Question about repowering early PT's

[erniecarpet@...]

In a message dated 6/6/2008 6:12:05 P.M. Central Standard Time, reck@... writes:

that one of the owners felt like they were a bit underpowered going up
hills

Kinda of an understatement. BUT--- If you are comfortable with the fact that you are driving the safest coach built, albeit, underpowered, you will grow to appreciate all that the 6v92 can do.

On another note, my son, the plastic palace king, states that his coach can run up hills at 65- 70. Fine, says the old Daddy. But once you step inside his coach and feel it move under your feet, you'll be convinced of the stability and weight of a Bluebird.

I know I'm not the fastest coach off the line, but get outta my way going downhill.

I believe the 8v may not fit in the engine compartment of the 6v. Am I right or am I wrong??

Ernie Ekberg
83PT40
Livingston, Montana

---

Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.

[Jonathan L]

Just curious....has anyone ever considered or pursued re-powering some of
the early 80's PT's (82-85) from the 6V92 to an 8V92 or something else
(Cummins? Cat?). I really have NO CLUE as to the viability of such an idea.
But, the discussion about one the early PT's for sale brought out a comment
that one of the owners felt like they were a bit underpowered going up
hills. I was just wondering how hard it would be to upgrade the powertrain
so that they got more power.

Along the same vein, I know that some diesels can have their ECU
reprogrammed to put out more power and generally the limiting factor is
what the transmission can handle. I know that these 6V's aren't really
computer controlled so that may not be an option in this case. But, is
there something else that could be done to bump up their performance?

Anyhow, as a wannabee (who won't be til he gets a job and sells some land),
I've been looking at all models of the PT's and just looking at all the
options that might be out there.

Jonathan Leifheit
Wannabee

[Leroy Eckert]

Well, I have an 8v92 and it has served me well. It would be nice I guess to have a 60 Series but haven't determined why. Talking points perhaps. A 60 is to tall to fit in my coach without major mods to make it work. Just buy one with it in there if that is what you want.
I look at it this way. These things aren't race cars, you buy them to full time and/or travel and have fun. If you are in a hurry you don't need one.

Leroy Eckert
1990 WB-40 Royale
Smoke N Mirrors
Dahlonega, GA

Jonathan L wrote:

Just
curious....has anyone ever considered or pursued re-powering some of
the early 80's PT's (82-85) from the 6V92 to an 8V92 or something else
(Cummins? Cat?). I really have NO CLUE as to the viability of such an idea.
But, the discussion about one the early PT's for sale brought out a comment
that one of the owners felt like they were a bit underpowered going up
hills. I was just wondering how hard it would be to upgrade the powertrain
so that they got more power.

Along the same vein, I know that some diesels can have their ECU
reprogrammed to put out more power and generally the limiting factor is
what the transmission can handle. I know that these 6V's aren't really
computer controlled so that may not be an option in this case. But, is
there something else that could be done to bump up their performance?

Anyhow, as a wannabee (who won't be til he gets a job and sells some land),
I've been looking at
all models of the PT's and just looking at all the
options that might be out there.

Jonathan Leifheit
Wannabee

[Ryan Wright]

On 6/6/08, Jonathan L wrote:
>
> Just curious....has anyone ever considered or pursued re-powering some of
> the early 80's PT's (82-85) from the 6V92 to an 8V92 or something else
> (Cummins? Cat?).

You'd spend less money buying a newer Bird and would retain some of
the value of your investment. An older PT isn't going to bring a lot
more just because it has an 8V. It might bring less, depending on the
quality of the work and documentation of the job. Better to spend that
extra money on a newer Bird to begin with and get the extra benefits
of a later model year coach, as well as a better resale value, along
with your power.

If you're concerned about power already and want a PT, I highly
recommend you do what I did: Only consider those with the 8V.
Certainly there is nothing wrong with an older bird with a 6V, but I'm
one of those impatient types and it just wouldn't have worked for me.
Watch the '86s, some had 6's, some 8's.

