Pokeys fan issue resolved, keeping the bus, generator rebuild?

[Tom Warner]

Yes there is. The glow plugs are designed to be connected in
series...............unless of course you would like to burn them out
and have to replace them.


tom warner
vernon center,ny
1985 PT 40

At 01:13 PM 12/7/2006, you wrote:
>Is there any reason not to run an individual wire to each glow plug,
>like off of a bus bar? Doug
>
>davidkerryedwards wrote: On the
>other series glow plug engines I have owned, the heavy wires
>joining the plugs glowed red when they were operating. With the
>series plugs, when one fails, they all fail.
>Does anyone know if there is a parallel pencil glow plug retrofit
>system for the Perkins. In my experience parallel glow plugs are
>far more efficient.
>
>Kerry
>82 FC 35
>Denver
>
>--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Troy Tikalsky"
> wrote:
> >
> > How do we verify the glow plugs are actually working?
> >
> > Troy Tikalsky
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Tom Warner
> > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 10:12 PM
> > Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Pokeys fan issue resolved,
>keeping the bus, generator rebuild?
> >
> >
> >
> > As Ernie can tell you the Perkins starts at very cold
>temperatures IF
> > you know how to start it. First make sure that the glow plugs
> > actually work. If you want the diesel to start right then you
>need to
> > do the correct preventative maintainance on the generator. If it
> > smokes there is a reason. Depending on the hours you may have to
> > remove the injectors and either clean or replace them. YOu need
>a
> > good air filter that is clean, and if you have the vertical one
>that
> > needs to have oil in the bottom, make sure its at the proper
>level.
> > Treat the Perkins right and it will out last both of us.
>I
> > rebuilt my control box and it made a significant difference in
> > starting reliably.
> >
> > tom warner
> > vernon center,ny
> > 1985 PT 40
> >
> > At 09:02 PM 12/6/2006, you wrote:
> > >Glad to hear you are as sick minded as the rest of us. How many
> > >hours does the Perkins
> > >have on it? Could the smoking be causes by the altitude? Are
>your
> > >glow plugs working
> > >right? I'd do a compression check before rebuilding it, but I'd
> > >probably just keep using it
> > >as long as it started fine and produced electricity.
> > >The one distinct advantage of a non-diesel generator, is that
>in
> > >very cold temperatures,
> > >the generator will start more reliably and then you can use
>that
> > >power to run the block
> > >heater on the car (when there's no access to electricity).
> > >
> > >Kerry
> > >82 FC 35
> > >Denver
> > >
> > >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "doug_ngl"
>wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hey gang,
> > > > Just thought I'd share a success. After testing the switch,
>checking
> > > > for current at the fan, jumpering power to the fan to see if
>I had a
> > > > functional hi speed mode, and finally pulling the dash, I
>found a poor
> > > > connection at the gang plug connecting the switch harness to
>the fan
> > > > harness. Cleaned it and used dielectric grease, works like a
>champ.
> > > > Just another note, after much thought, I've decided to keep
>Pokey,
> > > > at least for now. I did have her listed for sale, but the
>darn thing
> > > > keeps growing on me. I guess it's a sickness we all share.
>So let the
> > > > spending begin!
> > > > Lastly, the 12.5KW genset works well, but smokes a fair
>amount,
> > > > mostly at startup. I don't forsee useing it much, but it is
>a nice
> > > > option. I have considered rebuilding the Perkins, or
>replacing the it
> > > > with a propane fired unit...any words of advice??
> > > > Doug Engel, Gunnison, CO, 1981 FC35SB, "Pokey"
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
>http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

[one_dusty_hoot]

Glow plugs* I don't know how you would wire them in series,
as far as I know that is not possible.

Now is you are talking about the wire being in series with
each plug the, answer is yes, but!

Here's the but.. glow plugs use a tremendous amout of current
for a short period of time, something in the order of 6-8 AMPS.
depending on the plug and to the voltage applied at the cap/tp.

If the wire coming in from the power source was attached to
plug number ONE, then a wire to plug number TWO, then THREE
and so on there is a voltage drop on each wire depending on
the current flow, an example may be 9.5V-8.2V-6.8V and so on.
As you can see the voltage=heat would drop as you continued on
down the line. (If I were to call it in series it would be this
arrangment but it is not actually in series as each plug has
voltage to ground so the plugs are wired in parallel no matter)

You can check with a voltmeter to see if the voltage drops.
A better way of wiring is from the source to each glow plug
individually with large enough wire to carry the current, or,
have a huge copper bar or line attached to each glow plug, here
again with a large enough wire to the source to handle the
current.

You can forget the ohmmeter for checking these plugs even if
you have one out and in your hands. The resistance is so low
that an ohmmeter on X1 will read zero (0) thinking of course
that you have a short from cap to shell.

I have checked glow plugs with a good battery and jumper cables.
Attach to the battery, connect the black to the shell, the red
to the cap. WATCH OUT! The tips get extremely hot in just a few
seconds. Don't keep the voltage on too long. If they glow cherry
red at the tip first then toward the shell and not pitted or
erroded badly, they are good. If they don't heat or are badly
erroded they are bad.

You can well imagine the load on the battery with 3 or 4, even
6 or 8 glow plugs, many AMPS, batteries have just ran a marathon,
now you ask then to fire the starter, hey!, give me a break!

There is something else you can do to aid starting a diesel with
glow plugs and that is to add a relay, pust button, then momentarily
use the button on/off until the motor is running well.

