Chassis heat problems

[sfedeli3]

Hi Don,

I know that you don't want to hear this- but it was the one that
you're talking about on the bottom of the water pump that failed on
mine. Replacing the innards is a good move- and should solve your
problem. Some plumbing supply houses may carry new gates and seals for
the valve, but good luck finding a perfect match. Sadly, I do not
think that there is any way to replace that valve without having the
water pump off- and that is a challenge in itself. Maneuvering a 25 lb
chunk of iron with fittings and trying to match up the drive gears was
a real PITA.

Shane Fedeli
85PT40
Hershey, PA

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Bradner"
wrote:
>
> Back for more. Over the past two days I pulled the two gate valves
that I show in the image at
> http://www.arcatapet.net/image/heaterplumbing.jpg
>
> Both looked and operated fine, but I agree a ball valve is much
better, so I replaced them. Not a fun job getting things out, as there
isn't much room to wrench. Had to drop the air conditioning pump down
to have room to turn the right-hand one.
>
> As I was installing the left ball valve, I happened to notice that
there was another valve below the water pump - black with grease, and
hard to see - even harder to get to. It wasn't until I came back to
your post, Shane, to make this post that I happened to read new
meaning into the "I've replaced 2 of the 4 valves with ball valves." I
assumed you meant 2 gates, 1 Sporlan, 1 Bosch, which is what I knew I
had; now I'm thinking you meant 4 gate valves. Am I missing a 4th gate
valve somewhere?
>
> Anyway, I reached down and spun the handle, and spun the handle some
more. No stops, either direction. Sigh. I don't think I could get that
valve out without removing the water pump, which I really don't want
to tackle.
>
> So, what I did was to unscrew the top of the valve (a difficult
thing in its own right), and replace the handle/stem/gate with the
best of the other two. You can see it here after replacement, as well
as the handle of the left-side ball valve:
http://www.arcatapet.net/image/thirdvalve.jpg
>
> A picture of the valve stems is here:
http://www.arcatapet.net/image/erodedthreads.jpg
>
> On the left is the other "good" valve, and on the right is the bad
one from below the water pump. The threads are just eroded away enough
that the gate will slip somewhat freely on the stem.
>
> Unless I can find another valve to look at, tomorrow will be spent
filtering 8 gallons of collected coolant for replacement, then
checking for leaks, etc.
>
>

[Gregory OConnor]

If the valve is needed??? what is its purpose????? If it was never
used, why have it repalced only to fail again??? could you not just
shell out the guts, braze the stem cap hole shut, screw the stem cap
back on, then add one other valve down line in a more accessable
spot. Don's going to have to replace it again in 2036 anyway.

Cutting the valve apart may help removing it 'piece by piece' then
replace it with a thru pipe to a better spot. Or disassemble the new
valve to reinstall 'part by part'.


Tim alerted me that my mountain bike has two flats... Some repairs
dont hold purpose.
GregoryO'Connor
94ptRomolandCa

