6" SS EXHAUST STACK

[Kurt Horvath]

Hi Ernie,

There was talk about it and I asked Jessie at Tech Services and he
thought there may be but several PT 42 guys said no. Well curiousity
got the best of me so I went lookin and without a lot of trouble
there isn't going to be a hatch. I need to get the radiator checked
out anyway so no big deal. I would like to come up with a swing
system so you can get into the side of the engine bay from the
roadside. Now there's a project!

Kurt Horvath
95 PT 42
10AC




--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, erniecarpet@... wrote:
>
> Kurt- is your engine access in your rear closet floor?
>
> Ernie Ekberg
> 83PT40
> Weatherford, Texas
>
> **************Plan your next getaway with AOL Travel. Check out
Today's Hot
> 5 Travel Deals!
> (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x...71803/aol?
redir=http://travel.aol.com/discount-travel?nc...av00000001)
>

[mbulriss]

> out anyway so no big deal. I would like to come up with a swing
> system so you can get into the side of the engine bay from the
> roadside. Now there's a project!

Good grief! Do all people named Curt/Kurt have too much time on their
hands?! How do you find time to do that spectacular custom weapon
engraving? ;^)

Mike Bulriss
1991 WB40 "Texas Minivan"
San Antonio, TX


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Kurt Horvath"
wrote:
>
> Hi Ernie,
>
> There was talk about it and I asked Jessie at Tech Services and he
> thought there may be but several PT 42 guys said no. Well curiousity
> got the best of me so I went lookin and without a lot of trouble
> there isn't going to be a hatch. I need to get the radiator checked
> out anyway so no big deal. I would like to come up with a swing
> system so you can get into the side of the engine bay from the
> roadside. Now there's a project!
>
> Kurt Horvath
> 95 PT 42
> 10AC
>
>
>
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, erniecarpet@ wrote:
> >
> > Kurt- is your engine access in your rear closet floor?
> >
> > Ernie Ekberg
> > 83PT40
> > Weatherford, Texas
> >
> > **************Plan your next getaway with AOL Travel. Check out
> Today's Hot
> > 5 Travel Deals!
> >
(http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x...71803/aol?
> redir=http://travel.aol.com/discount-travel?
ncid=emlcntustrav00000001)
> >
>

[Kurt Horvath]

There isn't ehough time! LOL

Kurt Horvath
95 PT 42
10AC



--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "mbulriss" <mbulriss@...>
wrote:
>
> > out anyway so no big deal. I would like to come up with a swing
> > system so you can get into the side of the engine bay from the
> > roadside. Now there's a project!
>
> Good grief! Do all people named Curt/Kurt have too much time on
their
> hands?! How do you find time to do that spectacular custom weapon
> engraving? ;^)
>
> Mike Bulriss
> 1991 WB40 "Texas Minivan"
> San Antonio, TX
>
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Kurt Horvath"
> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Ernie,
> >
> > There was talk about it and I asked Jessie at Tech Services and
he
> > thought there may be but several PT 42 guys said no. Well
curiousity
> > got the best of me so I went lookin and without a lot of trouble
> > there isn't going to be a hatch. I need to get the radiator
checked
> > out anyway so no big deal. I would like to come up with a swing
> > system so you can get into the side of the engine bay from the
> > roadside. Now there's a project!
> >
> > Kurt Horvath
> > 95 PT 42
> > 10AC
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, erniecarpet@ wrote:
> > >
> > > Kurt- is your engine access in your rear closet floor?
> > >
> > > Ernie Ekberg
> > > 83PT40
> > > Weatherford, Texas
> > >
> > > **************Plan your next getaway with AOL Travel. Check
out
> > Today's Hot
> > > 5 Travel Deals!
> > >
> (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x...71803/aol?
> > redir=http://travel.aol.com/discount-travel?
> ncid=emlcntustrav00000001)
> > >
> >
>

[Gregory OConnor]