bob janes, '87fc35, greenville,sc




--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Doug Engel
wrote:
>
> Is there any reason not to run an individual wire to each glow
plug, like off of a bus bar? Doug
>
> davidkerryedwards wrote: On the other
series glow plug engines I have owned, the heavy wires
> joining the plugs glowed red when they were operating. With the
> series plugs, when one fails, they all fail.
> Does anyone know if there is a parallel pencil glow plug retrofit
> system for the Perkins. In my experience parallel glow plugs are
> far more efficient.
>
> Kerry
> 82 FC 35
> Denver
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Troy Tikalsky"
> wrote:
> >
> > How do we verify the glow plugs are actually working?
> >
> > Troy Tikalsky
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Tom Warner
> > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 10:12 PM
> > Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Pokeys fan issue resolved,
> keeping the bus, generator rebuild?
> >
> >
> >
> > As Ernie can tell you the Perkins starts at very cold
> temperatures IF
> > you know how to start it. First make sure that the glow plugs
> > actually work. If you want the diesel to start right then you
> need to
> > do the correct preventative maintainance on the generator. If it
> > smokes there is a reason. Depending on the hours you may have to
> > remove the injectors and either clean or replace them. YOu need
> a
> > good air filter that is clean, and if you have the vertical one
> that
> > needs to have oil in the bottom, make sure its at the proper
> level.
> > Treat the Perkins right and it will out last both of us.
> I
> > rebuilt my control box and it made a significant difference in
> > starting reliably.
> >
> > tom warner
> > vernon center,ny
> > 1985 PT 40
> >
> > At 09:02 PM 12/6/2006, you wrote:
> > >Glad to hear you are as sick minded as the rest of us. How many
> > >hours does the Perkins
> > >have on it? Could the smoking be causes by the altitude? Are
> your
> > >glow plugs working
> > >right? I'd do a compression check before rebuilding it, but I'd
> > >probably just keep using it
> > >as long as it started fine and produced electricity.
> > >The one distinct advantage of a non-diesel generator, is that
> in
> > >very cold temperatures,
> > >the generator will start more reliably and then you can use
> that
> > >power to run the block
> > >heater on the car (when there's no access to electricity).
> > >
> > >Kerry
> > >82 FC 35
> > >Denver
> > >
> > >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "doug_ngl"
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hey gang,
> > > > Just thought I'd share a success. After testing the switch,
> checking
> > > > for current at the fan, jumpering power to the fan to see if
> I had a
> > > > functional hi speed mode, and finally pulling the dash, I
> found a poor
> > > > connection at the gang plug connecting the switch harness to
> the fan
> > > > harness. Cleaned it and used dielectric grease, works like a
> champ.
> > > > Just another note, after much thought, I've decided to keep
> Pokey,
> > > > at least for now. I did have her listed for sale, but the
> darn thing
> > > > keeps growing on me. I guess it's a sickness we all share.
> So let the
> > > > spending begin!
> > > > Lastly, the 12.5KW genset works well, but smokes a fair
> amount,
> > > > mostly at startup. I don't forsee useing it much, but it is
> a nice
> > > > option. I have considered rebuilding the Perkins, or
> replacing the it
> > > > with a propane fired unit...any words of advice??
> > > > Doug Engel, Gunnison, CO, 1981 FC35SB, "Pokey"
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

[Doug Engel]

"A better way of wiring is from the source to each glow plug
individually with large enough wire to carry the current"
This was the scheme I had in mind when I made reference to wiring them
indivudually off of a bus bar, or common connection rated for a suitable (read:
large) amp load. Granted, if one plug fails, then have the amp load rated for X
number of plugs going to X-1 number of plugs. If enough plugs go out, and you
apply current long enough, you are going to burn out plugs prematurely, but few
systems are fool proof. From what I see in how mine are currently wired, from
one to two to three and so on, the same is true of this arrangement, but the
load on the one wire gets progressively greater, hence the melted insulation on
mine. Any one, two of four plugs can fail, and the remaining plugs still get
current across the continuous wire connecting the positive lugs. I like the
heavy copper bar idea... Doug

Glow plugs* I don't know how you would wire them in series,
as far as I know that is not possible.

Now is you are talking about the wire being in series with
each plug the, answer is yes, but!

Here's the but.. glow plugs use a tremendous amout of current
for a short period of time, something in the order of 6-8 AMPS.
depending on the plug and to the voltage applied at the cap/tp.

If the wire coming in from the power source was attached to
plug number ONE, then a wire to plug number TWO, then THREE
and so on there is a voltage drop on each wire depending on
the current flow, an example may be 9.5V-8.2V-6.8V and so on.
As you can see the voltage=heat would drop as you continued on
down the line. (If I were to call it in series it would be this
arrangment but it is not actually in series as each plug has
voltage to ground so the plugs are wired in parallel no matter)

You can check with a voltmeter to see if the voltage drops.
A better way of wiring is from the source to each glow plug
individually with large enough wire to carry the current, or,
have a huge copper bar or line attached to each glow plug, here
again with a large enough wire to the source to handle the
current.

You can forget the ohmmeter for checking these plugs even if
you have one out and in your hands. The resistance is so low
that an ohmmeter on X1 will read zero (0) thinking of course
that you have a short from cap to shell.

I have checked glow plugs with a good battery and jumper cables.
Attach to the battery, connect the black to the shell, the red
to the cap. WATCH OUT! The tips get extremely hot in just a few
seconds. Don't keep the voltage on too long. If they glow cherry
red at the tip first then toward the shell and not pitted or
erroded badly, they are good. If they don't heat or are badly
erroded they are bad.

You can well imagine the load on the battery with 3 or 4, even
6 or 8 glow plugs, many AMPS, batteries have just ran a marathon,
now you ask then to fire the starter, hey!, give me a break!

There is something else you can do to aid starting a diesel with
glow plugs and that is to add a relay, pust button, then momentarily
use the button on/off until the motor is running well.

