Sound- absorption or reflection

[Stephen Birtles]

if you look at the newer generators the sound deadening box has
baffled vents and is sealed as well as sound deadening
materials,thermostatically controlled fans and a smaller new motor
with indirect indirect injection. With all these it makes for a
quieter generator

Stephen 77fc35



--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Ernie Ekberg
wrote:
>
> Jim, while the some of the noise was deflected down, 30 more db was
reflected to the front of the radiator. Bob's coach has the front
fan/radiator.
>
>
> Ernie Ekberg
> 83PT40
> Wanderlodge
> Weatherford, Tx
> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/erni...gandrepair
>
> --- On Fri, 2/20/09, jim riordan wrote:
>
> From: jim riordan
> Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Sound- absorption or reflection
> To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Friday, February 20, 2009, 10:01 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I would assume that the sound deading material used in these
generator compartments actually reflect the nooise down. so the noie
is forced under the coaches. Many boats and I belive that some new
coaches now have a box lined with sound deading which the generator is
placed.
>
> just a thought
>
> jim riordan
> 88 wbwl xxv
> stuart fl
>
> --- On Fri, 2/20/09, Ernest Ekberg wrote:
>
> From: Ernest Ekberg
> Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Sound- absorption or reflection
> To: WanderlodgeForum@ yahoogroups. com
> Date: Friday, February 20, 2009, 7:43 PM
>
>
>
>
> After installing many generator compartments with the new insulation, I
> was wondering if there is a manufacturer that offers both.
> I insulated Bob Lawrences' generator compartment last December. He
> measured the db levels before and after and found that while the heat
> was reflected from the interior of the coach, the sound was also
> deflected to the outside. thus his db levels INCREASED to over 90.
> I know my with my coach, that I have been asked to park way downwind as
> my generator is really loud. Maybe its the dogs I carry with me???
> But, if there is a product that will absorb that sound while reflecting
> the heat, let's talk about it.
> Ernie-83PT40 in Texas, buying earplugs by the case~
>

[David Brady]

Ernie

Any insulation that's smooth is going to reflect the sound. In order
to absorb the sound you need a material with a 3 dimensional contour,
like an egg carton. You need the sort of material used in an anechoic
chamber.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anechoic_chamber

The basic idea is that the cones cause reflections that destructively
interfere with the incoming sound waves; i.e., the reflections cancel
out the noise. The dimension of the cone is on the order of the
wavelength of the noise that you're trying to cancel.

The LXi uses a material very similar to what's shown in the above
wikipedia page. People walk by the outside of the genny and don't
even notice that it's on.

David Brady
'02 LXi, NC

-----Original Message-----

From: Stephen Birtles

Sent: Feb 21, 2009 11:16 AM

To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com

Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Sound- absorption or reflection

if you look at the newer generators the sound deadening box has

baffled vents and is sealed as well as sound deadening

materials,thermostatically controlled fans and a smaller new motor

with indirect indirect injection. With all these it makes for a

quieter generator



Stephen 77fc35





--- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com", Ernie Ekberg .>

wrote:

>

> Jim, while the some of the noise was deflected down, 30 more db was

reflected to the front of the radiator. Bob's coach has the front

fan/radiator.

>

>

> Ernie Ekberg

> 83PT40

> Wanderlodge

> Weatherford, Tx

> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/erniesremodelingandrepair

>

> --- On Fri, 2/20/09, jim riordan wrote:

>

> From: jim riordan

> Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Sound- absorption or reflection

> To: "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com"

> Date: Friday, February 20, 2009, 10:01 PM

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> I would assume that the sound deading material used in these

generator compartments actually reflect the nooise down. so the noie

is forced under the coaches. Many boats and I belive that some new

coaches now have a box lined with sound deading which the generator is

placed.

>

> just a thought

>

> jim riordan

> 88 wbwl xxv

> stuart fl

>

> --- On Fri, 2/20/09, Ernest Ekberg wrote:

>

> From: Ernest Ekberg

> Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Sound- absorption or reflection

> To: WanderlodgeForum@ yahoogroups. com

> Date: Friday, February 20, 2009, 7:43 PM

>

>

>

>

> After installing many generator compartments with the new insulation, I

> was wondering if there is a manufacturer that offers both.

> I insulated Bob Lawrences' generator compartment last December. He

> measured the db levels before and after and found that while the heat

> was reflected from the interior of the coach, the sound was also

> deflected to the outside. thus his db levels INCREASED to over 90.