Kurt, try and figure why there were 4 bends. it may be that it was
engineered to alow for swing room between the 'hung exhaust' and
the 'torque reaction of the ruber mounted detroit'. look at the roll
of the torque and see that there is a place for the movement to twist
a union. I kinda think this movement was the problem with the
resulting crack. crack=result ;movement=cause ;facilitate movement
=repair. may be that BB enginered it correct but someone
overtightened a band to cure an exhaust leak??????? you also got to
keep the stack from cantilivering off of the maniford with your new
design. Scavenging is one variable in fuel efficiency. even straight
pipes some time will result in lower fuel economy because the intake
variable get screwd. backpressure is mathed into the computer.

[David Brady]

Kurt,



I agree with Greg. I'm gonna keep mine stock. There's a bunch

of vibration and movement back there. I figure BB's been building

buses a whole lot longer than I have. Initially I'd scratch my

head when looking at the frame and support pieces, but when

you consider that something as big as a bus must twist and flex,

this flexibility needs to be designed in. Make one piece stronger

and you've created a stress raiser someplace else.



I have a friend who transplanted a honda v-tech motor into a

lotus elise. Everything worked but the alternator mount. The mount

insists on cracking. There can be some weird harmonics and

resonant frequencies going on that are difficult to grasp and

only trial and error and a 50 year track record of building buses

can solve (unless you can model it and run high powered

computer finite element analysis on it). He's still fighting that

mount...



Okay, I'm off my soap box.



David Brady

'02 LXi, NC



Gregory OConnor wrote:

Kurt, try and figure why there were 4 bends. it may be that it was


engineered to alow for swing room between the 'hung exhaust' and

the 'torque reaction of the ruber mounted detroit'. look at the roll

of the torque and see that there is a place for the movement to twist

a union. I kinda think this movement was the problem with the

resulting crack. crack=result ;movement=cause ;facilitate movement

=repair. may be that BB enginered it correct but someone

overtightened a band to cure an exhaust leak??????? you also got to

keep the stack from cantilivering off of the maniford with your new

design. Scavenging is one variable in fuel efficiency. even straight

pipes some time will result in lower fuel economy because the intake

variable get screwd. backpressure is mathed into the computer.

Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.405 / Virus Database: 270.8.0/1715 - Release Date: 10/9/2008 12:00 AM

[Kurt Horvath]

David, Would you like to take that brand new muffler off my hands???

According to DD straight pipe & ECU will not have any issues in the
95 vintage S 60.

OEM built that pipe for BB ACAP - As Cheep As Possible -

The original routing of the pipe leaves the turbo, source of the
first failure, cracked the 1st 90 degree turn a short straight run
2nd. 90 degree turn, then into a double ball connector that also
telescopes in and out. You can check out that piece of S---, sorry
engineering wonder here.

http://www.dynaflexproducts.com/download...g70-89.pdf

Page 76 Double Ball Joint with Slip Joint Feature Allowing Lateral
Movement length 16 to 18 inches mine measures 14 .55 inches at
present. This marvel allows for 10 degrees of angularity 360 degree
rotation 2" of offset 2" axial movement,. Hell the u joints can't
move around that much. Besides it was hard clamped to the mount from
the engine in front of this connection not to mention rusted to the
point that it took an pneumatic impact chisel to get it apart.. So
what's the point. You need flex in between the turbo and the first
mount.

The Flex Connector with liner I choose is here at

http://vibrantperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php?
cPath=1022_1035_1064_1114&products_id=1008&osCsid=999d7ef5fdd15864bae3
3db41abf5ef9

The 2 90 degree turns were fabricated in that manner because it's not
easy to bend large diameter pipe in a single 180 degree bend, thus
they weld 2 90's together, which is the industry standard for
manufacturing a 180 degree turn in large pipe exhausts. Well this
ain't the factory and we're not constrained by what is easy. I have
acquired a 14ga 180 degree U-Tube that has the same external
dimensions as the original pipe. I'm not an engineer but I reasonably
certain that with the remaining 90 degree bend and a 45 degree bend
there will be sufficient back pressure.