-Ryan
'86 PT-40 8V92

[Scott Forman]

Just buy a coach with an 8v if you are concerned. I have an 8v in my
86 PT38, and it is practically a race car by motorhome standards. A
buddy of mine has a brand new Tiffin Phaeton and he can't keep up
with me.

Scott Forman
86 PT38
Memphis

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Jonathan L wrote:
>
> Just curious....has anyone ever considered or pursued re-powering
some of
> the early 80's PT's (82-85) from the 6V92 to an 8V92 or something
else
> (Cummins? Cat?). I really have NO CLUE as to the viability of such
an idea.
> But, the discussion about one the early PT's for sale brought out a
comment
> that one of the owners felt like they were a bit underpowered going
up
> hills. I was just wondering how hard it would be to upgrade the
powertrain
> so that they got more power.
>
> Along the same vein, I know that some diesels can have their ECU
> reprogrammed to put out more power and generally the limiting
factor is
> what the transmission can handle. I know that these 6V's aren't
really
> computer controlled so that may not be an option in this case. But,
is
> there something else that could be done to bump up their
performance?
>
> Anyhow, as a wannabee (who won't be til he gets a job and sells
some land),
> I've been looking at all models of the PT's and just looking at all
the
> options that might be out there.
>
> Jonathan Leifheit
> Wannabee
>

[David Brady]

The biggest benefit of the 4 stroke Series 60 is mpg. The second

biggest benefit is service and parts (these engines are still being

manufactured). The third biggest benefit is DDEC IV control. The

fourth is emissions.



Most owners get around 7 mpg. This could be as much as a 40% increase

over the 8V92. An engine is probably going to cast $25K to $30K,

and the conversion another $10K to $15K. To recoup $50K will take,

hmmm: (at $5/gal), 175,000 miles. Clearly one wouldn't do this to save

money. But diggity-dank I sure would love to own an '86 PT40 with

a Series-60.



David Brady

'02 LXi, NC



Leroy Eckert wrote:

Well, I have an 8v92 and it has served me well. It would be nice I
guess to have a 60 Series but haven't determined why. Talking points
perhaps. A 60 is to tall to fit in my coach without major mods to make
it work. Just buy one with it in there if that is what you want.

I look at it this way. These things aren't race cars, you buy them to
full time and/or travel and have fun. If you are in a hurry you don't
need one.



Leroy Eckert

1990 WB-40 Royale

Smoke N Mirrors

Dahlonega, GA



Jonathan L com> wrote:

Just curious....has anyone ever considered or pursued
re-powering some of

the early 80's PT's (82-85) from the 6V92 to an 8V92 or something else

(Cummins? Cat?). I really have NO CLUE as to the viability of such an
idea.

But, the discussion about one the early PT's for sale brought out a
comment

that one of the owners felt like they were a bit underpowered going up

hills. I was just wondering how hard it would be to upgrade the
powertrain

so that they got more power.



Along the same vein, I know that some diesels can have their ECU

reprogrammed to put out more power and generally the limiting factor is


what the transmission can handle. I know that these 6V's aren't really

computer controlled so that may not be an option in this case. But, is

there something else that could be done to bump up their performance?



Anyhow, as a wannabee (who won't be til he gets a job and sells some
land),

I've been looking at all models of the PT's and just looking at all the


options that might be out there.



Jonathan Leifheit

Wannabee

No virus found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.24.6/1486 - Release Date: 6/5/2008 6:29 PM

[brad barton]

The 8V92 is sheer genius and Ibelieve the highest development of the 2-cycle diesel power plant. Last I heard froma captain I know in the Coast Guard, they are still manufactured for marine use. Power to weight ratio is exceptional. I loved mine in the '86 Newell, just had to checkand oil more frequently. Acceleration and torque upgrades was not quitecarlike but at 475hp, a lot more nimble than my 525 hp now.

BradBarton00LXiDFW bbartonwx@...

---

To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
From: dmb993@...
Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2008 21:36:46 -0500
Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Question about repowering early PT's

The biggest benefit of the 4 stroke Series 60 is mpg. The second
biggest benefit is service and parts (these engines are still being
manufactured). The third biggest benefit is DDEC IV control. The
fourth is emissions.