> I know my with my coach, that I have been asked to park way downwind as

> my generator is really loud. Maybe its the dogs I carry with me???

> But, if there is a product that will absorb that sound while reflecting

> the heat, let's talk about it.

> Ernie-83PT40 in Texas, buying earplugs by the case~

>

[Al Scudder]

I havw ONAN RS12000(12K)unit outside my bedroom window (10 Ft) and can not hear it when it is running. Insulation is a 1" thick sponge with reflecting face sheet that is lined inside of the box that the generator
sits in. Works well cant tell you how many times I have awaken in the morning to find that the power was off for 6 hours or so



Scooter 2000LX Ocqueoc, MI

---

To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
From: jqrjr@...
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 20:01:40 -0800
Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Sound- absorption or reflection

I would assume that the sound deading material used in these generator compartments actually reflect the nooise down. so the noie is forced under the coaches. Many boats and I belive that some new coaches now have a box lined with sound deading which the generator is placed. just a thought jim riordan 88 wbwl xxv stuart fl --- On Fri, 2/20/09, Ernest Ekberg com> wrote: From: Ernest Ekberg com> Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Sound- absorption or reflection To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com Date: Friday, February 20, 2009, 7:43 PM After installing many generator compartments with the new insulation, I was wondering if there is a manufacturer that offers both. I insulated Bob Lawrences' generator compartment last December. He measured the db levels before and after and found that while the heat was reflected from the interior of the coach, the sound was also deflected to the outside. thus his db levels INCREASED to over 90. I know my with my coach, that I have been asked to park way downwind as my generator is really loud. Maybe its the dogs I carry with me??? But, if there is a product that will absorb that sound while reflecting the heat, let's talk about it. Ernie-83PT40 in Texas, buying earplugs by the case~

[fishfarm2003]

Ernie - Thomasnet lists several acoustical foam suppliers near you
(Dallas, Garland, Desoto). You might try them. Here's the list:

http://tiny.cc/Ae7Up

Bob McLaughlin
Wannabe

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Ernie Ekberg
wrote:
>
> I wonder how an individual would purchase this?
>
>
> Ernie Ekberg
> 83PT40
> Wanderlodge
> Weatherford, Tx
> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/erni...gandrepair

[Bill Garamella]

Last year I insulated the doghouse of our 1983FC doghouse with 2" 2#/ft. sq.
fiberglass
and lead material that I purchased from Soundown. I followed the instructions
provided
by their rep Gary Kissal and am very happy with the results.

I have been speaking with Gary on how best to quiet down the 12.5 Yanmar/Kohler
and
he suggested several things:

To quiet outside noise, create a baffle between the fan and the exhaust louvers.

To quiet inside:

1. Apply mechanical fasteners to all surfaces to be covered
2. Apply adhesive damping material against the metal inside the generator
compartment.

"Soundown Vibration Damping Sheets and Tiles are a high performance, easily
applied,
extensional vibration dampers for reducing structural reverberant "ringing" and
structureborne noise. This material is effective on a wide range of substrates,
especially
fiberglass, aluminum, and steel. Soundown Damping Sheets are available in 1/16",
1/8",
1/4" at 54" width, and in 1'x 1' tiles in 3/8" and 1/2". We also stock a
complete line of
interlayer damping materials for many applications."

3. Apply 2" 2# ft./sq. composite insulation onto the damping material using both
mechanical fasteners and adhesive.

"Soundown's Mass Loaded Vinyl Barrier (Tuff Mass®) is available in 1/2, 1,
1-1/2, and 2
lb/ft2 densities. It is a rugged all-purpose sheet barrier with a wide range of
uses. Our
Mass Loaded Vinyl is supplied in a standard 54" and 48" width and variable roll
lengths
from 10' to 250' depending upon material configuration. Soundown Acoustic Lead
Barrier
is available in weights of 1 and 2 lb. This traditional incombustible barrier
material is
supplied in a standard 48" width, and rolls of 12', 24', or longer as required."

I have no material interest in the company other than being a very satisfied
customer.
Their exclusive function is to quiet things down and they have been doing it for
a very
long time with very expensive marine craft, and high end structures.

Here is a link to their web site. http://www.soundown.com/AI.htm#

Garry Kissal's e-,mail is gkissal@...