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "sfedeli3"
<sfedeli3@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Don,
>
> I know that you don't want to hear this- but it was the one that
> you're talking about on the bottom of the water pump that failed on
> mine. Replacing the innards is a good move- and should solve your
> problem. Some plumbing supply houses may carry new gates and seals
for
> the valve, but good luck finding a perfect match. Sadly, I do not
> think that there is any way to replace that valve without having
the
> water pump off- and that is a challenge in itself. Maneuvering a
25 lb
> chunk of iron with fittings and trying to match up the drive gears
was
> a real PITA.
>
> Shane Fedeli
> 85PT40
> Hershey, PA
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Bradner"
> wrote:
> >
> > Back for more. Over the past two days I pulled the two gate
valves
> that I show in the image at
> > http://www.arcatapet.net/image/heaterplumbing.jpg
> >
> > Both looked and operated fine, but I agree a ball valve is much
> better, so I replaced them. Not a fun job getting things out, as
there
> isn't much room to wrench. Had to drop the air conditioning pump
down
> to have room to turn the right-hand one.
> >
> > As I was installing the left ball valve, I happened to notice
that
> there was another valve below the water pump - black with grease,
and
> hard to see - even harder to get to. It wasn't until I came back to
> your post, Shane, to make this post that I happened to read new
> meaning into the "I've replaced 2 of the 4 valves with ball
valves." I
> assumed you meant 2 gates, 1 Sporlan, 1 Bosch, which is what I
knew I
> had; now I'm thinking you meant 4 gate valves. Am I missing a 4th
gate
> valve somewhere?
> >
> > Anyway, I reached down and spun the handle, and spun the handle
some
> more. No stops, either direction. Sigh. I don't think I could get
that
> valve out without removing the water pump, which I really don't
want
> to tackle.
> >
> > So, what I did was to unscrew the top of the valve (a difficult
> thing in its own right), and replace the handle/stem/gate with the
> best of the other two. You can see it here after replacement, as
well
> as the handle of the left-side ball valve:
> http://www.arcatapet.net/image/thirdvalve.jpg
> >
> > A picture of the valve stems is here:
> http://www.arcatapet.net/image/erodedthreads.jpg
> >
> > On the left is the other "good" valve, and on the right is the
bad
> one from below the water pump. The threads are just eroded away
enough
> that the gate will slip somewhat freely on the stem.
> >
> > Unless I can find another valve to look at, tomorrow will be
spent
> filtering 8 gallons of collected coolant for replacement, then
> checking for leaks, etc.
> >
> >
>

[Don Bradner]

I suspect that valve on the bottom of the water pump takes the highest heat and
flow, which may explain why it erodes faster. Particularly if there is one exit
and two returns. I'm still not clear about whether I should be looking for a
fourth gate valve?

Unless I ever have to remove the water pump for some other reason, I don't think
that valve will get replaced. I will keep the other decent core for potential
repair in a few years - if push comes to shove I will do what Greg said, gut the
valve, and put another immediately downstream. Not necessary to do any major
work to gut it, just remove the gate from the stem and discard, then replace the
stem.

Don Bradner
90 PT40 "Blue Thunder"
Eureka, CA

On 3/22/2008 at 1:45 PM sfedeli3 wrote:

>Hi Don,
>
> I know that you don't want to hear this- but it was the one that
>you're talking about on the bottom of the water pump that failed on
>mine. Replacing the innards is a good move- and should solve your
>problem. Some plumbing supply houses may carry new gates and seals for
>the valve, but good luck finding a perfect match. Sadly, I do not
>think that there is any way to replace that valve without having the
>water pump off- and that is a challenge in itself. Maneuvering a 25 lb
>chunk of iron with fittings and trying to match up the drive gears was
>a real PITA.
>
>Shane Fedeli
>85PT40
>Hershey, PA
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Bradner"
> wrote:
>>
>> Back for more. Over the past two days I pulled the two gate valves
>that I show in the image at
>> http://www.arcatapet.net/image/heaterplumbing.jpg
>>
>> Both looked and operated fine, but I agree a ball valve is much
>better, so I replaced them. Not a fun job getting things out, as there
>isn't much room to wrench. Had to drop the air conditioning pump down
>to have room to turn the right-hand one.
>>
>> As I was installing the left ball valve, I happened to notice that
>there was another valve below the water pump - black with grease, and
>hard to see - even harder to get to. It wasn't until I came back to
>your post, Shane, to make this post that I happened to read new
>meaning into the "I've replaced 2 of the 4 valves with ball valves." I
>assumed you meant 2 gates, 1 Sporlan, 1 Bosch, which is what I knew I
>had; now I'm thinking you meant 4 gate valves. Am I missing a 4th gate
>valve somewhere?
>>
>> Anyway, I reached down and spun the handle, and spun the handle some
>more. No stops, either direction. Sigh. I don't think I could get that
>valve out without removing the water pump, which I really don't want
>to tackle.
>>
>> So, what I did was to unscrew the top of the valve (a difficult
>thing in its own right), and replace the handle/stem/gate with the
>best of the other two. You can see it here after replacement, as well
>as the handle of the left-side ball valve:
>http://www.arcatapet.net/image/thirdvalve.jpg
>>
>> A picture of the valve stems is here:
>http://www.arcatapet.net/image/erodedthreads.jpg
>>
>> On the left is the other "good" valve, and on the right is the bad
>one from below the water pump. The threads are just eroded away enough
>that the gate will slip somewhat freely on the stem.
>>
>> Unless I can find another valve to look at, tomorrow will be spent
>filtering 8 gallons of collected coolant for replacement, then
>checking for leaks, etc.
>>
>>
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

