Cost of ownership

[gcyeaw]

Tom,
I can do the mechanics within reason. I actually went to school
for auto mechanics back in the 60's. I spent two years in class
learning from spark plugs to automatic transmissions. I could put
Chevy 4-speed manual together blindfolded (the final test in one
course). Several years after graduating I switched careers and went
to work for IBM. So now I could do mechanical, hydraulic, and
electrical system repair (older IBM printers used hydraulic systems
to move the paper). Then I moved into telecommunications and wound
up working for UPS in network design.

The only problem is that I got a little older and a little less
flexable. Reaching into those tough places, and actually getting my
eyes to focus at the same time is becoming progressivly more
difficult. I have to be realistic and figure that over the years I
will need to rely more and more on others to do the work, and thus
incur higher costs.

But I still love the Wanterlodges and am motiveted to take over
the care of one. I just need to do the math and get my DW to buy in.

Gardner




--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Tom Warner
wrote:
>
> Gardner dont get discouraged. But you do need to ask the "right"
> questions if you hope to get a Bluebird that will suite you.
> First can you do the majority of the work on the coach yourself ?
If
> you understand the mechanics such as brakes, chassis, engines etc
> then you are a long way to doing it. Do you have the tools and
space
> to work in? Can you use a multimeter and read factory blueprints
that
> are available for all Bluebirds? If you can answer yes to these
> questions then I would advise you to jump in and buy one for they
are
> not as complicated as some would have you believe. I would look
for a
> rust free southern coach that has not been butchered by
inexperienced
> maintenance. Just make sure you get someone that understands
> Bluebirds and not only can work on them but can evaluate the
various
> systems on the coach with you. Mechanics can give you advise on
the
> engine and transmission but most of them are lost when it comes to
> the other systems of a motorhome. One thing is in your favor now,
> there are lots of bluebirds for sale and its a buyers market. Cash
talks!!!
> Tom Warner
> Vernon Center,NY
> 1985 PT 40
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> At 11:09 PM 7/8/2006, you wrote:
>
> >Leroy,
> >I am at the stage where I must rent a motorhome and 'see if we
> >like it'. This is a tough sell because the first trip is almost
sure
> >to be a disaster unless I do a tremendous amount of homework and
> >pick the right campgrounds and the right MH etc.etc. Too bad there
> >aren't any Bluebirds on the rental scene.
> >Gardner
> >
> >--- In
> > 40yahoogroups.com>WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com,
> >"jwasnewski"
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > -Yes sir I understand. I have been there. In my case the wife
was
> > > the driving force to buy a motor home. She didn't think I would
> >like
> > > it---for once she was wrong-----LOL > >please
> > > do not wake her up.
> > >
> > > Leroy Eckert
> > > 1990 WB-40
> > > Niceville, FL
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -- In
> > 40yahoogroups.com>WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com,
> > "gcyeaw" wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Leroy,
> > > > I have a lot of work to do before I can get the DW to weigh
in
> >on
> > > > the plan. Oh,I could probably go ahead and do it on my own,
but
> > > then
> > > > I would become a 'full timer", alone, with half my income.
> > > >
> > > > You know the old expression about divorce.
> > > > When you are married you get up in the morning, leave the
> >house
> > > > and kiss your wife good by.
> > > > When you get divorced, you get up in the morning, leave your
> > > wife
> > > > and kiss your house good by!
> > > >
> > > > Gardner
> > > > --- In
> > 40yahoogroups.com>WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com,
> > "Leroy Eckert"
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Well Gardner:
> > > > >
> > > > > Come on man, jump on in with the rest of us. You will be
happy
> > > you
> > > > purchased the ol school bus. Just look for the best physical
> > > > specimen before you buy.
> > > > >
> > > > > Side note----the wife wanted a Prevost. She said the
Bluebird
> > > > looked like a school bus. I said, you have traveled many a
> >mile
> > > in
> > > > a school bus and you are still here. Now---I cannot get her
out
> >of
> > > > the thing.
> > > > >
> > > > > You will love a Bird. It is a lifestyle.
> > > > >
> > > > > Leroy Eckert
> > > > > 1990 WB-40
> > > > > Niceville, FL
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > From: gcyeaw
> > > > > To:
> > 40yahoogroups.com>WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > Sent: Saturday, July 08, 2006 7:47 PM
> > > > > Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Cost of ownership
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Mike, Leroy, I can't disagree that if all I wanted was an
> >RV,
> > > > then
> > > > > buying a new or slightly used motorhome would be the way to
> >go.
> > > > When
> > > > > I saw an older Bluebird, it just looked so great. It was a
> >true
> > > > > classic with character and that is the attraction. It
> >certainly
> > > > > isn't the wisest investment if all you look at is the
> >dollars.
> > > > There
> > > > > has to be a return in the enjoyment and satisfaction of
> >caring
> > > > for
> > > > > and reviving such a machine.
> > > > >
> > > > > The reason I ask questions is to make sure I am going in
> >with
> > > my
> > > > > eyes wide open. The more I learn the better I will be able
> >to
> > > > make a
> > > > > wise choice when purchasing. And along the way I am meeting
> >new
> > > > > poeple on the forum, so it's already showing some reward.