In lieu of the baffle which I think will be too much work, I plan to install a
quiet plastic
DC fan to the radiator (like in a car) and an aqua-stat that will keep the big
AC fan off
until higher temps are reached. I suspect this will help a lot and much of the
time we
run our genset at way less than half load.

Another factor is the use of a ProSine 2K inverter that also helps to minimize
gen run
time.

NH Bill 1983 FC "Casa Billisa"


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Birtles" wrote:
>
> if you look at the newer generators the sound deadening box has
> baffled vents and is sealed as well as sound deadening
> materials,thermostatically controlled fans and a smaller new motor
> with indirect indirect injection. With all these it makes for a
> quieter generator
>
> Stephen 77fc35
>
>
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Ernie Ekberg
> wrote:
> >
> > Jim, while the some of the noise was deflected down, 30 more db was
> reflected to the front of the radiator. Bob's coach has the front
> fan/radiator.
> >
> >
> > Ernie Ekberg
> > 83PT40
> > Wanderlodge
> > Weatherford, Tx
> > http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/erni...gandrepair
> >
> > --- On Fri, 2/20/09, jim riordan wrote:
> >
> > From: jim riordan
> > Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Sound- absorption or reflection
> > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > Date: Friday, February 20, 2009, 10:01 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I would assume that the sound deading material used in these
> generator compartments actually reflect the nooise down. so the noie
> is forced under the coaches. Many boats and I belive that some new
> coaches now have a box lined with sound deading which the generator is
> placed.
> >
> > just a thought
> >
> > jim riordan
> > 88 wbwl xxv
> > stuart fl
> >
> > --- On Fri, 2/20/09, Ernest Ekberg wrote:
> >
> > From: Ernest Ekberg
> > Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Sound- absorption or reflection
> > To: WanderlodgeForum@ yahoogroups. com
> > Date: Friday, February 20, 2009, 7:43 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > After installing many generator compartments with the new insulation, I
> > was wondering if there is a manufacturer that offers both.
> > I insulated Bob Lawrences' generator compartment last December. He
> > measured the db levels before and after and found that while the heat
> > was reflected from the interior of the coach, the sound was also
> > deflected to the outside. thus his db levels INCREASED to over 90.
> > I know my with my coach, that I have been asked to park way downwind as
> > my generator is really loud. Maybe its the dogs I carry with me???
> > But, if there is a product that will absorb that sound while reflecting
> > the heat, let's talk about it.
> > Ernie-83PT40 in Texas, buying earplugs by the case~
> >
>

[Ernie Ekberg]

