30 AMP OPS

[Gregory OConnor]

Pete, use care in setting up the 30 amp 220. I would use a 50 amp 220
receptacle and mark it "will trip at 29 amps ." 30 amp cords are set
up for single leg. and 50 amps are set up for double. In the RV
industry 50 amp means double leg and 30 amp means single leg. your
30 amp breaker is just a responsible way to hook up a double leg run
with 100 foot extension cords. There is never any danger in tripping
a breaker. The danger is allowing too many amps to be drawn through
undersized or over lengthen wires.

To trip a 50 amp breaker you can draw 51 amps off one leg or 25 and
26 amps on a set. With your 30 amp 220 breaker at the house you have
30 amp available on each leg but not at the same time.

Even if you can hook both legs of the coach up to a pedestal at a
park, the park receptacles must be on different legs for you to get
220 in the coach for ac and such. Cheaters tie both sides of the
coach panel together into a common leg. You end up with twice the
risk of tripping a breaker. 220 appliances that get turned on may
act like a cheater as current may flow around the windings and or
rheostats. Cheaters may cause problems that could be where they get
the name
Gregory O'Connor
cheater
94ptRomolandCa

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete Masterson
wrote:
>
> I guess my coach (being "newer") has evolved. It only has a 50 amp
> connector. Everything else is reached by adaptors on the 50 amp
> connector.
>
> At my home, I actually have 220 v 30amps available ... but I had
to
> use 100' of extension cable to reach the coach and I bought two
50'
> 30 amp cables (and a matching receptacle) ...not realizing that
they
> were only 110v until I started to wire it up (and ended up with an
> "extra" wire). (Hey, I don't do that much wiring.)
>
> Had I realized, I'd have purchased 50 amp extensions and wired for
> 220 ... knowing that the outlet had a 30 amp breaker instead of
50.
> (If only I could park the coach closer to the house!)
>
> Still, the primary (and only) connection powers the leg with the
> charger when 30 amp 110 v is all that's available.
>
> So, my question is: Can the "cheater cable" actually work with a
50
> amp connection to get power to both legs? In a couple of parks
that
> didn't have 50 amps, it seemed that I could connect to 30 and 20
(or
> 15)? Would that work?
>
> Pete Masterson
> aeonix1@...
> '95 Bluebird Wanderlodge WBDA 4203
> El Sobrante, CA
>
>
>
>
> On Aug 12, 2006, at 5:21 AM, Tom Warner wrote:
>
> > All wanderlodges that I have seen have one 50 amp plug and two 30
amp
> > plugs. The 50 amp plug serves both leg one and leg two (with the
main
> > switch set to shore 50). One 30 amp plug serves the drivers side
of
> > the coach and the other 30 amp plug serves the passenger side
(with
> > the main switch set to shore 30). On the forward controls the
drivers
> > side 30 amp plug serves the chargers and on the PTs the passenger
> > side plug serves the chargers. To ensure that you can charge
using 30
> > amps just make sure you are plugged into the correct 30 amp plug.
> >
> > Tom warner
> > vernon center,ny
> > 1985 PT 40
> >
> >
> > At 06:31 AM 8/12/2006, you wrote:
> >> Leroy,
> >> On my 86 PT40 I have on the outside of coach one 50 amp connector
> >> and two 30 amp connectors one 30 amp connector for leg one and
one
> >> thirty amp connector for leg two
> >> Howard Truitt Camilla, Ga. 86 PT40
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: jwasnewski
> >> To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> >> Sent: Friday, August 11, 2006 6:14 PM
> >> Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] 30 AMP OPS
> >>
> >>
> >> Recently I stopped overnight and had to use 30amp park power.
I
> >> carry
> >> a cable for that purpose but have never used it. 30amp gave
me
> >> leg two
> >> in the coach but did not go through the Trace inverter to
charge
> >> the
> >> batteries. Looked at my diagrams with no luck. I may need to
get a
> >> 50amp female recepticle for the end of my 30amp cord, plug it
> >> into the
> >> normal 50amp line and see what happens. Doesn't make sense
that the
> >> factory 30amp bus connection does not charge the batteries. Is
this
> >> normal?
> >>
> >> Leroy Eckert
> >> 1990WB40
> >> Niceville, FL
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -----------------------------------------------------------------
----
> >> ---------
> >>
> >>
> >> No virus found in this incoming message.
> >> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> >> Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.10.9/416 - Release
Date:
> >> 8/10/2006
> >>
> >>
> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Yahoo! Groups Links
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