> > > > >
> > > > > Gardner
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In
> > 40yahoogroups.com>WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com,
> > "Leroy Eckert"
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Mike:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I agree with you. When we purchased our bird we planned
> >for
> > > > > deferred maintenance. I guess if we knew the costs of
owning
> > > > these
> > > > > beautiful machines up front we could become consultants and
> > > > charge
> > > > > $200.00/hr. Then we could be sued for misrepresentation.
> >It's a
> > > > > crazy world.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Leroy Eckert
> > > > > > 1990 WB-40
> > > > > > Niceville, FL
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > From: Mike Hohnstein
> > > > > > To:
> > 40yahoogroups.com>WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > > Sent: Saturday, July 08, 2006 12:49 PM
> > > > > > Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Cost of ownership
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Uh, you sure a new class C wouldn't be a better choice?
> > > Trying
> > > > > to see the future with an antique vehicle is very
irrational.
> > > > > > MH
> > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > From: gcyeaw
> > > > > > To:
> > 40yahoogroups.com>WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > > Sent: Saturday, July 08, 2006 11:54 AM
> > > > > > Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Cost of ownership
> > > > > >
> > > > > > James,
> > > > > > Thanks for your data. There seems to be some controversy
> >over
> > > > > the
> > > > > > level 2 maintenance cost, but based on an average speed
of
> > > say
> > > > > 30
> > > > > > mph, that's 60,000 miles in 2000 hours. So if it's $800
or
> > > > $1200
> > > > > > it's not much different spread out over that
mileage/time.
> > > Not
> > > > > > knowing the cost of adding a swing radiator, it would
seem
> >to
> > > > > pay
> > > > > > for itself on the first broken belt or hose. I imagine
> >that
> > > > > removing
> > > > > > the dog house and putting down a protective runner before
> > > > > heading in
> > > > > > for service might also save some labor and probably
please
> > > the
> > > > > > service tech as well.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- In
> > 40yahoogroups.com>WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com,
> >"orbitalsolutions"
> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Gardner, here are some actual maintence costs for the
> >model
> > > > > > of 'Bird
> > > > > > > that you are looking for.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > If you take the 'Bird to an authorized Cat Center for
> >oil
> > > > and
> > > > > > filter
> > > > > > > changes it will cost $280.00 -- This will include all
of
> > > > your
> > > > > oil
> > > > > > > and fuel filters, a complete chassie lube and Cat brand
> > > > motor
> > > > > > oil.
> > > > > > > Of course they do all the work, you watch them and
start
> > > the
> > > > > bus
> > > > > > > when needed.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Here are the parts cost:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 16 Qts. 15/40 Cat -- $34.40
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 2 - 1R-0713 -------- $11.20
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 1 - 1P-0808 -------- $2.46
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 1 - 1R-0750 -------- $11.88
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 1 - 8N9803 --------- $20.10
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Total parts cost is $80.04 -- so, you can save two
> >hundered
> > > > > bucks
> > > > > > > here if you do it yourself. This is a once a year task
> >for
> > > > > most
> > > > > > > folks.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Tires, every five years between $2200 and $3000
> >depending
> > > on
> > > > > Tire
> > > > > > > Brand.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Cat PM level 2 Maintainence -- every 2000 hours or
> >10.000
> > > > > gallons
> > > > > > of
> > > > > > > fuel -- Costs $790 at a certified Cat Center and
> >includes
> > > > > > > everything. This service also includes the above listed
> > > oil,
> > > > > > filter
> > > > > > > and lube service.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 1) All new hoses and belts
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 2) Performance Analysis report
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 3) Steam clean engine
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 4) Valve lash adjustment
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > 5) cooling system service (flush and clean)
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > That is pretty much your ongoing maintenience stuff.
You
> > > can
> > > > > also
> > > > > > > figure on a transmission service every thirty thousand
> > > miles
> > > > > with
> > > > > > a
> > > > > > > new filter and fluid for about $175.00 including labor.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > That's the stuff you can count on doing and what it
> > > actually
> > > > > > costs.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hope this helps.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > James
> > > > > > > 78FC33SB "Old School"
> > > > > > > Orange Lake, FL
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --- In
> > 40yahoogroups.com>WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com,
> >"orbitalsolutions"
> > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Hello, Gardner.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > The biggest factor in the cost of ownership of a 25
> >year
> > > > > old, or
> > > > > > > > older 'Bird, lies in the condition of the bus that
you