Thanks, Bill, very good information. The worst part of the generators that some of us have is that the fan is belt driven off the engine. Ernie Ekberg 83PT40 Wanderlodge Weatherford, Tx http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/erni...gandrepair --- On Sat, 2/21/09, Bill Garamella wrote: From: Bill Garamella Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Sound- absorption or reflection To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, February 21, 2009, 12:35 PM Last year I insulated the doghouse of our 1983FC doghouse with 2" 2#/ft. sq. fiberglass and lead material that I purchased from Soundown. I followed the instructions provided by their rep Gary Kissal and am very happy with the results. I have been speaking with Gary on how best to quiet down the 12.5 Yanmar/Kohler and he suggested several things: To quiet outside noise, create a baffle between the fan and the exhaust louvers. To quiet inside: 1. Apply mechanical fasteners to all surfaces to be covered 2. Apply adhesive damping material against the metal inside the generator compartment. "Soundown Vibration Damping Sheets and Tiles are a high performance, easily applied, extensional vibration dampers for reducing structural reverberant "ringing" and structureborne noise. This material is effective on a wide range of substrates, especially fiberglass, aluminum, and steel. Soundown Damping Sheets are available in 1/16", 1/8", 1/4" at 54" width, and in 1'x 1' tiles in 3/8" and 1/2". We also stock a complete line of interlayer damping materials for many applications. " 3. Apply 2" 2# ft./sq. composite insulation onto the damping material using both mechanical fasteners and adhesive. "Soundown's Mass Loaded Vinyl Barrier (Tuff Mass®) is available in 1/2, 1, 1-1/2, and 2 lb/ft2 densities. It is a rugged all-purpose sheet barrier with a wide range of uses. Our Mass Loaded Vinyl is supplied in a standard 54" and 48" width and variable roll lengths from 10' to 250' depending upon material configuration. Soundown Acoustic Lead Barrier is available in weights of 1 and 2 lb. This traditional incombustible barrier material is supplied in a standard 48" width, and rolls of 12', 24', or longer as required." I have no material interest in the company other than being a very satisfied customer. Their exclusive function is to quiet things down and they have been doing it for a very long time with very expensive marine craft, and high end structures. Here is a link to their web site. http://www.soundown .com/AI.htm# Garry Kissal's e-,mail is "gkissal%40soundown.com" In lieu of the baffle which I think will be too much work, I plan to install a quiet plastic DC fan to the radiator (like in a car) and an aqua-stat that will keep the big AC fan off until higher temps are reached. I suspect this will help a lot and much of the time we run our genset at way less than half load. Another factor is the use of a ProSine 2K inverter that also helps to minimize gen run time. NH Bill 1983 FC "Casa Billisa" --- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com", "Stephen Birtles" wrote: > > if you look at the newer generators the sound deadening box has > baffled vents and is sealed as well as sound deadening > materials,thermosta tically controlled fans and a smaller new motor > with indirect indirect injection. With all these it makes for a > quieter generator > > Stephen 77fc35 > > > > --- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com", Ernie Ekberg > wrote: > > > > Jim, while the some of the noise was deflected down, 30 more db was > reflected to the front of the radiator. Bob's coach has the front > fan/radiator. > > > > > > Ernie Ekberg > > 83PT40 > > Wanderlodge > > Weatherford, Tx > > http://autos. groups.yahoo. com/group/ erniesremodeling andrepair > > > > --- On Fri, 2/20/09, jim riordan wrote: > > > > From: jim riordan > > Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Sound- absorption or reflection > > To: "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com" > > Date: Friday, February 20, 2009, 10:01 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I would assume that the sound deading material used in these > generator compartments actually reflect the nooise down. so the noie > is forced under the coaches. Many boats and I belive that some new > coaches now have a box lined with sound deading which the generator is > placed. > > > > just a thought > > > > jim riordan > > 88 wbwl xxv > > stuart fl > > > > --- On Fri, 2/20/09, Ernest Ekberg wrote: > > > > From: Ernest Ekberg > > Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Sound- absorption or reflection > > To: WanderlodgeForum@ yahoogroups. com > > Date: Friday, February 20, 2009, 7:43 PM > > > > > > > > > > After installing many generator compartments with the new insulation, I > > was wondering if there is a manufacturer that offers both. > > I insulated Bob Lawrences' generator compartment last December. He > > measured the db levels before and after and found that while the heat > > was reflected from the interior of the coach, the sound was also > > deflected to the outside. thus his db levels INCREASED to over 90. > > I know my with my coach, that I have been asked to park way downwind as > > my generator is really loud. Maybe its the dogs I carry with me??? > > But, if there is a product that will absorb that sound while reflecting > > the heat, let's talk about it. > > Ernie-83PT40 in Texas, buying earplugs by the case~ > > >

[Chuck Wheeler]

I tried a little different approach to the fan noise on our FC. I scouted the local salvage yards and found a fan and viscous clutch that would fit the electric fan motor. It reduced the fan noise greatly and I still have some air flow through the genset area to keep the heat down. I have only heard it fully engage a couple of times while we were at a rest area on interstate 8 and it was 109 degrees outside.

- Chuck Wheeler-

1982 FC 31SB Fort Worth TX

---

From: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com [mailto:WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ernie Ekberg
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2009 12:46 PM
To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Sound- absorption or reflection