[Pete Masterson]

Gregory,

I followed your explanation except for the part quoted below. The 30
amp 220 circuit in my home that I "stole" for the coach originally
served an electric stove (or oven, I forget which -- we converted the
house stove to natural gas). So what I don't understand is why the 30
amps available would be only on one leg or the other but not both?
The circuit is served by two breakers (switches tied together with a
metal bar) and wired with a red, black, white and green wire. White
is neutral, green is ground, I thought the black and red were each a
30 amp "leg" of the circuit -- or am I missing something. (I'm not an
electrician, so "three phase" wiring isn't my area of clear
understanding.)

As for the cheater cable idea, it sounds like it's likely more
trouble than it's worth. My coach is "all electric" (no LP gas), so
when I've been in a park with 30 amp power, I've unplugged and turned
on the generator to use the cook top -- figured I'd blow the 30 amp
circuit otherwise. (It is a little inconvenient.) It might have been
nice to use the cheater to create enough power for the cook top, but
I'd guess that the 30 amp and 15/20 amp circuits use the same leg
(black or red) from the park power supply, and therefore wouldn't
gain me anything (but a headache and possibly an upset park owner).

Pete Masterson
aeonix1@...
'95 Bluebird Wanderlodge WBDA 4203
El Sobrante, CA




On Aug 12, 2006, at 7:18 PM, Gregory OConnor wrote:

> <snip>
>
> To trip a 50 amp breaker you can draw 51 amps off one leg or 25 and
> 26 amps on a set. With your 30 amp 220 breaker at the house you have
> 30 amp available on each leg but not at the same time.
> <snip>

> Gregory O'Connor
> cheater
> 94ptRomolandCa
<snip>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Gregory OConnor]

Pete, "With your 30 amp 220 breaker at the house you have 30 amp
available on each leg (red , Black) but not at the same time. " you
can draw 30 amps through that breaker total. ie; '30 on one leg and
zero on the other' or '15 and 15'. or run a total of 30 X 110 =
3,300 watts. By design the breaker will trip if you draw more than
30 amps in any combination. You could simply replace the breaker
with a 50 amp if you have proper rated wire leading up to the bus.
Nothing wrong with leaving it 30 and managing the watt/ amp usage in
the bus.

I wonder if there is a way to hook into 110 30 amp and use the
inverter to make the other leg for the cooktop?


If you hook into 110 30A and turn on the cooktop, I wonder if the
electricity will pass to appliances on the other leg? I have seen
this happen, the cooktop rehostat became a light dimmer for lights on
the dead leg.

My electrical certification is limited to a merit badge and education
I credited to a 'how to do it book'. Titled "Don't be shocked by the
shorts"

Gregory O'Connor
94ptRomolandCa
Eagle'74
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete Masterson
wrote:
>
> Gregory,
>
> I followed your explanation except for the part quoted below. The
30
> amp 220 circuit in my home that I "stole" for the coach originally
> served an electric stove (or oven, I forget which -- we converted
the
> house stove to natural gas). So what I don't understand is why the
30
> amps available would be only on one leg or the other but not both?
> The circuit is served by two breakers (switches tied together with
a
> metal bar) and wired with a red, black, white and green wire.
White
> is neutral, green is ground, I thought the black and red were each
a
> 30 amp "leg" of the circuit -- or am I missing something. (I'm not
an
> electrician, so "three phase" wiring isn't my area of clear

[Gardner Yeaw]

Pete,
I agree that for any equipment and particularly equipment with motors it
is unwise to switch power sources without turning the device off,
particularly air conditioners. I also doubt that it is good for the
generator to suddenly hit it with a full load of air conditioners, etc. It
is safer and better for your expensive toys to shut them off before
switching power.