[Don Bradner]

Never mind - I found a fourth gate valve. This one is down below the right side
of the Sporlan valve, after the water heater circuit returns. Another hard
location, and it is bad. I think I can do the same replacement of the
handle/stem/gate that I did on the other one.

On 3/22/2008 at 8:55 AM Don Bradner wrote:

>I suspect that valve on the bottom of the water pump takes the highest
>heat and flow, which may explain why it erodes faster. Particularly if
>there is one exit and two returns. I'm still not clear about whether I
>should be looking for a fourth gate valve?
>
>Unless I ever have to remove the water pump for some other reason, I don't
>think that valve will get replaced. I will keep the other decent core for
>potential repair in a few years - if push comes to shove I will do what
>Greg said, gut the valve, and put another immediately downstream. Not
>necessary to do any major work to gut it, just remove the gate from the
>stem and discard, then replace the stem.
>
>Don Bradner
>90 PT40 "Blue Thunder"
>Eureka, CA
>
>On 3/22/2008 at 1:45 PM sfedeli3 wrote:
>
>>Hi Don,
>>
>> I know that you don't want to hear this- but it was the one that
>>you're talking about on the bottom of the water pump that failed on
>>mine. Replacing the innards is a good move- and should solve your
>>problem. Some plumbing supply houses may carry new gates and seals for
>>the valve, but good luck finding a perfect match. Sadly, I do not
>>think that there is any way to replace that valve without having the
>>water pump off- and that is a challenge in itself. Maneuvering a 25 lb
>>chunk of iron with fittings and trying to match up the drive gears was
>>a real PITA.
>>
>>Shane Fedeli
>>85PT40
>>Hershey, PA
>>
>> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Bradner"
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Back for more. Over the past two days I pulled the two gate valves
>>that I show in the image at
>>> http://www.arcatapet.net/image/heaterplumbing.jpg
>>>
>>> Both looked and operated fine, but I agree a ball valve is much
>>better, so I replaced them. Not a fun job getting things out, as there
>>isn't much room to wrench. Had to drop the air conditioning pump down
>>to have room to turn the right-hand one.
>>>
>>> As I was installing the left ball valve, I happened to notice that
>>there was another valve below the water pump - black with grease, and
>>hard to see - even harder to get to. It wasn't until I came back to
>>your post, Shane, to make this post that I happened to read new
>>meaning into the "I've replaced 2 of the 4 valves with ball valves." I
>>assumed you meant 2 gates, 1 Sporlan, 1 Bosch, which is what I knew I
>>had; now I'm thinking you meant 4 gate valves. Am I missing a 4th gate
>>valve somewhere?
>>>
>>> Anyway, I reached down and spun the handle, and spun the handle some
>>more. No stops, either direction. Sigh. I don't think I could get that
>>valve out without removing the water pump, which I really don't want
>>to tackle.
>>>
>>> So, what I did was to unscrew the top of the valve (a difficult
>>thing in its own right), and replace the handle/stem/gate with the
>>best of the other two. You can see it here after replacement, as well
>>as the handle of the left-side ball valve:
>>http://www.arcatapet.net/image/thirdvalve.jpg
>>>
>>> A picture of the valve stems is here:
>>http://www.arcatapet.net/image/erodedthreads.jpg
>>>
>>> On the left is the other "good" valve, and on the right is the bad
>>one from below the water pump. The threads are just eroded away enough
>>that the gate will slip somewhat freely on the stem.
>>>
>>> Unless I can find another valve to look at, tomorrow will be spent
>>filtering 8 gallons of collected coolant for replacement, then
>>checking for leaks, etc.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>------------------------------------
>>
>>Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

[sfedeli3]

Don,

On mine, there are 4 gate valves for the chassis heater circuits and
a 5th for the loop to the water heater.