Thanks, Bill, very good information. The worst part of the generators that some of us have is that the fan is belt driven off the engine. Ernie Ekberg 83PT40 Wanderlodge Weatherford, Tx http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/erniesremodelingandrepair --- On Sat, 2/21/09, Bill Garamella yahoo.com> wrote: From: Bill Garamella yahoo.com> Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Sound- absorption or reflection To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, February 21, 2009, 12:35 PM Last year I insulated the doghouse of our 1983FC doghouse with 2" 2#/ft. sq. fiberglass and lead material that I purchased from Soundown. I followed the instructions provided by their rep Gary Kissal and am very happy with the results. I have been speaking with Gary on how best to quiet down the 12.5 Yanmar/Kohler and he suggested several things: To quiet outside noise, create a baffle between the fan and the exhaust louvers. To quiet inside: 1. Apply mechanical fasteners to all surfaces to be covered 2. Apply adhesive damping material against the metal inside the generator compartment. "Soundown Vibration Damping Sheets and Tiles are a high performance, easily applied, extensional vibration dampers for reducing structural reverberant "ringing" and structureborne noise. This material is effective on a wide range of substrates, especially fiberglass, aluminum, and steel. Soundown Damping Sheets are available in 1/16", 1/8", 1/4" at 54" width, and in 1'x 1' tiles in 3/8" and 1/2". We also stock a complete line of interlayer damping materials for many applications. " 3. Apply 2" 2# ft./sq. composite insulation onto the damping material using both mechanical fasteners and adhesive. "Soundown's Mass Loaded Vinyl Barrier (Tuff Mass® is available in 1/2, 1, 1-1/2, and 2 lb/ft2 densities. It is a rugged all-purpose sheet barrier with a wide range of uses. Our Mass Loaded Vinyl is supplied in a standard 54" and 48" width and variable roll lengths from 10' to 250' depending upon material configuration. Soundown Acoustic Lead Barrier is available in weights of 1 and 2 lb. This traditional incombustible barrier material is supplied in a standard 48" width, and rolls of 12', 24', or longer as required." I have no material interest in the company other than being a very satisfied customer. Their exclusive function is to quiet things down and they have been doing it for a very long time with very expensive marine craft, and high end structures. Here is a link to their web site. http://www.soundown .com/AI.htm# Garry Kissal's e-,mail is "gkissal%40soundown.com" In lieu of the baffle which I think will be too much work, I plan to install a quiet plastic DC fan to the radiator (like in a car) and an aqua-stat that will keep the big AC fan off until higher temps are reached. I suspect this will help a lot and much of the time we run our genset at way less than half load. Another factor is the use of a ProSine 2K inverter that also helps to minimize gen run time. NH Bill 1983 FC "Casa Billisa" --- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com", "Stephen Birtles" wrote: > > if you look at the newer generators the sound deadening box has > baffled vents and is sealed as well as sound deadening > materials,thermosta tically controlled fans and a smaller new motor > with indirect indirect injection. With all these it makes for a > quieter generator > > Stephen 77fc35 > > > > --- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com", Ernie Ekberg > wrote: > > > > Jim, while the some of the noise was deflected down, 30 more db was > reflected to the front of the radiator. Bob's coach has the front > fan/radiator. > > > > > > Ernie Ekberg > > 83PT40 > > Wanderlodge > > Weatherford, Tx > > http://autos. groups.yahoo. com/group/ erniesremodeling andrepair > > > > --- On Fri, 2/20/09, jim riordan wrote: > > > > From: jim riordan > > Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Sound- absorption or reflection > > To: "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com" > > Date: Friday, February 20, 2009, 10:01 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I would assume that the sound deading material used in these > generator compartments actually reflect the nooise down. so the noie > is forced under the coaches. Many boats and I belive that some new > coaches now have a box lined with sound deading which the generator is > placed. > > > > just a thought > > > > jim riordan > > 88 wbwl xxv > > stuart fl > > > > --- On Fri, 2/20/09, Ernest Ekberg wrote: > > > > From: Ernest Ekberg > > Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Sound- absorption or reflection > > To: WanderlodgeForum@ yahoogroups. com > > Date: Friday, February 20, 2009, 7:43 PM > > > > > > > > > > After installing many generator compartments with the new insulation, I > > was wondering if there is a manufacturer that offers both. > > I insulated Bob Lawrences' generator compartment last December. He > > measured the db levels before and after and found that while the heat > > was reflected from the interior of the coach, the sound was also > > deflected to the outside. thus his db levels INCREASED to over 90. > > I know my with my coach, that I have been asked to park way downwind as > > my generator is really loud. Maybe its the dogs I carry with me??? > > But, if there is a product that will absorb that sound while reflecting > > the heat, let's talk about it. > > Ernie-83PT40 in Texas, buying earplugs by the case~ > > >

[timvasqz]

Not too far fetched. My cummins engine computer is cooled with
diesel fuel. I am just curious where you were transfering heat to
with your 'insulation heat dissipation remanufacture redesign'

heat is transfered and lost to other objects. for one thing to lose
heat somthing else must take it. its a calorie calc. when you
insulate to keep heat from the interior of the bus where does that
heat now go?

some times when an interior gets hot and calls for modification it
is an overlooked sign that the heat producer has other issues causing
excessive heat. KurtH can atest. in a genset the genhead may be
cooking or engine exhaust is screwed up.