Gardner
78FC33
-----Original Message-----
From: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Pete Masterson
Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 3:47 PM
To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: 30 AMP OPS

John,

Thanks... My non-coach life has revolved around delicate computer
equipment, so I'm leery of switching power when devices are drawing
much (or any) current. At one point in my career, I 'supervised' a
computer that was so twitchy that just running a finger over the
breaker serving its circuit would cause it to go berserk -- since the
company's maintenance electricians had a habit of running their
fingers along the breakers to find one that was tripped, I had to
label "my" breaker with a "danger -- do not touch" label to avoid
unexpected shut downs.

It's good to know that the 'bird is rigged to consider the generator
as primary power source --- but for my own paranoia, I'll probably
still pull the breaker on the shore power before lighting the
generator just the same. Nice to know that there is likely safety
protocols that will prevent damage should I forget...

Pete Masterson
aeonix1@...
'95 Bluebird Wanderlodge WBDA 4203
El Sobrante, CA

On Aug 13, 2006, at 6:02 AM, John Suter wrote:

> Hi Pete,
>
> I wanted to address the following for you:
>
>> when I've been in a park with 30 amp power, I've
>> unplugged and turned
>> on the generator to use the cook top -- figured I'd
>> blow the 30 amp
>> circuit otherwise.
>
> Generally speaking, most Birds are electrically
> designed so the generator is the primary source of
> power. Therefore, after the generator is started and
> completes its warm-up and test cycles (and, for Birds
> so equipped, the additional tests by the generator
> controller (WestHaver GenCon)), the shore power
> connection is internally disconnected by the transfer
> switch (in some Birds you can hear the transfer switch
> humming in the kitchen sink area, or hear it
> snap/clunk when switching) in favor of the generator
> power source. When the generator is shut down, the
> power source automatically reverts to shore power, (or
> inverter, if no shore power is available). Therefore,
> in the future, you needn't disconnect at the pedestal
> to start/stop the generator; although, it is always a
> good idea not to switch among power sources while
> drawing heavy amperages to avoid burning/pitting the
> electrical contacts. Manual transfer switch Birds, as
> well. Best to reduce the load first (shut off A/C's,
> microwave oven, etc.) - If your coach has 12V
> electronic gear, such as in-motion sat, and DOES NOT
> have a separate 12V power supply (which we've
> recommended adding ad-nauseum here on the Forum), I'd
> also strongly recommend shutting those sensitive
> electronics down momentarily while switching power
> sources.
>
> John Suter

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[John Suter]

Hi Pete,

I wanted to address the following for you:

> when I've been in a park with 30 amp power, I've
> unplugged and turned
> on the generator to use the cook top -- figured I'd
> blow the 30 amp
> circuit otherwise.

Generally speaking, most Birds are electrically
designed so the generator is the primary source of
power. Therefore, after the generator is started and
completes its warm-up and test cycles (and, for Birds
so equipped, the additional tests by the generator
controller (WestHaver GenCon)), the shore power
connection is internally disconnected by the transfer
switch (in some Birds you can hear the transfer switch
humming in the kitchen sink area, or hear it
snap/clunk when switching) in favor of the generator
power source. When the generator is shut down, the
power source automatically reverts to shore power, (or
inverter, if no shore power is available). Therefore,
in the future, you needn't disconnect at the pedestal
to start/stop the generator; although, it is always a
good idea not to switch among power sources while
drawing heavy amperages to avoid burning/pitting the
electrical contacts. Manual transfer switch Birds, as
well. Best to reduce the load first (shut off A/C's,
microwave oven, etc.) - If your coach has 12V
electronic gear, such as in-motion sat, and DOES NOT
have a separate 12V power supply (which we've
recommended adding ad-nauseum here on the Forum), I'd
also strongly recommend shutting those sensitive
electronics down momentarily while switching power
sources.