-Shane

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Bradner"
wrote:
>
> Never mind - I found a fourth gate valve. This one is down below the
right side of the Sporlan valve, after the water heater circuit
returns. Another hard location, and it is bad. I think I can do the
same replacement of the handle/stem/gate that I did on the other one.
>
> On 3/22/2008 at 8:55 AM Don Bradner wrote:
>
> >I suspect that valve on the bottom of the water pump takes the highest
> >heat and flow, which may explain why it erodes faster. Particularly if
> >there is one exit and two returns. I'm still not clear about whether I
> >should be looking for a fourth gate valve?
> >
> >Unless I ever have to remove the water pump for some other reason,
I don't
> >think that valve will get replaced. I will keep the other decent
core for
> >potential repair in a few years - if push comes to shove I will do what
> >Greg said, gut the valve, and put another immediately downstream. Not
> >necessary to do any major work to gut it, just remove the gate from the
> >stem and discard, then replace the stem.
> >
> >Don Bradner
> >90 PT40 "Blue Thunder"
> >Eureka, CA
> >
> >On 3/22/2008 at 1:45 PM sfedeli3 wrote:
> >
> >>Hi Don,
> >>
> >> I know that you don't want to hear this- but it was the one that
> >>you're talking about on the bottom of the water pump that failed on
> >>mine. Replacing the innards is a good move- and should solve your
> >>problem. Some plumbing supply houses may carry new gates and seals for
> >>the valve, but good luck finding a perfect match. Sadly, I do not
> >>think that there is any way to replace that valve without having the
> >>water pump off- and that is a challenge in itself. Maneuvering a 25 lb
> >>chunk of iron with fittings and trying to match up the drive gears was
> >>a real PITA.
> >>
> >>Shane Fedeli
> >>85PT40
> >>Hershey, PA
> >>

[Don Bradner]

I cannot find a fifth valve. Do you have a Sporlan in the circuit back there
like I do? If not, perhaps it is the fifth valve.

The fourth valve turned out not to be bad. The only thing I can surmise is that
it was closed, and I just didn't turn enough times to hit the open stop. Good
thing, because it is a different valve body; not a lot of difference, but the
gate would not fit from one of the others.

Way back in this thread Ron Marabito asked if I had checked the gate valves
because they were notorious for working themselves closed. I replied that they
were opened, and wire-tied open. Of course at that time I thought I was only
talking about two valves. The third and fourth were not tied open. Now they are.

On 3/22/2008 at 6:00 PM sfedeli3 wrote:

>Don,
>
> On mine, there are 4 gate valves for the chassis heater circuits and
>a 5th for the loop to the water heater.
>
>-Shane
>
>--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Bradner"
> wrote:
>>
>> Never mind - I found a fourth gate valve. This one is down below the
>right side of the Sporlan valve, after the water heater circuit
>returns. Another hard location, and it is bad. I think I can do the
>same replacement of the handle/stem/gate that I did on the other one.
>>
>> On 3/22/2008 at 8:55 AM Don Bradner wrote:
>>
>> >I suspect that valve on the bottom of the water pump takes the highest
>> >heat and flow, which may explain why it erodes faster. Particularly if
>> >there is one exit and two returns. I'm still not clear about whether I
>> >should be looking for a fourth gate valve?
>> >
>> >Unless I ever have to remove the water pump for some other reason,
>I don't
>> >think that valve will get replaced. I will keep the other decent
>core for
>> >potential repair in a few years - if push comes to shove I will do what
>> >Greg said, gut the valve, and put another immediately downstream. Not
>> >necessary to do any major work to gut it, just remove the gate from the
>> >stem and discard, then replace the stem.
>> >
>> >Don Bradner
>> >90 PT40 "Blue Thunder"
>> >Eureka, CA
>> >
>> >On 3/22/2008 at 1:45 PM sfedeli3 wrote:
>> >
>> >>Hi Don,
>> >>
>> >> I know that you don't want to hear this- but it was the one that
>> >>you're talking about on the bottom of the water pump that failed on
>> >>mine. Replacing the innards is a good move- and should solve your
>> >>problem. Some plumbing supply houses may carry new gates and seals for
>> >>the valve, but good luck finding a perfect match. Sadly, I do not
>> >>think that there is any way to replace that valve without having the
>> >>water pump off- and that is a challenge in itself. Maneuvering a 25 lb
>> >>chunk of iron with fittings and trying to match up the drive gears was
>> >>a real PITA.
>> >>
>> >>Shane Fedeli
>> >>85PT40
>> >>Hershey, PA
>> >>
>
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