There will also be a flexible pipe hanger mount behind the Flex
connector mounted on the ceiling of the engine compartment that will
support the middle section of pipe and will allow for any movement
and or torque that may be transferred to the pipe by the motor. The
original clamps for the muffler have to go as they are 6" but the
rubber isolated mounting bars will remain and that's all that was
there to begin with. So where's the rub? Bub!

Not to take anything away from the engineers that designed the Bird,
But there are some glaring deficiencies. 7 way trailer plug, Air
Purge System, Watts valve, Accelerator and Brake peddles, Front Left
Shock Mount, Relay for Jake Brake, W/D Vent for Slendide 2000,
Installation of Refrigerator with inadequate convection, The seat
belts mounted to floor instead of the seat, That reminds me I still
have to fix that one. Nothing like hitting a road transition just to
have the air ride seat bounce and the seat belts automatically adjust
for the slack then the air ride seat rebounds and the belts try to
cut you in half at the waist. That's just the 95 PT 42. I'm not
bitchin! I'm fixin

Kurt Horvath
95 PT 42
10AC



--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, David Brady
wrote:
>
> Kurt,
>
> I agree with Greg. I'm gonna keep mine stock. There's a bunch
> of vibration and movement back there. I figure BB's been building
> buses a whole lot longer than I have. Initially I'd scratch my
> head when looking at the frame and support pieces, but when
> you consider that something as big as a bus must twist and flex,
> this flexibility needs to be designed in. Make one piece stronger
> and you've created a stress raiser someplace else.
>
> I have a friend who transplanted a honda v-tech motor into a
> lotus elise. Everything worked but the alternator mount. The mount
> insists on cracking. There can be some weird harmonics and
> resonant frequencies going on that are difficult to grasp and
> only trial and error and a 50 year track record of building buses
> can solve (unless you can model it and run high powered
> computer finite element analysis on it). He's still fighting that
> mount...
>
> Okay, I'm off my soap box.
>
> David Brady
> '02 LXi, NC
>
> Gregory OConnor wrote:
> >
> > Kurt, try and figure why there were 4 bends. it may be that it was
> > engineered to alow for swing room between the 'hung exhaust' and
> > the 'torque reaction of the ruber mounted detroit'. look at the
roll
> > of the torque and see that there is a place for the movement to
twist
> > a union. I kinda think this movement was the problem with the
> > resulting crack. crack=result ;movement=cause ;facilitate movement
> > =repair. may be that BB enginered it correct but someone
> > overtightened a band to cure an exhaust leak??????? you also got
to
> > keep the stack from cantilivering off of the maniford with your
new
> > design. Scavenging is one variable in fuel efficiency. even
straight
> > pipes some time will result in lower fuel economy because the
intake
> > variable get screwd. backpressure is mathed into the computer.
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------
------
> >
> > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
> > Checked by AVG.
> > Version: 7.5.405 / Virus Database: 270.8.0/1715 - Release Date:
10/9/2008 12:00 AM
> >
>

[Kurt Horvath]

As one of our contributors, a retired heavy equip mech. recently
posted a reminder, sorry I don't recall his name at the moment. The V-
Band clamps are meant to hold pipes in place not cinch them down
tightly. My system has three V-Band clamps and Flange Assemblies that
are placed in a manner that will allow for multiple Axis movement.
Hangers are flexible and hard mounts have rubber isolators. This
equates to 7 attaching points all will flex or swivel. Well 8 if you
count the 5" X 10" SS Braided Flex Connector that will flex in any
direction.