John Suter



--- Pete Masterson wrote:

> Gregory,
>
> I followed your explanation except for the part
> quoted below. The 30
> amp 220 circuit in my home that I "stole" for the
> coach originally
> served an electric stove (or oven, I forget which --
> we converted the
> house stove to natural gas). So what I don't
> understand is why the 30
> amps available would be only on one leg or the other
> but not both?
> The circuit is served by two breakers (switches tied
> together with a
> metal bar) and wired with a red, black, white and
> green wire. White
> is neutral, green is ground, I thought the black and
> red were each a
> 30 amp "leg" of the circuit -- or am I missing
> something. (I'm not an
> electrician, so "three phase" wiring isn't my area
> of clear
> understanding.)
>
> As for the cheater cable idea, it sounds like it's
> likely more
> trouble than it's worth. My coach is "all electric"
> (no LP gas), so
> when I've been in a park with 30 amp power, I've
> unplugged and turned
> on the generator to use the cook top -- figured I'd
> blow the 30 amp
> circuit otherwise. (It is a little inconvenient.) It
> might have been
> nice to use the cheater to create enough power for
> the cook top, but
> I'd guess that the 30 amp and 15/20 amp circuits use
> the same leg
> (black or red) from the park power supply, and
> therefore wouldn't
> gain me anything (but a headache and possibly an
> upset park owner).
>
> Pete Masterson
> aeonix1@...
> '95 Bluebird Wanderlodge WBDA 4203
> El Sobrante, CA
>
>
>
>
> On Aug 12, 2006, at 7:18 PM, Gregory OConnor wrote:
>
> > <snip>
> >
> > To trip a 50 amp breaker you can draw 51 amps off
> one leg or 25 and
> > 26 amps on a set. With your 30 amp 220 breaker at
> the house you have
> > 30 amp available on each leg but not at the same
> time.
> > <snip>
>
> > Gregory O'Connor
> > cheater
> > 94ptRomolandCa
> <snip>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been
> removed]
>
>



__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

[John Suter]

Hi Gregory,

It is not a good idea to try to mix and match dual
power sources, as in the following:

> I wonder if there is a way to hook into 110 30 amp
> and use the
> inverter to make the other leg for the cooktop?

These type connections (especially in motorhome type
applications where the grounding is minimal at best
and degrades with age) are prone to back-feeding where
a source of power can pass through an appliance
(without activating it, which would visually notify
the user) and continue on to another location where
someone might come in contact and become injured.

Simply said, don't mix and match sources unless you
are an accomplished electrician, and then label
everything so workman will also know what has been
done.

Not to belabor the point, but to provide an example
of the "lack of visual clues" some Forum folks may not
be aware of.

Typically, the 110V light over the table uses a
"dimmer" switch. In the "maximum dim" position, the
light will not illuminate. Yet, should one come in
contact with the hot wire of the light fixture, a
nasty/possibly fatal surprise awaits. 110V is
present. The dimmer has simply temporarily reduced
the amperage below the amount required for
illumination, but the 110 volt "electrical potential"
is fully available, just like a duplex (plug-in) wall
socket.

John Suter


--- Gregory OConnor wrote:

