Sad Safety Reminder

[mbulriss]

Our understanding is that Jim's passing was due to his bus falling on him.

This is again another sad reminder to be ultra safe when working under
these things.

I may be a big chicken, but personally, depending on what I am doing
under there, I use 4'x12"x6" wood ramps, wheel chocks, the bus jacks,
two 20-ton hydraulic jacks and two 20-ton jack stands before I crawl
under the Bird. I never crawl under without at least two redundant
sets of jacks in place. Any questions on why?

Sad, very sad.

Mike Bulriss
1991 WB40 "Texas Minivan"
San Antonio, TX

[Scott Forman]

Wow...just terrible



--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "mbulriss" <mbulriss@...>
wrote:
>
> Our understanding is that Jim's passing was due to his bus falling
on him.
>
> This is again another sad reminder to be ultra safe when working
under
> these things.
>
> I may be a big chicken, but personally, depending on what I am doing
> under there, I use 4'x12"x6" wood ramps, wheel chocks, the bus
jacks,
> two 20-ton hydraulic jacks and two 20-ton jack stands before I crawl
> under the Bird. I never crawl under without at least two redundant
> sets of jacks in place. Any questions on why?
>
> Sad, very sad.
>
> Mike Bulriss
> 1991 WB40 "Texas Minivan"
> San Antonio, TX
>

[Ryan Wright]

On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 4:36 PM, mbulriss <mbulriss@...> wrote:
> Our understanding is that Jim's passing was due to his bus falling on him.

Does anyone know how it happened? What was he doing, what went wrong?

I crawl under my bus all the time under these circumstances:

1. Parked on a flat, level surface.
2. Parking brake set.
3. Air bags inflated.
4. Leveling jacks down as a safety against airbag failure.

I've never had cause to jack the bus up beyond normal airbag operating
height. I'm small enough I can work around it without lifting it. I
can't see the airbags and the jacks failing at the same time. I'd
imagine most of the danger here is when you've actually lifted one or
more tires off the ground, yes?

-Ryan
'86 PT-40 8V92

[PM7088@...]

If you were to have some type of catastrophic air system failure, would you not
be better off with some solid blocking or cribbing under the bus?

Pete


-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Ryan Wright"
> On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 4:36 PM, mbulriss <mbulriss@...> wrote:
> > Our understanding is that Jim's passing was due to his bus falling on him.
>
> Does anyone know how it happened? What was he doing, what went wrong?
>
> I crawl under my bus all the time under these circumstances:
>
> 1. Parked on a flat, level surface.
> 2. Parking brake set.
> 3. Air bags inflated.
> 4. Leveling jacks down as a safety against airbag failure.
>
> I've never had cause to jack the bus up beyond normal airbag operating
> height. I'm small enough I can work around it without lifting it. I
> can't see the airbags and the jacks failing at the same time. I'd
> imagine most of the danger here is when you've actually lifted one or
> more tires off the ground, yes?
>
> -Ryan
> '86 PT-40 8V92

[Leroy Eckert]

What I got from Mike's post is reiteration of redundancy. What you are doing may be OK if you are skinny enough to be OK if both systems fail. Don't allow anyone in the cockpit while you are under there in that configuration. Try crawling under there with the bags down. If you fit the odds are better. I am to big to get under my coach unless it is jacked up except under the engine behind the tag.
Duplicate safety systems is a good idea because failure will most likely happen only once.
Our prayers are with his family.

Leroy Eckert
1990 WB-40 Royale
Dahlonega, GA
Smoke N Mirrors

Ryan Wright wrote:

On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 4:36 PM, mbulriss <"mbulriss%40yahoo.com"> wrote:
> Our understanding is that Jim's passing was due to his bus falling on him.

Does anyone know how it happened? What was he doing, what went wrong?

I crawl under my bus all the time under these circumstances:

1. Parked on a flat, level surface.
2. Parking brake set.
3. Air bags inflated.
4. Leveling jacks down as a safety against airbag failure.