Greg ofTim&Greg
94ptca



WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Birtles"
wrote:
>
> why thank you for the mindless dribble another useless comment
>
> Stephen 77fc35
>
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "timvasqz" wrote:
> >
> > To disipate heat, is to transfer it. Steve maybe you can disapate
it
> > thru a dupree valve back to the tank? Call it Hot$$$$ ?
> >
> > I understand that the vault gets up to +250 degrees(USA). I
guess
> > that is a factor for Ernie to consider once he removed the
disipation
> > path of the vault heat to the bus interior. where does that
heat
> > now go.
> >
> > Insulation keeps environments from disapating heat. heat is
removed
> > so the method to remove the heat in the compartment would now be
the
> > radiator system and the diesel engine is the heat sink, but the
> > diesel engine caused most of the heat. If the origional design
was
> > not intended to do that it would have to be beefed up
> >
> > If you insulate the exhaust the otherwise exposed metal does not
> > radiate heat in the compartment. heat goes out the stack with the
> > exhast air. But is the stack able to take all the extra heat.
> >
> > If someone complains to me about the noise my genset is making I
> > say "What? can't hear you, my genset is too loud".
> > GregofTim&Greg
> > 94ptCa
> >
> >
> >
> > In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Birtles"

> > wrote:
> > >
> > > We will look into re manufacturing or redesigning a similar
product
> > > that will work as sound absorption as well as heat dissipation
> > > It will take some time to get a satisfactory product.
> > > Stephen 77fc35
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ernest Ekberg"
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > After installing many generator compartments with the new
> > insulation, I
> > > > was wondering if there is a manufacturer that offers both.
> > > > I insulated Bob Lawrences' generator compartment last
December.
> > He
> > > > measured the db levels before and after and found that while
the
> > heat
> > > > was reflected from the interior of the coach, the sound was
also
> > > > deflected to the outside. thus his db levels INCREASED to
over
> > 90.
> > > > I know my with my coach, that I have been asked to park way
> > downwind as
> > > > my generator is really loud. Maybe its the dogs I carry with
me???
> > > > But, if there is a product that will absorb that sound while
> > reflecting
> > > > the heat, let's talk about it.
> > > > Ernie-83PT40 in Texas, buying earplugs by the case~
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

[Kurt Horvath]

I would say that careful inspections are the order of the day to keep
your coach in top form and you safe.

I'm not up to snuff on this post but in my case the new exhaust,
exhaust blankets on the new Stainless pipes (18ga.) and a soon to be
installed thermal and acoustic insulation in the engine compartment
she'll be cool, quite and efficient The blankets and the SS pipes are
rated at over 2000 degrees continuous duty. So the hottest parts are
insulated and the hottest gasses are directed out and away from the
motor. I did install 2 - 1650 cfm electric fans in the engine
compartment, to take care of any other residual heating problems.
I don't see how insulating any Bird compartment would be detrimental.
I can't imagine any engineer using the coach in any calculation as a
heat sink, to dissipate any heat from the engine or generator

Isn't that what radiators and exhausts are for.?

I'll redo the insulation in the genny compartment when I do the main
engine area.

Look at any Prevost conversion the generators are mostly in enclosed
compartments, Birds , at least the PT series are completely open
underneath. I would not worry about maximum insulation in the genny
box. When driving you get air flow, when parked the blower is sucking
air in from some where, some is air is flowing through the genny
box , along with the manifold, exhaust and valve cover blankets it's
already retaining/containing a lot of heat internally that can only
be removed through the exhaust and radiator. If after insulating you
see higher temps. Install a lower temp. thermostat.

After my near miss at burning up my coach I'd like to ask the forum a
question.

Has anybody ever checked the condition of the Generator exhaust stack
that goes up through the body? And how would we go about checking it?
It has the potential to be a serious issue should it be leaking
exhaust fumes into the coach.

In my coach the Genny Stack is located next to the Fridge. How well
insulated is it? Maybe that's why my Fridge works great when parked
but doesn't when I'm driving. I almost always run the generator when
driving, and yes it's running while parked if not at a place it can
be plugged in to. So is it part of my Fridge cooling problem? Maybe,
any thoughts?