> Pete, "With your 30 amp 220 breaker at the house you
> have 30 amp
> available on each leg (red , Black) but not at the
> same time. " you
> can draw 30 amps through that breaker total. ie; '30
> on one leg and
> zero on the other' or '15 and 15'. or run a total
> of 30 X 110 =
> 3,300 watts. By design the breaker will trip if you
> draw more than
> 30 amps in any combination. You could simply
> replace the breaker
> with a 50 amp if you have proper rated wire leading
> up to the bus.
> Nothing wrong with leaving it 30 and managing the
> watt/ amp usage in
> the bus.
>
> I wonder if there is a way to hook into 110 30 amp
> and use the
> inverter to make the other leg for the cooktop?
>
>
> If you hook into 110 30A and turn on the cooktop, I
> wonder if the
> electricity will pass to appliances on the other
> leg? I have seen
> this happen, the cooktop rehostat became a light
> dimmer for lights on
> the dead leg.
>
> My electrical certification is limited to a merit
> badge and education
> I credited to a 'how to do it book'. Titled "Don't
> be shocked by the
> shorts"
>
> Gregory O'Connor
> 94ptRomolandCa
> Eagle'74
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete
> Masterson
> wrote:
> >
> > Gregory,
> >
> > I followed your explanation except for the part
> quoted below. The
> 30
> > amp 220 circuit in my home that I "stole" for the
> coach originally
> > served an electric stove (or oven, I forget which
> -- we converted
> the
> > house stove to natural gas). So what I don't
> understand is why the
> 30
> > amps available would be only on one leg or the
> other but not both?
> > The circuit is served by two breakers (switches
> tied together with
> a
> > metal bar) and wired with a red, black, white and
> green wire.
> White
> > is neutral, green is ground, I thought the black
> and red were each
> a
> > 30 amp "leg" of the circuit -- or am I missing
> something. (I'm not
> an
> > electrician, so "three phase" wiring isn't my area
> of clear
>
>
>
>
>


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

[Wilhelmus Schreurs]

Hi all:

The wiring that we have in our homes and also in our BB is all single phase
wiring. Very rarly would one find 3 phase wiring other than in either a
commercial or industrial application.
We use single phase power, with two legs.


“with your 30amp 220 volt breaker at the house you have 30 amp available on
each leg (red,black) but not at the same time, you can draw 30 amps through that
breaker total. Ie: 30 on one leg and zero on the other, or 15 and 15, or run a
total of 30*110 =- 3300 watts. By design the breaker will trip if you draw more
than 30 amps in any combination.

This is false. In a 220 volt circuit, in which you have 2 legs, it is
possible to draw a total of 30 amps * 220 volts for a total of 6600 watts.
HOWEVER, each LEG is only designed to carry a total of 30 amps * 110 volts or
3300 watts., so if one leg is overloaded it will trip both breakers.

Pete: you mention about a cheater cable, well there are all sorts of types of
cheater cables, you need to know the type that you require.
Ie: if you have a cheater cable that you can connect into two 30 amp circuits
at a trailer park, it is possible to get 30 amps with 220 volts, or in other
words, if your stove is 220 volts you can use it. The problem here is, it might
be possible to have both 30 amps on the same leg, and this would give you 60
amps * 110 volts, but no 220 volts.
: Even if you can hook both legs of the coach up to a pedestal at a park, the
park receptacles must be on different legs for you to get 220 volt in the coach
for ac and such. Cheaters tie both sides of the coach panel together into a
common leg. You end up with twice the risk of tripping a breaker. 220 volt
applieances that get turned on may act like a cheater as current may flow around
the windings and or rheostants

As I mentioned above, cheaters can tie both sides of the coach panel together,
but it might not as well, this depends on the park receptacle if they are on
separate legs or not. I cannot understand the statement about “you end up with
twice the risk of tripping a breaker” as you have more power available to use.
Also maybe Greg can shed some light on where the current can flow around the
windings in some cases.

: to trip a 50 amp breaker you can draw 51 amps off one leg etc etc”.
The circuit breakers we have in our homes, and what we use in our BB, are
called “thermal breakers”. They trip with a function of heat, which is produced
by amperage. Different types of breakers can have a different curve
characteristic to them, ie: for a 50 amp breaker it might take 52 amps at 3 or
4 minutes to trip, 60 amps – 30 seconds, 75 amps instant. Other breaker could
be slower or faster.

: Typically, the 110 volt light over the table use a “dimmer” switch. In the
“maximum dim” position, the light will not illuminate. Yet, should one come in
contact with the hot wire of the light fixture, a nasty/possibility fatal
surprise awaits. 110v is present. The dimmer has simply temporarily reduced
the amperage below the amount required for illumination, but the 110 volt
“electrical potential” is fully available, just like a duplex (plug in) wall
socket.
John has a very good point here, and did you know that being unknowledgable
can really get you, or someone else killed

One main difference between our homes and our BB coaches is the ground/neutral
connection. In our homes, the ground and neutral are bonded together, and in
our coaches they are not. When you are tied into the power system, the bonding
will take place at the park receptacle. So when you are changing any of your
light switches or receptacles, pay particular attention that the ground and
neutral does not touch or get mixed up, if it does, the body/chassis of your
coach could become live.