Most owners get around 7 mpg. This could be as much as a 40% increase
over the 8V92. An engine is probably going to cast $25K to $30K,
and the conversion another $10K to $15K. To recoup $50K will take,
hmmm: (at $5/gal), 175,000 miles. Clearly one wouldn't do this to save
money. But diggity-dank I sure would love to own an '86 PT40 with
a Series-60.

David Brady
'02 LXi, NC

Leroy Eckert wrote:

Well, I have an 8v92 and it has served me well. It would be nice I guess to have a 60 Series but haven't determined why. Talking points perhaps. A 60 is to tall to fit in my coach without major mods to make it work. Just buy one with it in there if that is what you want.
I look at it this way. These things aren't race cars, you buy them to full time and/or travel and have fun. If you are in a hurry you don't need one.

Leroy Eckert
1990 WB-40 Royale
Smoke N Mirrors
Dahlonega, GA

Jonathan L com> wrote:

Just curious....has anyone ever considered or pursued re-powering some of
the early 80's PT's (82-85) from the 6V92 to an 8V92 or something else
(Cummins? Cat?). I really have NO CLUE as to the viability of such an idea.
But, the discussion about one the early PT's for sale brought out a comment
that one of the owners felt like they were a bit underpowered going up
hills. I was just wondering how hard it would be to upgrade the powertrain
so that they got more power.

Along the same vein, I know that some diesels can have their ECU
reprogrammed to put out more power and generally the limiting factor is
what the transmission can handle. I know that these 6V's aren't really
computer controlled so that may not be an option in this case. But, is
there something else that could be done to bump up their performance?

Anyhow, as a wannabee (who won't be til he gets a job and sells some land),
I've been looking at all models of the PT's and just looking at all the
options that might be out there.

Jonathan Leifheit
Wannabee

---

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.24.6/1486 - Release Date: 6/5/2008 6:29 PM

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[joepat50]

At least for the emissions there is a fix, check:
http://www.dieselpartsdirect.com/CustomP...ology.aspx

If you want more power ask on the Detroit Diesel Yahoo group, they
know a lot about these motors!

/Joe
'87 PT40 8v92
San Francisco


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, David Brady wrote:
>
> True, but they pollute, they're maintenance intensive, they're fuel
> hogs, they run backwards (maybe this is a feature), and they've
> been evolved to the limits of their engineering (o-ring cylinder
sleeves,
> for example). They had a good run, now it's the 4-strokers turn.
> (Actually has been for many years).
>
> David
> '02 LXi, (I bought the engine, the bus came with it), NC
>
> brad barton wrote:
> >
> > The 8V92 is sheer genius and I believe the highest development of the
> > 2-cycle diesel power plant. Last I heard from a captain I know in
the
> > Coast Guard, they are still manufactured for marine use. Power to
> > weight ratio is exceptional. I loved mine in the '86 Newell, just
had
> > to check and oil more frequently. Acceleration and torque up grades
> > was not quite carlike but at 475 hp, a lot more nimble than my 525 hp
> > now.
> >
> > Brad Barton 00LXiDFW bbartonwx@...
> >
> >
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > From: dmb993@...
> > Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2008 21:36:46 -0500
> > Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Question about repowering
early PT's
> >
> > The biggest benefit of the 4 stroke Series 60 is mpg. The second
> > biggest benefit is service and parts (these engines are still
being
> > manufactured). The third biggest benefit is DDEC IV control. The
> > fourth is emissions.
> >
> > Most owners get around 7 mpg. This could be as much as a 40%
increase
> > over the 8V92. An engine is probably going to cast $25K to $30K,
> > and the conversion another $10K to $15K. To recoup $50K will take,
> > hmmm: (at $5/gal), 175,000 miles. Clearly one wouldn't do this
to save
> > money. But diggity-dank I sure would love to own an '86 PT40 with
> > a Series-60.
> >
> > David Brady
> > '02 LXi, NC
> >
> > Leroy Eckert wrote:
> >
> > Well, I have an 8v92 and it has served me well. It would be
> > nice I guess to have a 60 Series but haven't determined why.
> > Talking points perhaps. A 60 is to tall to fit in my coach
> > without major mods to make it work. Just buy one with it in
> > there if that is what you want.
> > I look at it this way. These things aren't race cars, you buy
> > them to full time and/or travel and have fun. If you are in a
> > hurry you don't need one.
> >
> > Leroy Eckert
> > 1990 WB-40 Royale
> > Smoke N Mirrors
> > Dahlonega, GA
> >
> > */Jonathan L /* wrote:
> >
> > Just curious....has anyone ever considered or pursued
> > re-powering some of
> > the early 80's PT's (82-85) from the 6V92 to an 8V92 or
> > something else
> > (Cummins? Cat?). I really have NO CLUE as to the viability
> > of such an idea.
> > But, the discussion about one the early PT's for sale
> > brought out a comment
> > that one of the owners felt like they were a bit
> > underpowered going up
> > hills. I was just wondering how hard it would be to
> > upgrade the powertrain
> > so that they got more power.
> >
> > Along the same vein, I know that some diesels can have
> > their ECU
> > reprogrammed to put out more power and generally the
> > limiting factor is
> > what the transmission can handle. I know that these 6V's
> > aren't really
> > computer controlled so that may not be an option in this
> > case. But, is
> > there something else that could be done to bump up their
> > performance?
> >
> > Anyhow, as a wannabee (who won't be til he gets a job and
> > sells some land),
> > I've been looking at all models of the PT's and just
> > looking a all the
> > options that might be out there.
> >
> > Jonathan Leifheit
> > Wannabee
> >
> >
> >
> >
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG.
> > Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.24.6/1486 - Release
Date: 6/5/2008 6:29 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Enjoy 5 GB of free, password-protected online storage. Get Windows
> > Live SkyDrive.
> >
<http://www.windowslive.com/skydrive/over...h_sky\
drive_062008>