Kurt Horvath
95 PT 42
10AC


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "timvasqz" wrote:
>
> Not too far fetched. My cummins engine computer is cooled with
> diesel fuel. I am just curious where you were transfering heat to
> with your 'insulation heat dissipation remanufacture redesign'
>
> heat is transfered and lost to other objects. for one thing to
lose
> heat somthing else must take it. its a calorie calc. when you
> insulate to keep heat from the interior of the bus where does that
> heat now go?
>
> some times when an interior gets hot and calls for modification it
> is an overlooked sign that the heat producer has other issues
causing
> excessive heat. KurtH can atest. in a genset the genhead may be
> cooking or engine exhaust is screwed up.
>
> Greg ofTim&Greg
> 94ptca
>
>
>
> WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Birtles"
> wrote:
> >
> > why thank you for the mindless dribble another useless comment
> >
> > Stephen 77fc35
> >
> >
> > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "timvasqz" > wrote:
> > >
> > > To disipate heat, is to transfer it. Steve maybe you can
disapate
> it
> > > thru a dupree valve back to the tank? Call it Hot$$$$ ?
> > >
> > > I understand that the vault gets up to +250 degrees(USA). I
> guess
> > > that is a factor for Ernie to consider once he removed the
> disipation
> > > path of the vault heat to the bus interior. where does that
> heat
> > > now go.
> > >
> > > Insulation keeps environments from disapating heat. heat is
> removed
> > > so the method to remove the heat in the compartment would now
be
> the
> > > radiator system and the diesel engine is the heat sink, but
the
> > > diesel engine caused most of the heat. If the origional design
> was
> > > not intended to do that it would have to be beefed up
> > >
> > > If you insulate the exhaust the otherwise exposed metal does
not
> > > radiate heat in the compartment. heat goes out the stack with
the
> > > exhast air. But is the stack able to take all the extra heat.
> > >
> > > If someone complains to me about the noise my genset is making
I
> > > say "What? can't hear you, my genset is too loud".
> > > GregofTim&Greg
> > > 94ptCa
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Birtles"
>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > We will look into re manufacturing or redesigning a similar
> product
> > > > that will work as sound absorption as well as heat
dissipation
> > > > It will take some time to get a satisfactory product.
> > > > Stephen 77fc35
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ernest Ekberg"
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > After installing many generator compartments with the new
> > > insulation, I
> > > > > was wondering if there is a manufacturer that offers both.
> > > > > I insulated Bob Lawrences' generator compartment last
> December.
> > > He
> > > > > measured the db levels before and after and found that
while
> the
> > > heat
> > > > > was reflected from the interior of the coach, the sound was
> also
> > > > > deflected to the outside. thus his db levels INCREASED to
> over
> > > 90.
> > > > > I know my with my coach, that I have been asked to park way
> > > downwind as
> > > > > my generator is really loud. Maybe its the dogs I carry
with
> me???
> > > > > But, if there is a product that will absorb that sound
while
> > > reflecting
> > > > > the heat, let's talk about it.
> > > > > Ernie-83PT40 in Texas, buying earplugs by the case~
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

[Ernie Ekberg]