Good point John: even as an accomplished and certified electrician, I would
not want to mix and match power sources either.

Pete: If you have 30 amps 110 volts coming into your coach, and you only want
to use one burner of your stove, assuming your stove burner is 110 volts, go for
it. You might have to reduce other loads on in the coach for the time you are
using the burner.

Gosh I love this electrical stuff.

Bill
84FC35SB
Terrace, BC




---------------------------------
Now you can have a huge leap forward in email: get the new Yahoo! Mail.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Pete Masterson]

My question was academic* rather than practical as the current set-up
is simply to keep the batteries charged and for incidental lighting
in the coach while at home -- which works just fine. My home's main
distribution panel is an obsolete model that requires dreadfully
expensive breakers ($30 to $50 _each_), so I have no desire to
upgrade them as we're about to put the house on the market --- and
move into the coach full time. Besides, I wired the circuit for 30
amps and I'd have to pull new wire to increase to 50. (I was
reserving the circuit for a possible AC unit in the future. Weather
in our area rarely requires significant cooling, so we only have a
couple of small ACs through the wall into two bedrooms -- a third,
larger AC unit would round out the cooling in the living/dining
area.... This is something that a new owner can undertake, should
they so desire.)

I was considering the possibilities (using a cheater cord) of getting
a little more current at an RV park that only had 30 amp service ---
but my current practice of disconnecting shore power and running the
generator for cooking meals (all-electric coach) seems to be the
better approach in those circumstances -- rather than run the risk of
putting a section of an RV park into the dark with blown circuits.

I appreciate the information. (Admittedly, over the years I've been
'spoiled' by having a brother-in-law (now deceased) who was a
maintenance electrician at a large military facility assist with some
wiring issues, so my education in such matters has been limited.)

*"electricity" wasn't one of my merit badges. Probably would have
been more useful as my "fingerprinting" merit badge has been of
little use over the years!

Pete Masterson
aeonix1@...
'95 Bluebird Wanderlodge WBDA 4203
El Sobrante, CA




On Aug 12, 2006, at 10:05 PM, Gregory OConnor wrote:

> Pete, "With your 30 amp 220 breaker at the house you have 30 amp
> available on each leg (red , Black) but not at the same time. " you
> can draw 30 amps through that breaker total. ie; '30 on one leg and
> zero on the other' or '15 and 15'. or run a total of 30 X 110 =
> 3,300 watts. By design the breaker will trip if you draw more than
> 30 amps in any combination. You could simply replace the breaker
> with a 50 amp if you have proper rated wire leading up to the bus.
> Nothing wrong with leaving it 30 and managing the watt/ amp usage in
> the bus.
>
> I wonder if there is a way to hook into 110 30 amp and use the
> inverter to make the other leg for the cooktop?
>
>
> If you hook into 110 30A and turn on the cooktop, I wonder if the
> electricity will pass to appliances on the other leg? I have seen
> this happen, the cooktop rehostat became a light dimmer for lights on
> the dead leg.
>
> My electrical certification is limited to a merit badge and education
> I credited to a 'how to do it book'. Titled "Don't be shocked by the
> shorts"
>
> Gregory O'Connor
> 94ptRomolandCa
> Eagle'74
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete Masterson
> wrote:
>>
>> Gregory,
>>
>> I followed your explanation except for the part quoted below. The
> 30
>> amp 220 circuit in my home that I "stole" for the coach originally
>> served an electric stove (or oven, I forget which -- we converted
> the
>> house stove to natural gas). So what I don't understand is why the
> 30
>> amps available would be only on one leg or the other but not both?
>> The circuit is served by two breakers (switches tied together with
> a
>> metal bar) and wired with a red, black, white and green wire.
> White
>> is neutral, green is ground, I thought the black and red were each
> a
>> 30 amp "leg" of the circuit -- or am I missing something. (I'm not
> an
>> electrician, so "three phase" wiring isn't my area of clear
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Pete Masterson]