bob janes, '87fc35, greenville,sc

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Doug Engel
wrote:
>
> Is there any reason not to run an individual wire to each glow
plug, like off of a bus bar? Doug
>
> davidkerryedwards wrote: On the other
series glow plug engines I have owned, the heavy wires
> joining the plugs glowed red when they were operating. With the
> series plugs, when one fails, they all fail.
> Does anyone know if there is a parallel pencil glow plug retrofit
> system for the Perkins. In my experience parallel glow plugs are
> far more efficient.
>
> Kerry
> 82 FC 35
> Denver
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Troy Tikalsky"
> wrote:
> >
> > How do we verify the glow plugs are actually working?
> >
> > Troy Tikalsky
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Tom Warner
> > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 10:12 PM
> > Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Pokeys fan issue resolved,
> keeping the bus, generator rebuild?
> >
> >
> >
> > As Ernie can tell you the Perkins starts at very cold
> temperatures IF
> > you know how to start it. First make sure that the glow plugs
> > actually work. If you want the diesel to start right then you
> need to
> > do the correct preventative maintainance on the generator. If it
> > smokes there is a reason. Depending on the hours you may have to
> > remove the injectors and either clean or replace them. YOu need
> a
> > good air filter that is clean, and if you have the vertical one
> that
> > needs to have oil in the bottom, make sure its at the proper
> level.
> > Treat the Perkins right and it will out last both of us.
> I
> > rebuilt my control box and it made a significant difference in
> > starting reliably.
> >
> > tom warner
> > vernon center,ny
> > 1985 PT 40
> >
> > At 09:02 PM 12/6/2006, you wrote:
> > >Glad to hear you are as sick minded as the rest of us. How many
> > >hours does the Perkins
> > >have on it? Could the smoking be causes by the altitude? Are
> your
> > >glow plugs working
> > >right? I'd do a compression check before rebuilding it, but I'd
> > >probably just keep using it
> > >as long as it started fine and produced electricity.
> > >The one distinct advantage of a non-diesel generator, is that
> in
> > >very cold temperatures,
> > >the generator will start more reliably and then you can use
> that
> > >power to run the block
> > >heater on the car (when there's no access to electricity).
> > >
> > >Kerry
> > >82 FC 35
> > >Denver
> > >
> > >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "doug_ngl"
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hey gang,
> > > > Just thought I'd share a success. After testing the switch,
> checking
> > > > for current at the fan, jumpering power to the fan to see if
> I had a
> > > > functional hi speed mode, and finally pulling the dash, I
> found a poor
> > > > connection at the gang plug connecting the switch harness to
> the fan
> > > > harness. Cleaned it and used dielectric grease, works like a
> champ.
> > > > Just another note, after much thought, I've decided to keep
> Pokey,
> > > > at least for now. I did have her listed for sale, but the
> darn thing
> > > > keeps growing on me. I guess it's a sickness we all share.
> So let the
> > > > spending begin!
> > > > Lastly, the 12.5KW genset works well, but smokes a fair
> amount,
> > > > mostly at startup. I don't forsee useing it much, but it is
> a nice
> > > > option. I have considered rebuilding the Perkins, or
> replacing the it
> > > > with a propane fired unit...any words of advice??
> > > > Doug Engel, Gunnison, CO, 1981 FC35SB, "Pokey"
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>






Doug Engel, Gunnison, CO. 1981 FC35SB "Pokey"
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[davidkerryedwards]

The two different kinds (series/parallel or loop/pencil) that I am
familiar with are on Mercedes diesels. The Series/loop kind are
older and less efficient. The parallel/pencil type are newer and
more efficient. On the series kind, 12volt is applied to the first
plug, it flows thru the plug, heats the loop, out of that plug and
on to the next one with very heavy gauge wire with the final plug
grounded to the block. There are insulators at the top of these
plugs to stop the incoming electricity from jumping over to the
outgoing wire without passing thru the loop. These plugs lose a lot
of heat in the wires that join them together (you can see the wire
glow red). If a loop burns out, all the plugs stop working. I am
almost certain these are the style of plugs on my 82 Perkins.
The pencil/parallel plugs each receive 12 volts independent of the
other plugs and each is grounded to the block (I think). No heat is
lost in the wires that join them together. They are much more
efficient and if one burns out, the others still function since they
are independently grounded.
I converted my 77 Mercedes 300d from series to parallel and cold
weather starting improved immensely.

Kerry
82 FC35
Denver


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "one_dusty_hoot"
wrote:
>
> Glow plugs* I don't know how you would wire them in series,
> as far as I know that is not possible.
>
> Now is you are talking about the wire being in series with
> each plug the, answer is yes, but!
>
> Here's the but.. glow plugs use a tremendous amout of current
> for a short period of time, something in the order of 6-8 AMPS.
> depending on the plug and to the voltage applied at the cap/tp.
>
> If the wire coming in from the power source was attached to
> plug number ONE, then a wire to plug number TWO, then THREE
> and so on there is a voltage drop on each wire depending on
> the current flow, an example may be 9.5V-8.2V-6.8V and so on.
> As you can see the voltage=heat would drop as you continued on
> down the line. (If I were to call it in series it would be this
> arrangment but it is not actually in series as each plug has
> voltage to ground so the plugs are wired in parallel no matter)
>
> You can check with a voltmeter to see if the voltage drops.
> A better way of wiring is from the source to each glow plug
> individually with large enough wire to carry the current, or,
> have a huge copper bar or line attached to each glow plug, here
> again with a large enough wire to the source to handle the
> current.
>
> You can forget the ohmmeter for checking these plugs even if
> you have one out and in your hands. The resistance is so low
> that an ohmmeter on X1 will read zero (0) thinking of course
> that you have a short from cap to shell.
>
> I have checked glow plugs with a good battery and jumper cables.
> Attach to the battery, connect the black to the shell, the red
> to the cap. WATCH OUT! The tips get extremely hot in just a few
> seconds. Don't keep the voltage on too long. If they glow cherry
> red at the tip first then toward the shell and not pitted or
> erroded badly, they are good. If they don't heat or are badly
> erroded they are bad.
>
> You can well imagine the load on the battery with 3 or 4, even
> 6 or 8 glow plugs, many AMPS, batteries have just ran a marathon,
> now you ask then to fire the starter, hey!, give me a break!
>
> There is something else you can do to aid starting a diesel with
> glow plugs and that is to add a relay, pust button, then
momentarily
> use the button on/off until the motor is running well.
>
> bob janes, '87fc35, greenville,sc
>
>
>
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Doug Engel
> wrote:
> >
> > Is there any reason not to run an individual wire to each glow
> plug, like off of a bus bar? Doug
> >
> > davidkerryedwards wrote: On the other
> series glow plug engines I have owned, the heavy wires
> > joining the plugs glowed red when they were operating. With the
> > series plugs, when one fails, they all fail.
> > Does anyone know if there is a parallel pencil glow plug
retrofit
> > system for the Perkins. In my experience parallel glow plugs are
> > far more efficient.
> >
> > Kerry
> > 82 FC 35
> > Denver
> >
> > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Troy Tikalsky"
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > How do we verify the glow plugs are actually working?
> > >
> > > Troy Tikalsky
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Tom Warner
> > > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 10:12 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Pokeys fan issue resolved,
> > keeping the bus, generator rebuild?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > As Ernie can tell you the Perkins starts at very cold
> > temperatures IF
> > > you know how to start it. First make sure that the glow plugs
> > > actually work. If you want the diesel to start right then you
> > need to
> > > do the correct preventative maintainance on the generator. If
it
> > > smokes there is a reason. Depending on the hours you may have
to
> > > remove the injectors and either clean or replace them. YOu
need
> > a
> > > good air filter that is clean, and if you have the vertical
one
> > that
> > > needs to have oil in the bottom, make sure its at the proper
> > level.
> > > Treat the Perkins right and it will out last both of
us.
> > I
> > > rebuilt my control box and it made a significant difference in
> > > starting reliably.
> > >
> > > tom warner
> > > vernon center,ny
> > > 1985 PT 40
> > >
> > > At 09:02 PM 12/6/2006, you wrote:
> > > >Glad to hear you are as sick minded as the rest of us. How
many
> > > >hours does the Perkins
> > > >have on it? Could the smoking be causes by the altitude? Are
> > your
> > > >glow plugs working
> > > >right? I'd do a compression check before rebuilding it, but
I'd
> > > >probably just keep using it
> > > >as long as it started fine and produced electricity.
> > > >The one distinct advantage of a non-diesel generator, is that
> > in
> > > >very cold temperatures,
> > > >the generator will start more reliably and then you can use
> > that
> > > >power to run the block
> > > >heater on the car (when there's no access to electricity).
> > > >
> > > >Kerry
> > > >82 FC 35
> > > >Denver
> > > >
> > > >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "doug_ngl"

> > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Hey gang,
> > > > > Just thought I'd share a success. After testing the
switch,
> > checking
> > > > > for current at the fan, jumpering power to the fan to see
if
> > I had a
> > > > > functional hi speed mode, and finally pulling the dash, I
> > found a poor
> > > > > connection at the gang plug connecting the switch harness
to
> > the fan
> > > > > harness. Cleaned it and used dielectric grease, works like
a
> > champ.
> > > > > Just another note, after much thought, I've decided to
keep
> > Pokey,
> > > > > at least for now. I did have her listed for sale, but the
> > darn thing
> > > > > keeps growing on me. I guess it's a sickness we all share.
> > So let the
> > > > > spending begin!
> > > > > Lastly, the 12.5KW genset works well, but smokes a fair
> > amount,
> > > > > mostly at startup. I don't forsee useing it much, but it
is
> > a nice
> > > > > option. I have considered rebuilding the Perkins, or
> > replacing the it
> > > > > with a propane fired unit...any words of advice??
> > > > > Doug Engel, Gunnison, CO, 1981 FC35SB, "Pokey"
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> > http://mail.yahoo.com
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>

[davidkerryedwards]

Each plug would also have to be grounded seperately since the system
as it exists depends on a ground wire from the last plug to the
block (I think).

Kerry
82 FC 35
Denver

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Doug Engel
wrote:
>
> "A better way of wiring is from the source to each glow plug
> individually with large enough wire to carry the current"
> This was the scheme I had in mind when I made reference to
wiring them indivudually off of a bus bar, or common connection
rated for a suitable (read: large) amp load. Granted, if one plug
fails, then have the amp load rated for X number of plugs going to
X-1 number of plugs. If enough plugs go out, and you apply current
long enough, you are going to burn out plugs prematurely, but few
systems are fool proof. From what I see in how mine are currently
wired, from one to two to three and so on, the same is true of this
arrangement, but the load on the one wire gets progressively
greater, hence the melted insulation on mine. Any one, two of four
plugs can fail, and the remaining plugs still get current across the
continuous wire connecting the positive lugs. I like the heavy
copper bar idea... Doug
>
> Glow plugs* I don't know how you would wire them in
series,
> as far as I know that is not possible.
>
> Now is you are talking about the wire being in series with
> each plug the, answer is yes, but!
>
> Here's the but.. glow plugs use a tremendous amout of current
> for a short period of time, something in the order of 6-8 AMPS.
> depending on the plug and to the voltage applied at the cap/tp.
>
> If the wire coming in from the power source was attached to
> plug number ONE, then a wire to plug number TWO, then THREE
> and so on there is a voltage drop on each wire depending on
> the current flow, an example may be 9.5V-8.2V-6.8V and so on.
> As you can see the voltage=heat would drop as you continued on
> down the line. (If I were to call it in series it would be this
> arrangment but it is not actually in series as each plug has
> voltage to ground so the plugs are wired in parallel no matter)
>
> You can check with a voltmeter to see if the voltage drops.
> A better way of wiring is from the source to each glow plug
> individually with large enough wire to carry the current, or,
> have a huge copper bar or line attached to each glow plug, here
> again with a large enough wire to the source to handle the
> current.
>
> You can forget the ohmmeter for checking these plugs even if
> you have one out and in your hands. The resistance is so low
> that an ohmmeter on X1 will read zero (0) thinking of course
> that you have a short from cap to shell.
>
> I have checked glow plugs with a good battery and jumper cables.
> Attach to the battery, connect the black to the shell, the red
> to the cap. WATCH OUT! The tips get extremely hot in just a few
> seconds. Don't keep the voltage on too long. If they glow cherry
> red at the tip first then toward the shell and not pitted or
> erroded badly, they are good. If they don't heat or are badly
> erroded they are bad.
>
> You can well imagine the load on the battery with 3 or 4, even
> 6 or 8 glow plugs, many AMPS, batteries have just ran a marathon,
> now you ask then to fire the starter, hey!, give me a break!
>
> There is something else you can do to aid starting a diesel with
> glow plugs and that is to add a relay, pust button, then
momentarily
> use the button on/off until the motor is running well.
>
> bob janes, '87fc35, greenville,sc
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Doug Engel
> wrote:
> >
> > Is there any reason not to run an individual wire to each glow
> plug, like off of a bus bar? Doug
> >
> > davidkerryedwards wrote: On the other
> series glow plug engines I have owned, the heavy wires
> > joining the plugs glowed red when they were operating. With the
> > series plugs, when one fails, they all fail.
> > Does anyone know if there is a parallel pencil glow plug
retrofit
> > system for the Perkins. In my experience parallel glow plugs are
> > far more efficient.
> >
> > Kerry
> > 82 FC 35
> > Denver
> >
> > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Troy Tikalsky"
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > How do we verify the glow plugs are actually working?
> > >
> > > Troy Tikalsky
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Tom Warner
> > > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 10:12 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Pokeys fan issue resolved,
> > keeping the bus, generator rebuild?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > As Ernie can tell you the Perkins starts at very cold
> > temperatures IF
> > > you know how to start it. First make sure that the glow plugs
> > > actually work. If you want the diesel to start right then you
> > need to
> > > do the correct preventative maintainance on the generator. If
it
> > > smokes there is a reason. Depending on the hours you may have
to
> > > remove the injectors and either clean or replace them. YOu
need
> > a
> > > good air filter that is clean, and if you have the vertical
one
> > that
> > > needs to have oil in the bottom, make sure its at the proper
> > level.
> > > Treat the Perkins right and it will out last both of
us.
> > I
> > > rebuilt my control box and it made a significant difference in
> > > starting reliably.
> > >
> > > tom warner
> > > vernon center,ny
> > > 1985 PT 40
> > >
> > > At 09:02 PM 12/6/2006, you wrote:
> > > >Glad to hear you are as sick minded as the rest of us. How
many
> > > >hours does the Perkins
> > > >have on it? Could the smoking be causes by the altitude? Are
> > your
> > > >glow plugs working
> > > >right? I'd do a compression check before rebuilding it, but
I'd
> > > >probably just keep using it
> > > >as long as it started fine and produced electricity.
> > > >The one distinct advantage of a non-diesel generator, is that
> > in
> > > >very cold temperatures,
> > > >the generator will start more reliably and then you can use
> > that
> > > >power to run the block
> > > >heater on the car (when there's no access to electricity).
> > > >
> > > >Kerry
> > > >82 FC 35
> > > >Denver
> > > >
> > > >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "doug_ngl"

> > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Hey gang,
> > > > > Just thought I'd share a success. After testing the
switch,
> > checking
> > > > > for current at the fan, jumpering power to the fan to see
if
> > I had a
> > > > > functional hi speed mode, and finally pulling the dash, I
> > found a poor
> > > > > connection at the gang plug connecting the switch harness
to
> > the fan
> > > > > harness. Cleaned it and used dielectric grease, works like
a
> > champ.
> > > > > Just another note, after much thought, I've decided to
keep
> > Pokey,
> > > > > at least for now. I did have her listed for sale, but the
> > darn thing
> > > > > keeps growing on me. I guess it's a sickness we all share.
> > So let the
> > > > > spending begin!
> > > > > Lastly, the 12.5KW genset works well, but smokes a fair
> > amount,
> > > > > mostly at startup. I don't forsee useing it much, but it
is
> > a nice
> > > > > option. I have considered rebuilding the Perkins, or
> > replacing the it
> > > > > with a propane fired unit...any words of advice??
> > > > > Doug Engel, Gunnison, CO, 1981 FC35SB, "Pokey"
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> > http://mail.yahoo.com
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Doug Engel, Gunnison, CO. 1981 FC35SB "Pokey"
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

[Jeff Miller]

Tom's post reminded me of the two toggles on the control box. The
on/off one has to be on for the glow plugs to operate when the stop
button is depressed. Later Yanmar gensets have the same switch
except it is for the primer pump when stop is depressed. Check the
manual for cold-weather operation of your genset, and I believe that
20seconds is the max. glow by the manual.

- Jeff Miller
in Holland, MI


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Tom Warner
wrote:
>
> YOu can activate the glow plugs from the control box in the
generator
> as well as in the two positions inside the coach. Open up the
> generator tray, activate the glow plugs by either depressing the
glo
> plug switch on the control box if your specific model has it, or
> depress the start switch the opposite direction and you will hear
the
> glow plug relay click on. You can check each glowplug with a
ohmeter
> for resistance by taking off each terminal and checking the center
to
> ground. If there is a resistance its good.
> I dont have a diagram for the glow plugs so unless I go to the
shop
> and check it cant tell you how to check the glow plugs with a
> voltmeter. I believe however they are in series so checking each
one
> with a voltmeter will show either a voltage (DC) or none at all if
> that one is bad. I suspect that they have been very rarely used so
> are probably good. Most owners never knew the generator had that
feature.
>
> good luck
>
> tom warner
> vernon center,ny
> 1985 PT 40 Home for an hour to eat. working on that XX???@@###
hot
> water heater to add a way of winterizing the freshwater system.
>
>
> At 12:28 PM 12/7/2006, you wrote:
> >How do we verify the glow plugs are actually working?
> >
> >Troy Tikalsky
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Tom Warner
> > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 10:12 PM
> > Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Pokeys fan issue resolved,
> > keeping the bus, generator rebuild?
> >
> >
> >
> > As Ernie can tell you the Perkins starts at very cold
temperatures IF
> > you know how to start it. First make sure that the glow plugs
> > actually work. If you want the diesel to start right then you
need to
> > do the correct preventative maintainance on the generator. If
it
> > smokes there is a reason. Depending on the hours you may have
to
> > remove the injectors and either clean or replace them. YOu
need a
> > good air filter that is clean, and if you have the vertical
one that
> > needs to have oil in the bottom, make sure its at the proper
level.
> > Treat the Perkins right and it will out last both of
us. I
> > rebuilt my control box and it made a significant difference in
> > starting reliably.
> >
> > tom warner
> > vernon center,ny
> > 1985 PT 40
> >
> > At 09:02 PM 12/6/2006, you wrote:
> > >Glad to hear you are as sick minded as the rest of us. How
many
> > >hours does the Perkins
> > >have on it? Could the smoking be causes by the altitude? Are
your
> > >glow plugs working
> > >right? I'd do a compression check before rebuilding it, but
I'd
> > >probably just keep using it
> > >as long as it started fine and produced electricity.
> > >The one distinct advantage of a non-diesel generator, is that
in
> > >very cold temperatures,
> > >the generator will start more reliably and then you can use
that
> > >power to run the block
> > >heater on the car (when there's no access to electricity).
> > >
> > >Kerry
> > >82 FC 35
> > >Denver
> > >
> > >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "doug_ngl"
wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hey gang,
> > > > Just thought I'd share a success. After testing the
switch, checking
> > > > for current at the fan, jumpering power to the fan to see
if I had a
> > > > functional hi speed mode, and finally pulling the dash, I
found a poor
> > > > connection at the gang plug connecting the switch harness
to the fan
> > > > harness. Cleaned it and used dielectric grease, works like
a champ.
> > > > Just another note, after much thought, I've decided to
keep Pokey,
> > > > at least for now. I did have her listed for sale, but the
darn thing
> > > > keeps growing on me. I guess it's a sickness we all share.
So let the
> > > > spending begin!
> > > > Lastly, the 12.5KW genset works well, but smokes a fair
amount,
> > > > mostly at startup. I don't forsee useing it much, but it
is a nice
> > > > option. I have considered rebuilding the Perkins, or
replacing the it
> > > > with a propane fired unit...any words of advice??
> > > > Doug Engel, Gunnison, CO, 1981 FC35SB, "Pokey"
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>

[Jeff Miller]

Series is the older method, and as Kerry mentioned the glow plugs
are each running at ~3Vdc in the series system, would be running at
12v in parallel which would require different plugs.

