Aqua Hot performance

[George Burke]

Hello Wayne, Read your post with interest, and had to get up and check downstairs on my antifreeze jug, which is the Extended life 5 yr. or 50,000 mile stuff. This antifreeze is better than the older variety, and at 50/50 will protect down to -34 degrees. At 70/30, it goes down to -84 degrees, with your 60/40 mix being somewhere in between. Here in the Charlotte, N.C. area, I don't think that in my life its ever gotten below 5 or 6 degrees, so I will use 0 as a base. You are getting on the right track by lowering your mixture ratio, because water is still the best at transferring heat, but of course it doesn't offer much freeze protection. I have always used a 50/50 mix here, mainly because the anti-corrosive properties are higher at that ratio, not that I needed the lower freeze protection. Of course all the mfg.s of this stuff recommended  a 50/50/ mix, even in the south. They love to sell you more. I now wonder if this newer 5 yr. stuff has a higher amount of anti-corrosive properties in it, and then I could get away with using  a 40 antifreeze/60 water mixture, being getting rid of heat is needed more here than anything else. I don't know where you are from, or where you travel to, as your last couple of posts don't say, but I wouldn't use any higher mixture than necessary to protect your Bird. Good Luck with your problem, I hope you get it solved soon. Are there any experts here on this forum that have kept up with the new and improved 5 yr. antifreeze? If so, I would like to know the latest on this stuff. You use to be able to replenish your antifreezes anticorrosive ability yrs. ago, but I haven't seen or even heard of it in many years. Anyone know if it is still available? Hope I have helped you a bit. Regards, George Burke 1977 FC31 Charlotte

On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 1:21 AM, Wayne Kotila <"waynekotila@yahoo.com"> wrote:

 

Marty insulating the hoses is a good idea and insulating the windows, I think those single pane windows are like large heat exchangers radiating cold into the rv. I took my inside  warmer (53 deg F).  

Wayne kotila

96PT42

---

From: 95 BMC 37 <"martingregg598@msn.com">
To: "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com"

Sent: Mon, February 28, 2011 10:35:25 AM

Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Aqua Hot performance

 

If your 3 electric toe kick heaters will keep the coach warm and they produce a couple of thousand BTUs each, it only makes since that the A/H should do a better job as they produce 2 times the heat, each. There must be a problem? I do a lot of cold camping, last weekend it was 9 deg in Republic WA. and I keep the coach at the temp I wanted. I have done a few things to improve the system. All the hoses run along the side of the coach next to the exterior skin in the bays, so I moved them a little and encased them in pipe insulation everywhere I could, and two of the hoses ran outside to the front of the coach so I encased those in pipe insulation. One thing I do know is that the burner runs a lot when it's that cold, and diesel cost a lot, so I too heat with electric and supplement with the A/H. I also made window inserts out of ¼" white packing foam stuff, and keep the blinds down except in the sun.

Marty Gregg
95 BMC 37
Kennewick
WA

[Eric]

Wayne,

In the nearly 7 years I have been full timing I have read nearly every post on
most of the BB web sites. I don't remember any discussions about the
inadequacies of the heating in the front of our coaches, particularily the
mid-90's coaches. Many of us are reluctant to mention anything that suggests
that our rigs are less than perfect. This is one area that my rig falls short
of being "just great".

My point is: maybe it is just my coach that has inadequate heating in the
forward portion of the coach. Both the AquaHot heating system is inadequate and
the electric heat is inadequate. I've been very statisfied with the confort of
the bus if I suppliment the heating with one (sometimes even two) electric
heaters in temperatures below 40 degrees.

I would be very interested to read posts from mid-90's coach owners who say "my
BB installed heating system works just fine and is fully adequate." I would
then inquire what I am doing wrong.

Eric Perplies
96' PT-42

[Wayne Kotila]

Hi Eric, I have discovered several issues that reduced the output of the Aqua Hot. The first was the fuel pump pressure was 20 psi to low, John at parliament coach tested it and adjusted it to the proper pressure. This greatly improved the output of the diesel burner, before, when multiple zones were running the burner could not keep up so it ran constant and the coach got colder. Now with all zones running the burner will bring the boiler fluid to the max temp and shut off.I also had a heavy antifreeze to water ratio,I thinned it out to try to get back to a 50/50 mix, this ratio is supposed to be much more efficient at transferring heat.