> >
> >
> >
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG.
> > Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.24.6/1486 - Release Date:
6/5/2008 6:29 PM
> >
>

[David Brady]

True, but they pollute, they're maintenance intensive, they're fuel

hogs, they run backwards (maybe this is a feature), and they've

been evolved to the limits of their engineering (o-ring cylinder
sleeves,

for example). They had a good run, now it's the 4-strokers turn.

(Actually has been for many years).



David

'02 LXi, (I bought the engine, the bus came with it), NC



brad barton wrote:

The 8V92 is sheer genius and Ibelieve the highest development of
the 2-cycle diesel power plant. Last I heard froma captain I know in
the Coast Guard, they are still manufactured for marine use. Power to
weight ratio is exceptional. I loved mine in the '86 Newell, just had
to checkand oil more frequently. Acceleration and torque upgrades
was not quitecarlike but at 475hp, a lot more nimble than my 525 hp
now.



BradBarton00LXiDFW bbartonwx@hotmail.com

---

To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com

From: dmb993@earthlink.net

Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2008 21:36:46 -0500

Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Question about repowering early PT's

The biggest benefit of the 4 stroke Series
60 is mpg. The second

biggest benefit is service and parts (these engines are still being

manufactured). The third biggest benefit is DDEC IV control. The

fourth is emissions.



Most owners get around 7 mpg. This could be as much as a 40% increase

over the 8V92. An engine is probably going to cast $25K to $30K,

and the conversion another $10K to $15K. To recoup $50K will take,

hmmm: (at $5/gal), 175,000 miles. Clearly one wouldn't do this to save

money. But diggity-dank I sure would love to own an '86 PT40 with

a Series-60.



David Brady

'02 LXi, NC



Leroy Eckert wrote:

Well, I have an 8v92 and it has served me well. It would be
nice I guess to have a 60 Series but haven't determined why. Talking
points perhaps. A 60 is to tall to fit in my coach without major mods
to make it work. Just buy one with it in there if that is what you
want.

I look at it this way. These things aren't race cars, you buy them to
full time and/or travel and have fun. If you are in a hurry you don't
need one.



Leroy Eckert

1990 WB-40 Royale

Smoke N Mirrors

Dahlonega, GA



Jonathan L com> wrote:

Just curious....has anyone ever considered or pursued
re-powering some of

the early 80's PT's (82-85) from the 6V92 to an 8V92 or something else

(Cummins? Cat?). I really have NO CLUE as to the viability of such an
idea.