Series works, but as glowplugs age the resistance changes, and the
lower the resistance the less voltage-drop across it, so the heating
becomes inconsistent across cylinders. The other problem is that as
mentioned, if one burns out you have no glow plugs.

A parallel arrangement would be a nice upgrade for frequent cold-
weather starts.

- Jeff Miller
in Holland, MI


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "davidkerryedwards"
wrote:
>
> The two different kinds (series/parallel or loop/pencil) that I am
> familiar with are on Mercedes diesels. The Series/loop kind are
> older and less efficient. The parallel/pencil type are newer and
> more efficient. On the series kind, 12volt is applied to the first
> plug, it flows thru the plug, heats the loop, out of that plug and
> on to the next one with very heavy gauge wire with the final plug
> grounded to the block. There are insulators at the top of these
> plugs to stop the incoming electricity from jumping over to the
> outgoing wire without passing thru the loop. These plugs lose a
lot
> of heat in the wires that join them together (you can see the wire
> glow red). If a loop burns out, all the plugs stop working. I am
> almost certain these are the style of plugs on my 82 Perkins.
> The pencil/parallel plugs each receive 12 volts independent of the
> other plugs and each is grounded to the block (I think). No heat
is
> lost in the wires that join them together. They are much more
> efficient and if one burns out, the others still function since
they
> are independently grounded.
> I converted my 77 Mercedes 300d from series to parallel and cold
> weather starting improved immensely.
>
> Kerry
> 82 FC35
> Denver

[one_dusty_hoot]

I had a '74D-4cyl and a '77D-5cyl. Never heard of the
pencil loop but that is not to say it did not exist.
On a 4 Cyl John Deere I put a large relay close to the
glow pugss, large wire to the relay and large wires to
the glow plugs, PB controlled the relay w/12v. The
voltages given were real world from an 8.0 Onan which
as soon as I get off my duff will be changed. See if
you can get ahold of some high temp wire covering or
with shield.

bob janes, '87fc35, greenville, sc




--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "davidkerryedwards"
wrote:
>
> The two different kinds (series/parallel or loop/pencil) that I am
> familiar with are on Mercedes diesels. The Series/loop kind are
> older and less efficient. The parallel/pencil type are newer and
> more efficient. On the series kind, 12volt is applied to the first
> plug, it flows thru the plug, heats the loop, out of that plug and
> on to the next one with very heavy gauge wire with the final plug
> grounded to the block. There are insulators at the top of these
> plugs to stop the incoming electricity from jumping over to the
> outgoing wire without passing thru the loop. These plugs lose a
lot
> of heat in the wires that join them together (you can see the wire
> glow red). If a loop burns out, all the plugs stop working. I am
> almost certain these are the style of plugs on my 82 Perkins.
> The pencil/parallel plugs each receive 12 volts independent of the
> other plugs and each is grounded to the block (I think). No heat is
> lost in the wires that join them together. They are much more
> efficient and if one burns out, the others still function since
they
> are independently grounded.
> I converted my 77 Mercedes 300d from series to parallel and cold
> weather starting improved immensely.
>
> Kerry
> 82 FC35
> Denver
>
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "one_dusty_hoot"
> wrote:
> >
> > Glow plugs* I don't know how you would wire them in series,
> > as far as I know that is not possible.
> >
> > Now is you are talking about the wire being in series with
> > each plug the, answer is yes, but!
> >
> > Here's the but.. glow plugs use a tremendous amout of current
> > for a short period of time, something in the order of 6-8 AMPS.
> > depending on the plug and to the voltage applied at the cap/tp.
> >
> > If the wire coming in from the power source was attached to
> > plug number ONE, then a wire to plug number TWO, then THREE
> > and so on there is a voltage drop on each wire depending on
> > the current flow, an example may be 9.5V-8.2V-6.8V and so on.
> > As you can see the voltage=heat would drop as you continued on
> > down the line. (If I were to call it in series it would be this
> > arrangment but it is not actually in series as each plug has
> > voltage to ground so the plugs are wired in parallel no matter)
> >
> > You can check with a voltmeter to see if the voltage drops.
> > A better way of wiring is from the source to each glow plug
> > individually with large enough wire to carry the current, or,
> > have a huge copper bar or line attached to each glow plug, here
> > again with a large enough wire to the source to handle the
> > current.
> >
> > You can forget the ohmmeter for checking these plugs even if
> > you have one out and in your hands. The resistance is so low
> > that an ohmmeter on X1 will read zero (0) thinking of course
> > that you have a short from cap to shell.
> >
> > I have checked glow plugs with a good battery and jumper cables.
> > Attach to the battery, connect the black to the shell, the red
> > to the cap. WATCH OUT! The tips get extremely hot in just a few
> > seconds. Don't keep the voltage on too long. If they glow cherry
> > red at the tip first then toward the shell and not pitted or
> > erroded badly, they are good. If they don't heat or are badly
> > erroded they are bad.
> >
> > You can well imagine the load on the battery with 3 or 4, even
> > 6 or 8 glow plugs, many AMPS, batteries have just ran a marathon,
> > now you ask then to fire the starter, hey!, give me a break!
> >
> > There is something else you can do to aid starting a diesel with
> > glow plugs and that is to add a relay, pust button, then
> momentarily
> > use the button on/off until the motor is running well.
> >
> > bob janes, '87fc35, greenville,sc
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Doug Engel
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > Is there any reason not to run an individual wire to each glow
> > plug, like off of a bus bar? Doug
> > >
> > > davidkerryedwards wrote: On the other
> > series glow plug engines I have owned, the heavy wires
> > > joining the plugs glowed red when they were operating. With the
> > > series plugs, when one fails, they all fail.
> > > Does anyone know if there is a parallel pencil glow plug
> retrofit
> > > system for the Perkins. In my experience parallel glow plugs
are
> > > far more efficient.
> > >
> > > Kerry
> > > 82 FC 35
> > > Denver
> > >
> > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Troy Tikalsky"
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > How do we verify the glow plugs are actually working?
> > > >
> > > > Troy Tikalsky
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: Tom Warner
> > > > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > > Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 10:12 PM
> > > > Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Pokeys fan issue
resolved,
> > > keeping the bus, generator rebuild?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > As Ernie can tell you the Perkins starts at very cold
> > > temperatures IF
> > > > you know how to start it. First make sure that the glow plugs
> > > > actually work. If you want the diesel to start right then you
> > > need to
> > > > do the correct preventative maintainance on the generator. If
> it
> > > > smokes there is a reason. Depending on the hours you may have
> to
> > > > remove the injectors and either clean or replace them. YOu
> need
> > > a
> > > > good air filter that is clean, and if you have the vertical
> one
> > > that
> > > > needs to have oil in the bottom, make sure its at the proper
> > > level.
> > > > Treat the Perkins right and it will out last both of
> us.
> > > I
> > > > rebuilt my control box and it made a significant difference
in
> > > > starting reliably.
> > > >
> > > > tom warner
> > > > vernon center,ny
> > > > 1985 PT 40
> > > >
> > > > At 09:02 PM 12/6/2006, you wrote:
> > > > >Glad to hear you are as sick minded as the rest of us. How
> many
> > > > >hours does the Perkins
> > > > >have on it? Could the smoking be causes by the altitude? Are
> > > your
> > > > >glow plugs working
> > > > >right? I'd do a compression check before rebuilding it, but
> I'd
> > > > >probably just keep using it
> > > > >as long as it started fine and produced electricity.
> > > > >The one distinct advantage of a non-diesel generator, is
that
> > > in
> > > > >very cold temperatures,
> > > > >the generator will start more reliably and then you can use
> > > that
> > > > >power to run the block
> > > > >heater on the car (when there's no access to electricity).
> > > > >
> > > > >Kerry
> > > > >82 FC 35
> > > > >Denver
> > > > >
> > > > >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "doug_ngl"
>
> > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Hey gang,
> > > > > > Just thought I'd share a success. After testing the
> switch,
> > > checking
> > > > > > for current at the fan, jumpering power to the fan to see
> if
> > > I had a
> > > > > > functional hi speed mode, and finally pulling the dash, I
> > > found a poor
> > > > > > connection at the gang plug connecting the switch harness
> to
> > > the fan
> > > > > > harness. Cleaned it and used dielectric grease, works
like
> a
> > > champ.
> > > > > > Just another note, after much thought, I've decided to
> keep
> > > Pokey,
> > > > > > at least for now. I did have her listed for sale, but the
> > > darn thing
> > > > > > keeps growing on me. I guess it's a sickness we all
share.
> > > So let the
> > > > > > spending begin!
> > > > > > Lastly, the 12.5KW genset works well, but smokes a fair
> > > amount,
> > > > > > mostly at startup. I don't forsee useing it much, but it
> is
> > > a nice
> > > > > > option. I have considered rebuilding the Perkins, or
> > > replacing the it
> > > > > > with a propane fired unit...any words of advice??
> > > > > > Doug Engel, Gunnison, CO, 1981 FC35SB, "Pokey"
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________
> > > Do You Yahoo!?
> > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> > > http://mail.yahoo.com
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> >
>