David, I would also assume that if the new insulation is too thick and takes up too much room, that it would restrict air flow? Ernie Ekberg 83PT40 Wanderlodge Weatherford, Tx http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/erni...gandrepair --- On Sun, 2/22/09, david brady wrote: From: david brady Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Sound- absorption or reflection To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, February 22, 2009, 8:39 AM I pulled this out of the Powertech manual: (for what it's worth), "Each engine is equipped with a high water temperature shutdown switch, which will automatically shut down the set if the operating temperature climbs too high. To prevent the generator set from shutting down make sure the compartment openings are large enough to allow adequate circulation of cooling air. The minimum free air opening in the compartment door is 400 sq. in. or 2580 sq. cm. Remember that louvers, screens and protective grills will restrict airflow. A relatively open mesh screen will restrict airflow as much as 45%. The intake opening must be increased to compensate for such restrictions. " David '02 LXi, NC Kurt Horvath wrote: I would say that careful inspections are the order of the day to keep your coach in top form and you safe. I'm not up to snuff on this post but in my case the new exhaust, exhaust blankets on the new Stainless pipes (18ga.) and a soon to be installed thermal and acoustic insulation in the engine compartment she'll be cool, quite and efficient The blankets and the SS pipes are rated at over 2000 degrees continuous duty. So the hottest parts are insulated and the hottest gasses are directed out and away from the motor. I did install 2 - 1650 cfm electric fans in the engine compartment, to take care of any other residual heating problems. I don't see how insulating any Bird compartment would be detrimental. I can't imagine any engineer using the coach in any calculation as a heat sink, to dissipate any heat from the engine or generator Isn't that what radiators and exhausts are for.? I'll redo the insulation in the genny compartment when I do the main engine area. Look at any Prevost conversion the generators are mostly in enclosed compartments, Birds , at least the PT series are completely open underneath. I would not worry about maximum insulation in the genny box. When driving you get air flow, when parked the blower is sucking air in from some where, some is air is flowing through the genny box , along with the manifold, exhaust and valve cover blankets it's already retaining/containin g a lot of heat internally that can only be removed through the exhaust and radiator. If after insulating you see higher temps. Install a lower temp. thermostat. After my near miss at burning up my coach I'd like to ask the forum a question. Has anybody ever checked the condition of the Generator exhaust stack that goes up through the body? And how would we go about checking it? It has the potential to be a serious issue should it be leaking exhaust fumes into the coach. In my coach the Genny Stack is located next to the Fridge. How well insulated is it? Maybe that's why my Fridge works great when parked but doesn't when I'm driving. I almost always run the generator when driving, and yes it's running while parked if not at a place it can be plugged in to. So is it part of my Fridge cooling problem? Maybe, any thoughts? Kurt Horvath 95 PT 42 10AC --- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com", "timvasqz" wrote: > > Not too far fetched. My cummins engine computer is cooled with > diesel fuel. I am just curious where you were transfering heat to > with your 'insulation heat dissipation remanufacture redesign' > > heat is transfered and lost to other objects. for one thing to lose > heat somthing else must take it. its a calorie calc. when you > insulate to keep heat from the interior of the bus where does that > heat now go? > > some times when an interior gets hot and calls for modification it > is an overlooked sign that the heat producer has other issues causing > excessive heat. KurtH can atest. in a genset the genhead may be > cooking or engine exhaust is screwed up. > > Greg ofTim&Greg > 94ptca > > > > "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com", "Stephen Birtles" > wrote: > > > > why thank you for the mindless dribble another useless comment > > > > Stephen 77fc35 > > > > > > --- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com", "timvasqz" > wrote: > > > > > > To disipate heat, is to transfer it. Steve maybe you can disapate > it > > > thru a dupree valve back to the tank? Call it Hot$$$$ ? > > > > > > I understand that the vault gets up to +250 degrees(USA) . I > guess > > > that is a factor for Ernie to consider once he removed the > disipation > > > path of the vault heat to the bus interior. where does that > heat > > > now go. > > > > > > Insulation keeps environments from disapating heat. heat is > removed > > > so the method to remove the heat in the compartment would now be > the > > > radiator system and the diesel engine is the heat sink, but the > > > diesel engine caused most of the heat. If the origional design > was > > > not intended to do that it would have to be beefed up > > > > > > If you insulate the exhaust the otherwise exposed metal does not > > > radiate heat in the compartment. heat goes out the stack with the > > > exhast air. But is the stack able to take all the extra heat. > > > > > > If someone complains to me about the noise my genset is making I > > > say "What? can't hear you, my genset is too loud". > > > GregofTim&Greg > > > 94ptCa > > > > > > > > > > > > In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com", "Stephen Birtles" > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > We will look into re manufacturing or redesigning a similar > product > > > > that will work as sound absorption as well as heat dissipation > > > > It will take some time to get a satisfactory product. > > > > Stephen 77fc35 > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com", "Ernest Ekberg" > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > After installing many generator compartments with the new > > > insulation, I > > > > > was wondering if there is a manufacturer that offers both. > > > > > I insulated Bob Lawrences' generator compartment last > December. > > > He > > > > > measured the db levels before and after and found that while > the > > > heat > > > > > was reflected from the interior of the coach, the sound was > also > > > > > deflected to the outside. thus his db levels INCREASED to > over > > > 90. > > > > > I know my with my coach, that I have been asked to park way > > > downwind as > > > > > my generator is really loud. Maybe its the dogs I carry with > me??? > > > > > But, if there is a product that will absorb that sound while > > > reflecting > > > > > the heat, let's talk about it. > > > > > Ernie-83PT40 in Texas, buying earplugs by the case~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.11.2/1965 - Release Date: 2/21/2009 3:36 PM