[erniecarpet@...]

In a message dated 3/22/2008 12:01:05 P.M. Central Standard Time, sfedeli3@... writes:

On mine, there are 4 gate valves for the chassis heater circuits and
a 5th for the loop to the water heater.

-Shane

I always knew about 4 valves, but I wonder if the PO of your coach, installed the 5th valve.

Ernie Ekberg
83PT40
Livingston, Montana

Weatherford, Tx

---

Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL Home.

[Richard Gideon]

Four on the floor and a fifth under the seat?

Dick Gideon

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Bradner"
wrote:
>
> I cannot find a fifth valve. Do you have a Sporlan in the circuit
back there like I do? If not, perhaps it is the fifth valve.
>
> The fourth valve turned out not to be bad. The only thing I can
surmise is that it was closed, and I just didn't turn enough times to
hit the open stop. Good thing, because it is a different valve body;
not a lot of difference, but the gate would not fit from one of the
others.
>
> Way back in this thread Ron Marabito asked if I had checked the
gate valves because they were notorious for working themselves
closed. I replied that they were opened, and wire-tied open. Of
course at that time I thought I was only talking about two valves.
The third and fourth were not tied open. Now they are.
>
> On 3/22/2008 at 6:00 PM sfedeli3 wrote:
>
> >Don,
> >
> > On mine, there are 4 gate valves for the chassis heater circuits
and
> >a 5th for the loop to the water heater.
> >
> >-Shane
> >
> >--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Bradner"
> > wrote:
> >>
> >> Never mind - I found a fourth gate valve. This one is down below
the
> >right side of the Sporlan valve, after the water heater circuit
> >returns. Another hard location, and it is bad. I think I can do the
> >same replacement of the handle/stem/gate that I did on the other
one.
> >>
> >> On 3/22/2008 at 8:55 AM Don Bradner wrote:
> >>
> >> >I suspect that valve on the bottom of the water pump takes the
highest
> >> >heat and flow, which may explain why it erodes faster.
Particularly if
> >> >there is one exit and two returns. I'm still not clear about
whether I
> >> >should be looking for a fourth gate valve?
> >> >
> >> >Unless I ever have to remove the water pump for some other
reason,
> >I don't
> >> >think that valve will get replaced. I will keep the other decent
> >core for
> >> >potential repair in a few years - if push comes to shove I will
do what
> >> >Greg said, gut the valve, and put another immediately
downstream. Not
> >> >necessary to do any major work to gut it, just remove the gate
from the
> >> >stem and discard, then replace the stem.
> >> >
> >> >Don Bradner
> >> >90 PT40 "Blue Thunder"
> >> >Eureka, CA
> >> >
> >> >On 3/22/2008 at 1:45 PM sfedeli3 wrote:
> >> >
> >> >>Hi Don,
> >> >>
> >> >> I know that you don't want to hear this- but it was the one
that
> >> >>you're talking about on the bottom of the water pump that
failed on
> >> >>mine. Replacing the innards is a good move- and should solve
your
> >> >>problem. Some plumbing supply houses may carry new gates and
seals for
> >> >>the valve, but good luck finding a perfect match. Sadly, I do
not
> >> >>think that there is any way to replace that valve without
having the
> >> >>water pump off- and that is a challenge in itself. Maneuvering
a 25 lb
> >> >>chunk of iron with fittings and trying to match up the drive
gears was
> >> >>a real PITA.
> >> >>
> >> >>Shane Fedeli
> >> >>85PT40
> >> >>Hershey, PA
> >> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------
> >
> >Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>

[Don Bradner]

Success! After cleaning things up, filtering/replacing the captured coolant,
plus buying more, then warming the engine up, I have heat again.