[one_dusty_hoot]

Jeff, This toggle, or, I used a push button, is what
the cold weather fellows need to get the diesel up
and running quicker, after it starts, toggle on for
a few then off for a few, this really makes a difference.

bob janes, '87fc35, greenville, sc

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff Miller"
wrote:
>
> Tom's post reminded me of the two toggles on the control box. The
> on/off one has to be on for the glow plugs to operate when the stop
> button is depressed. Later Yanmar gensets have the same switch
> except it is for the primer pump when stop is depressed. Check the
> manual for cold-weather operation of your genset, and I believe
that
> 20seconds is the max. glow by the manual.
>
> - Jeff Miller
> in Holland, MI
>
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Tom Warner
> wrote:
> >
> > YOu can activate the glow plugs from the control box in the
> generator
> > as well as in the two positions inside the coach. Open up the
> > generator tray, activate the glow plugs by either depressing the
> glo
> > plug switch on the control box if your specific model has it, or
> > depress the start switch the opposite direction and you will hear
> the
> > glow plug relay click on. You can check each glowplug with a
> ohmeter
> > for resistance by taking off each terminal and checking the
center
> to
> > ground. If there is a resistance its good.
> > I dont have a diagram for the glow plugs so unless I go to the
> shop
> > and check it cant tell you how to check the glow plugs with a
> > voltmeter. I believe however they are in series so checking each
> one
> > with a voltmeter will show either a voltage (DC) or none at all
if
> > that one is bad. I suspect that they have been very rarely used
so
> > are probably good. Most owners never knew the generator had that
> feature.
> >
> > good luck
> >
> > tom warner
> > vernon center,ny
> > 1985 PT 40 Home for an hour to eat. working on that XX???@@###
> hot
> > water heater to add a way of winterizing the freshwater system.
> >
> >
> > At 12:28 PM 12/7/2006, you wrote:
> > >How do we verify the glow plugs are actually working?
> > >
> > >Troy Tikalsky
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Tom Warner
> > > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 10:12 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Pokeys fan issue
resolved,
> > > keeping the bus, generator rebuild?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > As Ernie can tell you the Perkins starts at very cold
> temperatures IF
> > > you know how to start it. First make sure that the glow plugs
> > > actually work. If you want the diesel to start right then you
> need to
> > > do the correct preventative maintainance on the generator. If
> it
> > > smokes there is a reason. Depending on the hours you may have
> to
> > > remove the injectors and either clean or replace them. YOu
> need a
> > > good air filter that is clean, and if you have the vertical
> one that
> > > needs to have oil in the bottom, make sure its at the proper
> level.
> > > Treat the Perkins right and it will out last both of
> us. I
> > > rebuilt my control box and it made a significant difference in
> > > starting reliably.
> > >
> > > tom warner
> > > vernon center,ny
> > > 1985 PT 40
> > >
> > > At 09:02 PM 12/6/2006, you wrote:
> > > >Glad to hear you are as sick minded as the rest of us. How
> many
> > > >hours does the Perkins
> > > >have on it? Could the smoking be causes by the altitude? Are
> your
> > > >glow plugs working
> > > >right? I'd do a compression check before rebuilding it, but
> I'd
> > > >probably just keep using it
> > > >as long as it started fine and produced electricity.
> > > >The one distinct advantage of a non-diesel generator, is
that
> in
> > > >very cold temperatures,
> > > >the generator will start more reliably and then you can use
> that
> > > >power to run the block
> > > >heater on the car (when there's no access to electricity).
> > > >
> > > >Kerry
> > > >82 FC 35
> > > >Denver
> > > >
> > > >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "doug_ngl"
> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Hey gang,
> > > > > Just thought I'd share a success. After testing the
> switch, checking
> > > > > for current at the fan, jumpering power to the fan to see
> if I had a
> > > > > functional hi speed mode, and finally pulling the dash, I
> found a poor
> > > > > connection at the gang plug connecting the switch harness
> to the fan
> > > > > harness. Cleaned it and used dielectric grease, works
like
> a champ.
> > > > > Just another note, after much thought, I've decided to
> keep Pokey,
> > > > > at least for now. I did have her listed for sale, but the
> darn thing
> > > > > keeps growing on me. I guess it's a sickness we all
share.
> So let the
> > > > > spending begin!
> > > > > Lastly, the 12.5KW genset works well, but smokes a fair
> amount,
> > > > > mostly at startup. I don't forsee useing it much, but it
> is a nice
> > > > > option. I have considered rebuilding the Perkins, or
> replacing the it
> > > > > with a propane fired unit...any words of advice??
> > > > > Doug Engel, Gunnison, CO, 1981 FC35SB, "Pokey"
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>

