you some pretty good answers to your
question. And
> > > yes,
> > > > >some
> > > > > > repairs can be costly, no question there. Blow a 12R
22.5 tire
> > > and
> > > > >wheel
> > > > > > wells along with various other damage can occur.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > As to the pricey alternator job, I agree it was pricey
but
> > > > >necessary? Even
> > > > > > removing the bumper the un install and re install is
maybe 4
> > > hours.
> > > > >Perhaps
> > > > > > something else happened, like a broken bolt that had
to be
> > > drilled out.
> > > > > > More than likely they 2 tech's on the job and charged
for each
> > > > >tech.? That
> > > > > > is not right either, in my book. It would be
interesting
> to have
> > > > >seen that
> > > > > > bill and what the write up was. No I am not defending
that
> > > shop, in
> > > > >fact I
> > > > > > would be dubious of it.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Part of what this and other Forums were started for
was to
> help
> > > one
> > > > >another
> > > > > > as we can and also to list the "known" good shops
around the
> > > Country to
> > > > > > take the birds to and then on the other hand, to know
what
> > > shops not to
> > > > > > take them to. This Forum is intended to be a clearing
house of
> > > seeking
> > > > > > answers to problems and so forth. Even if your not
doing the
> > > repair
> > > > >work <
> > > > > > which, as Mike pointed out, will save one some money>
one can
> > > come
> > > > >to the
> > > > > > forum's to try to get a better idea of what to expect
when
> > > taking a
> > > > >Coach
> > > > > > to a shop. Information among us, is a powerful tool,
and one
> > > that
> > > > >can help
> > > > > > you recognize if that shop or repair facility is
running high
> > > on costs.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Repairs on Birds, Prevost, Newell or any high line
Coach will
> > > > >usually run
> > > > > > higher in some respects as they are far advanced
machines with
> > > more
> > > > > > amenities than most others. With that advancement,
comes the
> > > fact
> > > > >that a
> > > > > > tech has spent many an hour just learning the how the
systems
> > > work and
> > > > > > those systems change almost daily at times. So yes,
shops do
> > > ask for a
> > > > > > higher wage and get it because we are way past bailing
> wire and
> > > stickum.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > In my shop, I charge the $75.00 per hour plus parts
rate and I
> > > work on
> > > > > > Birds. Though, as Mike told you, I have worked on
Vectra's and
> > > > >bounders and
> > > > > > Fleetwood products at the same price. I am also one
tech that
> > > > >prefers the
> > > > > > customer to be with me, if he/she so chooses as I am
> working on
> > > > >their coach.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Bottom line is, information, data, questions and
answers
> on the
> > > > >forum gives
> > > > > > anyone a powerful tool, and most of us have learned to
use it
> > > along
> > > > >with
> > > > > > learning to do some things by our on hand. And in
truth,
> most of
> > > > >those that
> > > > > > do some of the work, learns the systems in them, end up
> having a
> > > > >greater
> > > > > > sense of Ownership and the resultant pride that goes
with.
> > > There is
> > > > >nothing
> > > > > > wrong with Birds and you won't find a better coach for
not
> only
> > > fun
> > > > >but
> > > > > > safety out on the road.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Safe travels,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Ralph and Charolette Fullenwider
> > > > > > Ralph's RV Solutions, Duncan, Oklahoma
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > >
> >
>
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