I've never had cause to jack the bus up beyond normal airbag operating
height. I'm small enough I can work around it without lifting it. I
can't see the airbags and the jacks failing at the same time. I'd
imagine most of the danger here is when you've actually lifted one or
more tires off the ground, yes?

-Ryan
'86 PT-40
8V92

[Rob Robinson]

Prevost usually do not have leveling jacks due tomonocoque (sp) construction. You cannot have leveling jacks without a frame.Regardless, a coach like a Bluebird with air bags and leveling jacks also needs to be supported with stationary jacks and/or cribbing while you are underneath. I'm extremely sad to hear of yet another death in this fashion. In the BB community less BB drivers have been reportedly killed in road crashes compared to crushings. Think of it.......we couldour deaths by 50% or more if we just listen to the advise that is given nearly once or twice a month.....NEVER GO UNDER YOUR BUS......unless you know what you are doing. That said, if your are ignorant of how to lift a heavy bus it is your responsibilty to contact a heavy equipment companys to learn the safety procedures. Get your bus over to someone who knows or have them come over to your place and demonstrate how to lift your bus.

2008/6/9 Ryan Wright <"ryanpwright@gmail.com">:

On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 4:36 PM, mbulriss <"mbulriss%40yahoo.com"> wrote:
> Our understanding is that Jim's passing was due to his bus falling on him.


Does anyone know how it happened? What was he doing, what went wrong?

I crawl under my bus all the time under these circumstances:

1. Parked on a flat, level surface.
2. Parking brake set.
3. Air bags inflated.

4. Leveling jacks down as a safety against airbag failure.

I've never had cause to jack the bus up beyond normal airbag operating
height. I'm small enough I can work around it without lifting it. I
can't see the airbags and the jacks failing at the same time. I'd

imagine most of the danger here is when you've actually lifted one or
more tires off the ground, yes?

-Ryan
'86 PT-40 8V92

--
Rob, Sue & Merlin Robinson

94 WLWB

[Gregory OConnor]

The HWH jacks are dependent on valves and lines. when you get under
a bus it is most often chasing a failure of some system.

I use 8inch X 10inch X 30inch long wood stacked like lincoln logs
under a section of frame as a landing point for the bus. I dont use
jack stands because if they are strong enough they are too heavy to
posture and too expensive. Jack stands also rely on the bus staying
still in its tracks and not rolling. The wood I use is Gluelam
remnaments. GlueLam is more or less 8 inch if stack plywood. the
plywood is glued in thin sheets of wood and the grains are crossed
NorthSouth to EastWest. The crossed grain keeps the manufactured
gluelam beam from splitting down a natural grain found in a thick
milled tree trunk style beam. I found the glueLam at a greenwaste
recyclincing junkyard near my house.

I am glad Mike notated COD. It is out of respect for JimS that I
plan on taking extra care when I raise my bus, Trucks, tractors and
cars for repair and service.

GregoryO'Connor
94ptRomolandCa
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Ryan Wright"
wrote:
>
> On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 4:36 PM, mbulriss <mbulriss@...> wrote:
> > Our understanding is that Jim's passing was due to his bus
falling on him.
>
> Does anyone know how it happened? What was he doing, what went
wrong?
>
> I crawl under my bus all the time under these circumstances:
>
> 1. Parked on a flat, level surface.
> 2. Parking brake set.
> 3. Air bags inflated.
> 4. Leveling jacks down as a safety against airbag failure.
>
> I've never had cause to jack the bus up beyond normal airbag
operating
> height. I'm small enough I can work around it without lifting it. I
> can't see the airbags and the jacks failing at the same time. I'd
> imagine most of the danger here is when you've actually lifted one
or
> more tires off the ground, yes?
>
> -Ryan
> '86 PT-40 8V92
>

[erniecarpet@...]

David- you could serve a 5 course meal on your garage floor!! Very nice.

Ernie Ekberg
83PT40
Livingston, Montana

---

Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008.

[Dorn Hetzel]

I haven't had to spend a lot of time under my 77FC35 yet, but I'm already plotting to build a service pit I can park it over.