[Tom Warner]

You have an excellent memory Jeff.
Here is what my Kohler manual says: On a cold engine depress the
preheat switch for 15-20 (But no longer) seconds and then try to
start the engine. Only hold the start switch down for 15-20 seconds
but no longer. If it does not start let the engine come to a complete
stop and then repeat the glow plug sequence for an additional 15-20
seconds and keep that sequence up until it starts.

But just one addition relative to the glow plugs. They are wired in
series and you do not want to put 12VDC to any of them separately as
you stand a good chance of buring it out quickly. Remember in series
the resistance is the total of all 4 plugs and that limits the total
current thru any one of them. If you want to modify the glow plugs to
a parallel configuration you want a glow plug made for that purpose.

tom warner
vernon center,ny
1985 PT 40

At 03:32 PM 12/7/2006, you wrote:
>Tom's post reminded me of the two toggles on the control box. The
>on/off one has to be on for the glow plugs to operate when the stop
>button is depressed. Later Yanmar gensets have the same switch
>except it is for the primer pump when stop is depressed. Check the
>manual for cold-weather operation of your genset, and I believe that
>20seconds is the max. glow by the manual.
>
> - Jeff Miller
>in Holland, MI
>
>
>--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Tom Warner
>wrote:
> >
> > YOu can activate the glow plugs from the control box in the
>generator
> > as well as in the two positions inside the coach. Open up the
> > generator tray, activate the glow plugs by either depressing the
>glo
> > plug switch on the control box if your specific model has it, or
> > depress the start switch the opposite direction and you will hear
>the
> > glow plug relay click on. You can check each glowplug with a
>ohmeter
> > for resistance by taking off each terminal and checking the center
>to
> > ground. If there is a resistance its good.
> > I dont have a diagram for the glow plugs so unless I go to the
>shop
> > and check it cant tell you how to check the glow plugs with a
> > voltmeter. I believe however they are in series so checking each
>one
> > with a voltmeter will show either a voltage (DC) or none at all if
> > that one is bad. I suspect that they have been very rarely used so
> > are probably good. Most owners never knew the generator had that
>feature.
> >
> > good luck
> >
> > tom warner
> > vernon center,ny
> > 1985 PT 40 Home for an hour to eat. working on that XX???@@###
>hot
> > water heater to add a way of winterizing the freshwater system.
> >
> >
> > At 12:28 PM 12/7/2006, you wrote:
> > >How do we verify the glow plugs are actually working?
> > >
> > >Troy Tikalsky
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: Tom Warner
> > > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > > Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 10:12 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Pokeys fan issue resolved,
> > > keeping the bus, generator rebuild?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > As Ernie can tell you the Perkins starts at very cold
>temperatures IF
> > > you know how to start it. First make sure that the glow plugs
> > > actually work. If you want the diesel to start right then you
>need to
> > > do the correct preventative maintainance on the generator. If
>it
> > > smokes there is a reason. Depending on the hours you may have
>to
> > > remove the injectors and either clean or replace them. YOu
>need a
> > > good air filter that is clean, and if you have the vertical
>one that
> > > needs to have oil in the bottom, make sure its at the proper
>level.
> > > Treat the Perkins right and it will out last both of
>us. I
> > > rebuilt my control box and it made a significant difference in
> > > starting reliably.
> > >
> > > tom warner
> > > vernon center,ny
> > > 1985 PT 40
> > >
> > > At 09:02 PM 12/6/2006, you wrote:
> > > >Glad to hear you are as sick minded as the rest of us. How
>many
> > > >hours does the Perkins
> > > >have on it? Could the smoking be causes by the altitude? Are
>your
> > > >glow plugs working
> > > >right? I'd do a compression check before rebuilding it, but
>I'd
> > > >probably just keep using it
> > > >as long as it started fine and produced electricity.
> > > >The one distinct advantage of a non-diesel generator, is that
>in
> > > >very cold temperatures,
> > > >the generator will start more reliably and then you can use
>that
> > > >power to run the block
> > > >heater on the car (when there's no access to electricity).
> > > >
> > > >Kerry
> > > >82 FC 35
> > > >Denver
> > > >
> > > >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "doug_ngl"
> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Hey gang,
> > > > > Just thought I'd share a success. After testing the
>switch, checking
> > > > > for current at the fan, jumpering power to the fan to see
>if I had a
> > > > > functional hi speed mode, and finally pulling the dash, I
>found a poor
> > > > > connection at the gang plug connecting the switch harness
>to the fan
> > > > > harness. Cleaned it and used dielectric grease, works like
>a champ.
> > > > > Just another note, after much thought, I've decided to
>keep Pokey,
> > > > > at least for now. I did have her listed for sale, but the
>darn thing
> > > > > keeps growing on me. I guess it's a sickness we all share.
>So let the
> > > > > spending begin!
> > > > > Lastly, the 12.5KW genset works well, but smokes a fair
>amount,
> > > > > mostly at startup. I don't forsee useing it much, but it
>is a nice
> > > > > option. I have considered rebuilding the Perkins, or
>replacing the it
> > > > > with a propane fired unit...any words of advice??
> > > > > Doug Engel, Gunnison, CO, 1981 FC35SB, "Pokey"
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>