For those who wondered whether heat requires the thermostat on the engine to be
open, it doesn't. Well before the gauge hit 100 I had noticeable warmth, and by
the time it was around 120 it could be categorized as hot air.

When checking under the front end for leaks where I removed and re-installed the
Bosch valve there was a discernible rush of fluid as the timer cycled.

My best guess is that the problem was the fourth valve vibrating closed, but the
failing third valve certainly needed to be fixed.

Don Bradner
90 PT40 "Blue Thunder"
Eureka, CA

On 3/22/2008 at 12:08 PM Don Bradner wrote:

>I cannot find a fifth valve. Do you have a Sporlan in the circuit back
>there like I do? If not, perhaps it is the fifth valve.
>
>The fourth valve turned out not to be bad. The only thing I can surmise is
>that it was closed, and I just didn't turn enough times to hit the open
>stop. Good thing, because it is a different valve body; not a lot of
>difference, but the gate would not fit from one of the others.
>
>Way back in this thread Ron Marabito asked if I had checked the gate
>valves because they were notorious for working themselves closed. I
>replied that they were opened, and wire-tied open. Of course at that time
>I thought I was only talking about two valves. The third and fourth were
>not tied open. Now they are.
>
>On 3/22/2008 at 6:00 PM sfedeli3 wrote:
>
>>Don,
>>
>> On mine, there are 4 gate valves for the chassis heater circuits and
>>a 5th for the loop to the water heater.
>>
>>-Shane
>>
>>--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Bradner"
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Never mind - I found a fourth gate valve. This one is down below the
>>right side of the Sporlan valve, after the water heater circuit
>>returns. Another hard location, and it is bad. I think I can do the
>>same replacement of the handle/stem/gate that I did on the other one.
>>>
>>> On 3/22/2008 at 8:55 AM Don Bradner wrote:
>>>
>>> >I suspect that valve on the bottom of the water pump takes the highest
>>> >heat and flow, which may explain why it erodes faster. Particularly if
>>> >there is one exit and two returns. I'm still not clear about whether I
>>> >should be looking for a fourth gate valve?
>>> >
>>> >Unless I ever have to remove the water pump for some other reason,
>>I don't
>>> >think that valve will get replaced. I will keep the other decent
>>core for
>>> >potential repair in a few years - if push comes to shove I will do what
>>> >Greg said, gut the valve, and put another immediately downstream. Not
>>> >necessary to do any major work to gut it, just remove the gate from the
>>> >stem and discard, then replace the stem.
>>> >
>>> >Don Bradner
>>> >90 PT40 "Blue Thunder"
>>> >Eureka, CA
>>> >
>>> >On 3/22/2008 at 1:45 PM sfedeli3 wrote:
>>> >
>>> >>Hi Don,
>>> >>
>>> >> I know that you don't want to hear this- but it was the one that
>>> >>you're talking about on the bottom of the water pump that failed on
>>> >>mine. Replacing the innards is a good move- and should solve your
>>> >>problem. Some plumbing supply houses may carry new gates and seals for
>>> >>the valve, but good luck finding a perfect match. Sadly, I do not
>>> >>think that there is any way to replace that valve without having the
>>> >>water pump off- and that is a challenge in itself. Maneuvering a 25 lb
>>> >>chunk of iron with fittings and trying to match up the drive gears was
>>> >>a real PITA.
>>> >>
>>> >>Shane Fedeli
>>> >>85PT40
>>> >>Hershey, PA
>>> >>
>>
>>
>>
>>------------------------------------
>>
>>Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

Don Bradner
90 PT40 "Blue Thunder"
Eureka, CA