I've actually considered using my little backhoe to dig a pair of 18 inch wide trenches parallel and the right distance apart for the wheels and about 5 feet deep, then filling them with rebar and concrete. After it all sets up I would use the excavator to dig the dirt out from in between and then pour a concrete floor in the bottom of that. Fence around it for safety and instant service pit


It's probably crazy but it seems doable ...

-Dorn
Hogansville, GA

On Mon, Jun 9, 2008 at 3:14 PM, Gregory OConnor <"Gregoryoc@aol.com"> wrote:

The HWH jacks are dependent on valves and lines. when you get under

a bus it is most often chasing a failure of some system.



I use 8inch X 10inch X 30inch long wood stacked like lincoln logs

under a section of frame as a landing point for the bus. I dont use

jack stands because if they are strong enough they are too heavy to

posture and too expensive. Jack stands also rely on the bus staying

still in its tracks and not rolling. The wood I use is Gluelam

remnaments. GlueLam is more or less 8 inch if stack plywood. the

plywood is glued in thin sheets of wood and the grains are crossed

NorthSouth to EastWest. The crossed grain keeps the manufactured

gluelam beam from splitting down a natural grain found in a thick

milled tree trunk style beam. I found the glueLam at a greenwaste

recyclincing junkyard near my house.



I am glad Mike notated COD. It is out of respect for JimS that I

plan on taking extra care when I raise my bus, Trucks, tractors and

cars for repair and service.



GregoryO'Connor

94ptRomolandCa

--- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com", "Ryan Wright"

wrote:

>

> On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 4:36 PM, mbulriss <mbulriss@...> wrote:

> > Our understanding is that Jim's passing was due to his bus

falling on him.

>

> Does anyone know how it happened? What was he doing, what went

wrong?

>

> I crawl under my bus all the time under these circumstances:

>

> 1. Parked on a flat, level surface.

> 2. Parking brake set.

> 3. Air bags inflated.

> 4. Leveling jacks down as a safety against airbag failure.

>

> I've never had cause to jack the bus up beyond normal airbag

operating

> height. I'm small enough I can work around it without lifting it. I

> can't see the airbags and the jacks failing at the same time. I'd

> imagine most of the danger here is when you've actually lifted one

or

> more tires off the ground, yes?

>

> -Ryan

> '86 PT-40 8V92

>

[Pete Masterson]

Ryan,

That is the precise recipe for a disaster. You need to add:

5. Wheels chocked front and back (with adequate chocks!) Two axles preferred.

6. Jack stands, of suitable weight rating, set under the frame members to hold the bus should it come down.

I note that on later models, lowering the jacks causes the suspension to dump automatically. The leveling jacks (on my coach) state right on the control panel, "Not to be used for working under the coach."

The only true safety from being crushed is for something that can not collapse should be placed between the frame and the ground. The air bags can collapse without warning if (for example) you open an air-line on purpose or by accident. The leveling jacks may have a failure (or you may damage a hydraulic line) while you're working under the coach. 

I note during my recent visit to CCW that the technicians were clever in their use of the leveling jacks to raise the coach for working under it (at one point, putting blocks under the jacks to raise the coach higher then normal). However, they also used very heavy duty jack stands (looked like they could hold 50 tons) to keep the coach from unexpectedly coming down. 

Pete Masterson

'95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42

El Sobrante CA

"aeonix1@mac.com"

On Jun 9, 2008, at 11:12 AM, Ryan Wright wrote:

On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 4:36 PM, mbulriss <"mbulriss@yahoo.com"> wrote:

Our understanding is that Jim's passing was due to his bus falling on him.

Does anyone know how it happened? What was he doing, what went wrong?

I crawl under my bus all the time under these circumstances:

1. Parked on a flat, level surface.

2. Parking brake set.

3. Air bags inflated.

4. Leveling jacks down as a safety against airbag failure.

I've never had cause to jack the bus up beyond normal airbag operating

height. I'm small enough I can work around it without lifting it. I

can't see the airbags and the jacks failing at the same time. I'd

imagine most of the danger here is when you've actually lifted one or

more tires off the ground, yes?