> > > buy.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Remember we are talking about older buses here and no
> >two
> > > > > are
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > same. You will find "project buses" on the market
that
> > > may
> > > > > need
> > > > > > > > everything replaced on them from the motor and
> > > electronics
> > > > > to
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > fridge and carpet ect. However, from time to time, a
> >very
> > > > > nice
> > > > > > > > highly updated example will be offered for sale that
> >will
> > > > > need
> > > > > > > next
> > > > > > > > to nothing.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Obviously the cost of ownership will be much higher
on
> > > > > > a "project
> > > > > > > > bus" than on a Cheery example with newer motor and
> > > > > everything
> > > > > > else
> > > > > > > > in the bus having been already updated and in good
> > > working
> > > > > order.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I guess my point is to buy your bus wisely! The
> >project
> > > > bus
> > > > > at
> > > > > > a
> > > > > > > > rock bottom price that needs everying replaced will
> >not
> > > be
> > > > > your
> > > > > > > best
> > > > > > > > value. Rather, find a bus that has had on-going care
> >by
> > > > > folks
> > > > > > who
> > > > > > > > were enthusiastic owners.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Take my bus for example ... the motor is about 4
years
> > > old
> > > > > with
> > > > > > > > 15,000 miles on it. At the time the motor was
replaced
> >so
> > > > > were
> > > > > > > all
> > > > > > > > pumps, fan assembly even the main started motor. All
> > > belts
> > > > > and
> > > > > > > > hoses are two years old. Trojan batteries less than a
> > > year
> > > > > > old.
> > > > > > > > Twin 55 amp Iota charges less than a year old.
Xantrex
> > > > pure
> > > > > > sine-
> > > > > > > > wave inverter less than a year old. High deffenition
> > > > Direct
> > > > > TV
> > > > > > > > system less than a yera old. 27" Samsung LCD TV less
> >than
> > > > a
> > > > > > year
> > > > > > > > old. Refridgerator about 4 years old. AC units about
3
> > > > years
> > > > > > > old.
> > > > > > > > Roof deck rebedded, refastened and painted less than
a
> > > > year
> > > > > > ago.
> > > > > > > > Polished Aluminum wheels that you can comb your hair
> >in.
> > > > New
> > > > > > > carpet
> > > > > > > > about 2 years ago. I could go on and on, but you get
> >my
> > > > > point.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > If I were to sell my bus tomorrow I could get around
> >25
> > > to
> > > > > 27
> > > > > > > > thousand.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Now think about that "project bus" that has been
> >sitting
> > > > > behind
> > > > > > a
> > > > > > > > barn for 8 years before someone pulled it out,
> >polished
> > > it
> > > > > up
> > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > hung a for sale sign on it. These are two very
> >different
> > > > > > pictures
> > > > > > > > arn't they? Certainly you would experience a very
> > > > different
> > > > > > cost
> > > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > ownewship betweeen the above examples. Now you may be
> > > able
> > > > > to
> > > > > > buy
> > > > > > > > the project bus for 16 thousand bucks, but get ready
> >to
> > > > > spend
> > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > much again, and more, to make it into a good looking
> > > > > reliable
> > > > > > > runner.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > So shop wisely, and buy the best bus you can find in
> >your
> > > > > price
> > > > > > > > range.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Good Luck.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > James
> > > > > > > > 78FC33SB "Old School"
> > > > > > > > Orange Lake, FL (Mid-Eightys, total over cast and
> >raining)
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > --- In
> > 40yahoogroups.com>WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com,
> > "gcyeaw"
> > > >
> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I have asked other questions on this forum and I do
> > > > > > appreciate
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > responses I have received. I have been building a
> > > > > spreadsheet
> > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > try
> > > > > > > > > to estimate the real cost of owning a vintage
> >Bluebird.
> > > > I
> > > > > love
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > look and would enjoy repairing/restoring the
systems
> >at
> > > > my
> > > > > > > leisure
> > > > > > > > > prior to retirement.
> > > > > > > > > The price range I am looking at is under $30,000
for
> >a
> > > > > 1984
> > > > > > > or
> > > > > > > > > older FC 33 TO 35. Given that price range I would
> > > expect
> > > > > to
> > > > > > have
> > > > > > > > > lots of small things to fix. Also given the age, I
> > > would
> > > > > > expect
> > > > > > > > > higher incidence of failure in in basic
> >engine/transmit
> > > > > > > > ion/chassis
> > > > > > > > > systems over say, a 10 year time span..
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Would it be reasonable to estimate $700/year for
> > > routine
> > > > > > > > > maintenance and $1000/year for unplanned
maintenance
> > > > > averaged
> > > > > > > over
> > > > > > > > a
> > > > > > > > > ten year time span? (assuming I don't need an
engine
> > > > > rebuild)
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I am really trying to determine the value as the
> >clock
> > > > > > ticks
> > > > > > > on
> > > > > > > > > 20 to 25 year old coaches. They may be well built,
> >but
> > > > so
> > > > > was
> > > > > > I
> > > > > > > 40
> > > > > > > > > years ago!
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Gardner
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
>