Kurt Horvath
95 Pt 42
10AC



--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Kurt Horvath"
wrote:
>
> David, Would you like to take that brand new muffler off my hands???
>
> According to DD straight pipe & ECU will not have any issues in the
> 95 vintage S 60.
>
> OEM built that pipe for BB ACAP - As Cheep As Possible -
>
> The original routing of the pipe leaves the turbo, source of the
> first failure, cracked the 1st 90 degree turn a short straight run
> 2nd. 90 degree turn, then into a double ball connector that also
> telescopes in and out. You can check out that piece of S---, sorry
> engineering wonder here.
>
> http://www.dynaflexproducts.com/download...g70-89.pdf
>
> Page 76 Double Ball Joint with Slip Joint Feature Allowing Lateral
> Movement length 16 to 18 inches mine measures 14 .55 inches at
> present. This marvel allows for 10 degrees of angularity 360 degree
> rotation 2" of offset 2" axial movement,. Hell the u joints can't
> move around that much. Besides it was hard clamped to the mount
from
> the engine in front of this connection not to mention rusted to the
> point that it took an pneumatic impact chisel to get it apart.. So
> what's the point. You need flex in between the turbo and the first
> mount.
>
> The Flex Connector with liner I choose is here at
>
> http://vibrantperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php?
>
cPath=1022_1035_1064_1114&products_id=1008&osCsid=999d7ef5fdd15864bae3
> 3db41abf5ef9
>
> The 2 90 degree turns were fabricated in that manner because it's
not
> easy to bend large diameter pipe in a single 180 degree bend, thus
> they weld 2 90's together, which is the industry standard for
> manufacturing a 180 degree turn in large pipe exhausts. Well this
> ain't the factory and we're not constrained by what is easy. I have
> acquired a 14ga 180 degree U-Tube that has the same external
> dimensions as the original pipe. I'm not an engineer but I
reasonably
> certain that with the remaining 90 degree bend and a 45 degree bend
> there will be sufficient back pressure.
>
> There will also be a flexible pipe hanger mount behind the Flex
> connector mounted on the ceiling of the engine compartment that
will
> support the middle section of pipe and will allow for any movement
> and or torque that may be transferred to the pipe by the motor.
The
> original clamps for the muffler have to go as they are 6" but the
> rubber isolated mounting bars will remain and that's all that was
> there to begin with. So where's the rub? Bub!
>
> Not to take anything away from the engineers that designed the
Bird,
> But there are some glaring deficiencies. 7 way trailer plug, Air
> Purge System, Watts valve, Accelerator and Brake peddles, Front
Left
> Shock Mount, Relay for Jake Brake, W/D Vent for Slendide 2000,
> Installation of Refrigerator with inadequate convection, The seat
> belts mounted to floor instead of the seat, That reminds me I still
> have to fix that one. Nothing like hitting a road transition just
to
> have the air ride seat bounce and the seat belts automatically
adjust
> for the slack then the air ride seat rebounds and the belts try to
> cut you in half at the waist. That's just the 95 PT 42. I'm not
> bitchin! I'm fixin
>
> Kurt Horvath
> 95 PT 42
> 10AC
>
>
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, David Brady
> wrote:
> >
> > Kurt,
> >
> > I agree with Greg. I'm gonna keep mine stock. There's a bunch
> > of vibration and movement back there. I figure BB's been building
> > buses a whole lot longer than I have. Initially I'd scratch my
> > head when looking at the frame and support pieces, but when
> > you consider that something as big as a bus must twist and flex,
> > this flexibility needs to be designed in. Make one piece stronger
> > and you've created a stress raiser someplace else.
> >
> > I have a friend who transplanted a honda v-tech motor into a
> > lotus elise. Everything worked but the alternator mount. The mount
> > insists on cracking. There can be some weird harmonics and
> > resonant frequencies going on that are difficult to grasp and
> > only trial and error and a 50 year track record of building buses
> > can solve (unless you can model it and run high powered
> > computer finite element analysis on it). He's still fighting that
> > mount...
> >
> > Okay, I'm off my soap box.
> >
> > David Brady
> > '02 LXi, NC
> >
> > Gregory OConnor wrote:
> > >
> > > Kurt, try and figure why there were 4 bends. it may be that it
was
> > > engineered to alow for swing room between the 'hung exhaust' and
> > > the 'torque reaction of the ruber mounted detroit'. look at the
> roll
> > > of the torque and see that there is a place for the movement to
> twist
> > > a union. I kinda think this movement was the problem with the
> > > resulting crack. crack=result ;movement=cause ;facilitate
movement
> > > =repair. may be that BB enginered it correct but someone
> > > overtightened a band to cure an exhaust leak??????? you also
got
> to
> > > keep the stack from cantilivering off of the maniford with your
> new
> > > design. Scavenging is one variable in fuel efficiency. even
> straight
> > > pipes some time will result in lower fuel economy because the
> intake
> > > variable get screwd. backpressure is mathed into the computer.
> > >
> > >
> > > ----------------------------------------------------------------
--
> ------
> > >
> > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
> > > Checked by AVG.
> > > Version: 7.5.405 / Virus Database: 270.8.0/1715 - Release Date:
> 10/9/2008 12:00 AM
> > >
> >
>