But, the discussion about one the early PT's for sale brought out a
comment

that one of the owners felt like they were a bit underpowered going up

hills. I was just wondering how hard it would be to upgrade the
powertrain

so that they got more power.



Along the same vein, I know that some diesels can have their ECU

reprogrammed to put out more power and generally the limiting factor is


what the transmission can handle. I know that these 6V's aren't really

computer controlled so that may not be an option in this case. But, is

there something else that could be done to bump up their performance?



Anyhow, as a wannabee (who won't be til he gets a job and sells some
land),

I've been looking at all models of the PT's and just looking a all the

options that might be out there.



Jonathan Leifheit

Wannabee

---

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG.
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[David Brady]

I found these specs online:



8V92T: weight 2395 lb, len: 48", width: 39", height: 52"

Series 60: weight 2640 lb, len: 57", width: 34", height: 50"



Surprisingly the weights are the same and the S-60 is smaller

in all dimensions but len where it exceeds the 8V by only 9

inches. There may be some hope for an '86 PT40 swap after

all.



David

'02 LXi, NC



brad barton wrote:

The 8V92 is sheer genius and Ibelieve the highest development of
the 2-cycle diesel power plant. Last I heard froma captain I know in
the Coast Guard, they are still manufactured for marine use. Power to
weight ratio is exceptional. I loved mine in the '86 Newell, just had
to checkand oil more frequently. Acceleration and torque upgrades
was not quitecarlike but at 475hp, a lot more nimble than my 525 hp
now.



BradBarton00LXiDFW bbartonwx@hotmail.com

---

To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com

From: dmb993@earthlink.net

Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2008 21:36:46 -0500

Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Question about repowering early PT's

The biggest benefit of the 4 stroke Series
60 is mpg. The second

biggest benefit is service and parts (these engines are still being

manufactured). The third biggest benefit is DDEC IV control. The

fourth is emissions.



Most owners get around 7 mpg. This could be as much as a 40% increase

over the 8V92. An engine is probably going to cast $25K to $30K,

and the conversion another $10K to $15K. To recoup $50K will take,

hmmm: (at $5/gal), 175,000 miles. Clearly one wouldn't do this to save

money. But diggity-dank I sure would love to own an '86 PT40 with

a Series-60.



David Brady

'02 LXi, NC



Leroy Eckert wrote:

Well, I have an 8v92 and it has served me well. It would be
nice I guess to have a 60 Series but haven't determined why. Talking
points perhaps. A 60 is to tall to fit in my coach without major mods
to make it work. Just buy one with it in there if that is what you
want.

I look at it this way. These things aren't race cars, you buy them to
full time and/or travel and have fun. If you are in a hurry you don't
need one.



Leroy Eckert

1990 WB-40 Royale

Smoke N Mirrors

Dahlonega, GA



Jonathan L com> wrote:

Just curious....has anyone ever considered or pursued
re-powering some of

the early 80's PT's (82-85) from the 6V92 to an 8V92 or something else

(Cummins? Cat?). I really have NO CLUE as to the viability of such an
idea.

But, the discussion about one the early PT's for sale brought out a
comment

that one of the owners felt like they were a bit underpowered going up

hills. I was just wondering how hard it would be to upgrade the
powertrain

so that they got more power.



Along the same vein, I know that some diesels can have their ECU

reprogrammed to put out more power and generally the limiting factor is


what the transmission can handle. I know that these 6V's aren't really

computer controlled so that may not be an option in this case. But, is

there something else that could be done to bump up their performance?



Anyhow, as a wannabee (who won't be til he gets a job and sells some
land),

I've been looking at all models of the PT's and just looking a all the

options that might be out there.



Jonathan Leifheit

Wannabee

---

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.24.6/1486 - Release Date: 6/5/2008 6:29 PM

---

Enjoy 5 GB of free, password-protected online storage. Get Windows Live SkyDrive.

No virus found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.24.6/1486 - Release Date: 6/5/2008 6:29 PM