LXi and WideBody PTO/Pump Splines

[pgchin]

(05-28-2013 12:41)davidmbrady Wrote:  Wow Pete! BTDT!

I know what a great feeling it is to have a new PTO/Pump unit installed! Congrats! I'm sure you're enjoying the smooth and quiet operation that comes with new. Are you also going to look into your fan speed control? It may be worth while to take a photo tachometer to the system to get a baseline for speeds. At this point the only items that could impact fan speed are the controller and the fan motor.

I couldn't agree more about the 2 1/4" u-pipe and flexible hose couplings. I couldn't budge one of them. I also hauled mine down to my local hydraulics shop for them to separate the couplings. They clamped it to their mongo vice, grabbed a 4' cheater pipe, and brought over their forklift to apply pressure the the cheater bar! It popped! I don't know what's up with those large connections - there may be some galling going on that welds them together.

On the LXi style lowered chassis models I was able to hold the combined PTO/Pump assembly up with one hand while I positioned the bolts with the other. In fact, I did it twice, which is usually my luck. The first time I put the PTO/Pump assembly together after topping up with fluid and starting the coach I noticed that the seal at the PTO shaft was leaking (at the grease fitting side). So, I drained the fluid a second time, took it all apart, brought down the PTO/Pump as a single assy, installed a new seal and lifted it back up with one hand and bolted it in place with the other. Don't mess with me, I'm a Hercules! Not!

Way to go Pete! I'm glad you go that job done!

David,
First , if you did that job twice on an LXI by yourself and removed and installed the pump and PTO as one assembly.... you ARE Hercules!!!!!!! I have chicken wings for arms and a Bird chest!!!!!! Now you know why I own a bird!!!!!!
As for the fan and controller, I had a new fan motor installed in 2007, seeping seal....... on the 95, 96, and not sure about 97, we have the DDEC III, you have IV. Anyway with DDEC III you only have 2 speeds on the fan......low and high and you can hear the difference, we are not variable like you.....that's another reason, as you stated in previous posts, LXI's DDECIV's get better mileage than us and your fan speed is variable, but yes I keep an eye on the controller and did make sure the fan worked in both modes! Thanks for the tips and reminding me to mention this as that is why I road tested it to get it up to temp for the low/ high fan check and to work out any remaining air bubbles in the system. Also for those of you with DDECC IV / LXI, please look at David's suggestion about fan speed. Since you have variable, check the motor and controller. You DO NOT want to do this job only to loose the engine to a bad fan motor or controller!!!!! Very IMPORTANT. thanks David for mentioning it for our LXI owners! Tips/ clues here is loss of mileage and an s60 that runs warm....... IF that occurs, then the photo tachomoeter deal would be a good thing to do as David mentioned! Many things can affect mileage but tuned up s60's usually hold strong so just be aware of the signs as David mentioned!
Yes, and nothing like doing that job and the old bird comes online smoothly!!!!!! What a FABULOUS feeling, you are 100% correct! Hummm since I saved the labor cost on this job, I guess I am entitled to by a new toy or some bling!

[davidbrady]

(05-28-2013 13:21)pgchin Wrote:  First , if you did that job twice on an LXI by yourself and removed and installed the pump and PTO as one assembly.... you ARE Hercules!!!!!!!

It was pure adrenaline Pete!

[al perna]

is there a way to inspect as to whether you have a wet system on the PTO . I would love to think this conversion has been done . If it is not done , any recommendations .

[davidbrady]

Al,

There's at a minimum one pressure line coming from the transmission and terminating at the Chelsea PTO. This line supplies transmission lubricant to the PTO gears. If you have a wet spline kit then you'll have a second line that Tees off the transmission line at the PTO and terminates at the PTO/Pump cavity - hose 329057 in the attached pic. This line supplies pressurized fluid to the splines. So, a wet spline has an extra pressure line and a Tee.

[al perna]

David
I will cross my fingers and check it in the morning , thanks for the drawing .

[pgchin]

Al,
If you have the wet spline kit, you will see the "tee" David talks about at the bottom of the transmission, back of the coach, curb side. You can see it without crawling under right by where the tranny filters are. If you see a "tee" and 2 lines, you got it, 1 line, you have grease.

[cmillsap]

While my bus is in the repair shop, they checked the condition of my PTO and said it was abnormally noisy. I have asked them to try to determine if it is the pump or the looseness in the PTO spline. Anyway, I decided it is a good time to upgrade the PTO, so I added that to the list. I am having it upgraded to the wet spline I" shaft & pump.

On another subject regarding the slide top trim rail. The repair shop has a good body repair shop on site so they are repairing the trim piece. They called HWH for a replacement part and was told the HWH does not carry the part anymore. and they have been unable to duplicate elsewhere. So, they are going to reuse to broken trim piece and ure Sikaflex 221 and flat headed rivits to secure it in place.

[davidbrady]

Thanks for the update Chuck. I think you're doing the right thing with the Pump/PTO. When upgrading to the 1" shaft it's my opinion that it's plenty strong enough to wet spline - no fears of excessive wear and metal shavings landing in the transmission. I'd do the same.

[cmillsap]

(05-28-2013 12:41)davidmbrady Wrote:  Wow Pete! BTDT!

I couldn't agree more about the 2 1/4" u-pipe and flexible hose couplings. I couldn't budge one of them. I also hauled mine down to my local hydraulics shop for them to separate the couplings. They clamped it to their mongo vice, grabbed a 4' cheater pipe, and brought over their forklift to apply pressure the the cheater bar! It popped! I don't know what's up with those large connections - there may be some galling going on that welds them together.

They had the same problem with my u-line but they did get it loosened.
The couplings may have "locking taper threads" on one side which are very difficult to loosen once tightened and not disturbed for a few years.

---

I'm posting a few pics below to show folks that the 7/8" PTO can be rebuilt as a 1" greasable or wet splined PTO. I am sure that the cost is much less than a new PTO, but at this time I do not have all the invoices to say exactly what the cost is.

It includes the -129 Kit, 3 new larger bearings, end cap to receive the 1" pump & an end cap to replace the cap with the grease fitting.

More to come

[cmillsap]

Sometimes it just easier to replace the rigid U-Line pipe with all new hose.