[Kurt Horvath]

Yea I've heard that but the one with the liner has fixed the high
pressure leaks according to the Mfg. Let's hope. Prevost has from
what I recall pipes bent in one piece, they are held together with
those nifty band clamps that seat and conform to the pipe exterior,
If the V-Bands and Flanges don't work out I'll go to those pipe
clamps. The Flanges are also available with three different types of
gaskets, o-ring, flat, and, and, and I can't remember, oh yea the
type I bought, male-female flanges, perfect alignment, leak free,
again according to Vibrant Mfg. There is also a Stainless Steel
Muffler available that may work well on your coach, but it's inlet
outlet is 5" not the 6" like on your coach. well I assume yours is
6"??? Also it is 10" in diameter which would help with crowed exhaust
tunnel.

Kurt Horvath
95 Pt 42
10AC

--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, David Brady
wrote:
>
> Hi Kurt,
>
> No thanks, I already have a stock muffler. Thanks for the links,
> there's some pretty nifty items there. Be careful with those fancy
> braided stainless steel pieces. They look sharp, but they've always
> leaked on my turbocharged subaru wrx. Kurt, you've been around
> a few over-the-road coaches, Prevost' and what not, what do they
> run on their exhaust systems; i.e., expansion pipes, flex pipe, etc.
>
> David Brady
> '02 LXi, NC
>
> Kurt Horvath wrote:
> >
> > David, Would you like to take that brand new muffler off my
hands???
> >
> > According to DD straight pipe & ECU will not have any issues in
the
> > 95 vintage S 60.
> >
> > OEM built that pipe for BB ACAP - As Cheep As Possible -
> >
> > The original routing of the pipe leaves the turbo, source of the
> > first failure, cracked the 1st 90 degree turn a short straight run
> > 2nd. 90 degree turn, then into a double ball connector that also
> > telescopes in and out. You can check out that piece of S---, sorry
> > engineering wonder here.
> >
> > http://www.dynaflexproducts.com/download...g_03_pg70-
89.pdf
> > <http://www.dynaflexproducts.com/download...g_03_pg70-
89.pdf>
> >
> > Page 76 Double Ball Joint with Slip Joint Feature Allowing Lateral
> > Movement length 16 to 18 inches mine measures 14 .55 inches at
> > present. This marvel allows for 10 degrees of angularity 360
degree
> > rotation 2" of offset 2" axial movement,. Hell the u joints can't
> > move around that much. Besides it was hard clamped to the mount
from
> > the engine in front of this connection not to mention rusted to
the
> > point that it took an pneumatic impact chisel to get it apart.. So
> > what's the point. You need flex in between the turbo and the first
> > mount.
> >
> > The Flex Connector with liner I choose is here at
> >
> > http://vibrantperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php?
> > <http://vibrantperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php?>
> >
cPath=1022_1035_1064_1114&products_id=1008&osCsid=999d7ef5fdd15864bae3
> > 3db41abf5ef9
> >
> > The 2 90 degree turns were fabricated in that manner because it's
not
> > easy to bend large diameter pipe in a single 180 degree bend, thus
> > they weld 2 90's together, which is the industry standard for
> > manufacturing a 180 degree turn in large pipe exhausts. Well this
> > ain't the factory and we're not constrained by what is easy. I
have
> > acquired a 14ga 180 degree U-Tube that has the same external
> > dimensions as the original pipe. I'm not an engineer but I
reasonably