On my system the kitchen and living room are one zone using 3 -10,000 BTU heat exchangers, I question weather the size of the piping and the volume of the pump are adequate to supply30,000BTU from this one zone. The front of the coach is definitelythe highest heat demandarea with the windshield and all the windows on both sides it's almost allglass up front. On top of all that heat loss from all the single pane windows, the door is also up front and the door gasketing on my coach is bad. I picked up a door seal kit from Parliament and am going to replace that and try to bend the bottom of the door in because it is bowed out slightly preventing a good seal. The last issueI discovered is that one of the fans on the Aqua Hot heat exchanger below the dash isn't working so one half of that exchanger has little or no air moving across it, this would reduce the output in the highest heat demand area of the
coach. I am going to try to access the fan and replace it. In reality a 50,000BTU system should be adequate to heat our coach's if everything is running properly and the system is properly designed to the deliver those BTU's to the coach and in the required amounts to meet the demands of each area. I live in Minnesota and do most of my heating with a 45,000 BTU geo thermal heat pump, It's a 23 year old house with over 3000 sq ft and alot of windows and I use the heat pump down to -10 F, if it's gets colder than that I switch to the gas furnace. The point is that the 45,000 Btu heat pump heats way more sq ft with alot more windows and doors and keeps the house at 70 deg F so the 50,000 BTU Aqua Hot should be able to keep our coach's warm, I will post weather or not mine can after Ireplace my bad fan.

Wayne kotila

96PT42

---

From: Eric To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, March 4, 2011 7:29:28 PM
Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Aqua Hot performance

Wayne,

In the nearly 7 years I have been full timing I have read nearly every post on most of the BB web sites. I don't remember any discussions about the inadequacies of the heating in the front of our coaches, particularily the mid-90's coaches. Many of us are reluctant to mention anything that suggests that our rigs are less than perfect. This is one area that my rig falls short of being "just great".

My point is: maybe it is just my coach that has inadequate heating in the forward portion of the coach. Both the AquaHot heating system is inadequate and the electric heat is inadequate. I've been very statisfied with the confort of the bus if I suppliment the heating with one (sometimes even two) electric heaters in temperatures below 40 degrees.

I would be very interested to read posts from mid-90's coach owners who say "my BB installed heating system works just fine and is fully adequate." I would then inquire what I am
doing wrong.

Eric Perplies
96' PT-42

[Wayne Kotila]

Hi George I am from Minnesota and a 50/50 mix is definitely needed here. I know you can buy test strips to test antifreeze for multiple things at truck stops. You can also buy test strips to test boiler fluid at home store's, in our area Menards sells the test strips, boiler fluid and additive to neutralize the acidity if it's to high. I was told that the strips work for ethylene glycol or propylene glycol antifreeze.

Good Luck

Wayne Kotila

96PT42

---

From: George Burke
To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, March 4, 2011 1:26:49 AM
Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Aqua Hot performance

Hello Wayne, Read your post with interest, and had to get up and check downstairs on my antifreeze jug, which is the Extended life 5 yr. or 50,000 mile stuff. This antifreeze is better than the older variety, and at 50/50 will protect down to -34 degrees. At 70/30, it goes down to -84 degrees, with your 60/40 mix being somewhere in between. Here in the Charlotte, N.C. area, I don't think that in my life its ever gotten below 5 or 6 degrees, so I will use 0 as a base. You are getting on the right track by lowering your mixture ratio, because water is still the best at transferring heat, but of course it doesn't offer much freeze protection. I have always used a 50/50 mix here, mainly because the anti-corrosive properties are higher at that ratio, not that I needed the lower freeze protection. Of course all the mfg.s of this stuff recommended a 50/50/ mix, even in the south. They love to sell you more. I now wonder if this newer 5 yr. stuff has a
higher amount of anti-corrosive properties in it, and then I could get away with using a 40 antifreeze/60 water mixture, being getting rid of heat is needed more here than anything else. I don't know where you are from, or where you travel to, as your last couple of posts don't say, but I wouldn't use any higher mixture than necessary to protect your Bird. Good Luck with your problem, I hope you get it solved soon. Are there any experts here on this forum that have kept up with the new and improved 5 yr. antifreeze? If so, I would like to know the latest on this stuff. You use to be able to replenish your antifreezes anticorrosive ability yrs. ago, but I haven't seen or even heard of it in many years. Anyone know if it is still available? Hope I have helped you a bit. Regards, George Burke 1977 FC31 Charlotte

On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 1:21 AM, Wayne Kotila <"waynekotila@yahoo.com"> wrote:

Marty insulating the hoses is a good idea and insulating the windows, I think those single pane windows are like large heat exchangers radiating cold into the rv.I took my inside warmer (53 degF).

Wayne kotila

96PT42

---

From: 95 BMC 37 <"martingregg598@msn.com">
To: "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com"
Sent: Mon, February 28, 2011 10:35:25 AM

Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Aqua Hot performance

If your 3 electric toe kick heaters will keep the coach warm and they produce a couple of thousand BTUs each, it only makes since that the A/H should do a better job as they produce 2 times the heat, each. There must be a problem? I do a lot of cold camping, last weekend it was 9 deg in Republic WA. and I keep the coach at the temp I wanted. I have done a few things to improve the system. All the hoses run along the side of the coach next to the exterior skin in the bays, so I moved them a little and encased them in pipe insulation everywhere I could, and two of the hoses ran outside to the front of the coach so I encased those in pipe insulation. One thing I do know is that the burner runs a lot when it's that cold, and diesel cost a lot, so I too heat with electric and supplement with the A/H. I also made window inserts out of ¼" white packing foam stuff, and keep the blinds down except in the sun.
Marty Gregg
95 BMC 37
Kennewick
WA