John,

Thanks... My non-coach life has revolved around delicate computer
equipment, so I'm leery of switching power when devices are drawing
much (or any) current. At one point in my career, I 'supervised' a
computer that was so twitchy that just running a finger over the
breaker serving its circuit would cause it to go berserk -- since the
company's maintenance electricians had a habit of running their
fingers along the breakers to find one that was tripped, I had to
label "my" breaker with a "danger -- do not touch" label to avoid
unexpected shut downs.

It's good to know that the 'bird is rigged to consider the generator
as primary power source --- but for my own paranoia, I'll probably
still pull the breaker on the shore power before lighting the
generator just the same. Nice to know that there is likely safety
protocols that will prevent damage should I forget...

Pete Masterson
aeonix1@...
'95 Bluebird Wanderlodge WBDA 4203
El Sobrante, CA




On Aug 13, 2006, at 6:02 AM, John Suter wrote:

> Hi Pete,
>
> I wanted to address the following for you:
>
>> when I've been in a park with 30 amp power, I've
>> unplugged and turned
>> on the generator to use the cook top -- figured I'd
>> blow the 30 amp
>> circuit otherwise.
>
> Generally speaking, most Birds are electrically
> designed so the generator is the primary source of
> power. Therefore, after the generator is started and
> completes its warm-up and test cycles (and, for Birds
> so equipped, the additional tests by the generator
> controller (WestHaver GenCon)), the shore power
> connection is internally disconnected by the transfer
> switch (in some Birds you can hear the transfer switch
> humming in the kitchen sink area, or hear it
> snap/clunk when switching) in favor of the generator
> power source. When the generator is shut down, the
> power source automatically reverts to shore power, (or
> inverter, if no shore power is available). Therefore,
> in the future, you needn't disconnect at the pedestal
> to start/stop the generator; although, it is always a
> good idea not to switch among power sources while
> drawing heavy amperages to avoid burning/pitting the
> electrical contacts. Manual transfer switch Birds, as
> well. Best to reduce the load first (shut off A/C's,
> microwave oven, etc.) - If your coach has 12V
> electronic gear, such as in-motion sat, and DOES NOT
> have a separate 12V power supply (which we've
> recommended adding ad-nauseum here on the Forum), I'd
> also strongly recommend shutting those sensitive
> electronics down momentarily while switching power
> sources.
>
> John Suter



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[jwasnewski]

Hi Folks: Thanks to all of you who responded to my inquiry. I think
each of you have it correct, now I would like a double check,
please. Been out at the bus for cleaning, polishing, inspecting
etc. I studied my maunal on 30 AMP ops. It's rather vague, but here
is what I think.
I have a 30 amp aux connection which powers my Leg 2. My 50amp 240
permanent connector powers everything, both 120 legs. That should be
100amps. The manual calls for having adaptors which I do not have.
I think I can do the following:

1. Purchase a 240 female to fit my permanent 240 male shore cable
and wire one leg in it to a 30amp shore plug. That should give me 30
amps on leg 1 then plug my 30amp aux connection into either another
30amp shore power or 20amp shore power to get 30amps or 20 amps
respectively on leg 2. In my configuration, I think it is the only
way to get 2 legs of any kind of power. My inverter/charger runs off
leg 1. Then I gotta really manage power in the summer.

2. The 240amp female has a ground, a white(neutral) X & Y
connections representing 2 120 legs, I think. I would need to
determine whether X or Y on my permanent shore power cable powers leg
1 in the bus when I wire it to a 30 amp plug.

I do not plan to use this configuration but I would like to be ready
to do so if needed.

I handle 12v very well, 120v not as well. Does the foregoing sound
correct?

So that very faint humming noise I here when everyone is asleep is
the transfer switch. I was about to go searching for the source. Now
I won't.

Thanks again.

Leroy Eckert
1990WB40
Niceville, FL