> > certain that with the remaining 90 degree bend and a 45 degree
bend
> > there will be sufficient back pressure.
> >
> > There will also be a flexible pipe hanger mount behind the Flex
> > connector mounted on the ceiling of the engine compartment that
will
> > support the middle section of pipe and will allow for any movement
> > and or torque that may be transferred to the pipe by the motor.
The
> > original clamps for the muffler have to go as they are 6" but the
> > rubber isolated mounting bars will remain and that's all that was
> > there to begin with. So where's the rub? Bub!
> >
> > Not to take anything away from the engineers that designed the
Bird,
> > But there are some glaring deficiencies. 7 way trailer plug, Air
> > Purge System, Watts valve, Accelerator and Brake peddles, Front
Left
> > Shock Mount, Relay for Jake Brake, W/D Vent for Slendide 2000,
> > Installation of Refrigerator with inadequate convection, The seat
> > belts mounted to floor instead of the seat, That reminds me I
still
> > have to fix that one. Nothing like hitting a road transition just
to
> > have the air ride seat bounce and the seat belts automatically
adjust
> > for the slack then the air ride seat rebounds and the belts try to
> > cut you in half at the waist. That's just the 95 PT 42. I'm not
> > bitchin! I'm fixin
> >
> > Kurt Horvath
> > 95 PT 42
> > 10AC
> >
> > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
> > , David Brady
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > Kurt,
> > >
> > > I agree with Greg. I'm gonna keep mine stock. There's a bunch
> > > of vibration and movement back there. I figure BB's been
building
> > > buses a whole lot longer than I have. Initially I'd scratch my
> > > head when looking at the frame and support pieces, but when
> > > you consider that something as big as a bus must twist and flex,
> > > this flexibility needs to be designed in. Make one piece
stronger
> > > and you've created a stress raiser someplace else.
> > >
> > > I have a friend who transplanted a honda v-tech motor into a
> > > lotus elise. Everything worked but the alternator mount. The
mount
> > > insists on cracking. There can be some weird harmonics and
> > > resonant frequencies going on that are difficult to grasp and
> > > only trial and error and a 50 year track record of building
buses
> > > can solve (unless you can model it and run high powered
> > > computer finite element analysis on it). He's still fighting
that
> > > mount...
> > >
> > > Okay, I'm off my soap box.
> > >
> > > David Brady
> > > '02 LXi, NC
> > >
> > > Gregory OConnor wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Kurt, try and figure why there were 4 bends. it may be that
it was
> > > > engineered to alow for swing room between the 'hung exhaust'
and
> > > > the 'torque reaction of the ruber mounted detroit'. look at
the
> > roll
> > > > of the torque and see that there is a place for the movement
to
> > twist
> > > > a union. I kinda think this movement was the problem with the
> > > > resulting crack. crack=result ;movement=cause ;facilitate
movement
> > > > =repair. may be that BB enginered it correct but someone
> > > > overtightened a band to cure an exhaust leak??????? you also
got
> > to
> > > > keep the stack from cantilivering off of the maniford with
your
> > new
> > > > design. Scavenging is one variable in fuel efficiency. even
> > straight
> > > > pipes some time will result in lower fuel economy because the
> > intake
> > > > variable get screwd. backpressure is mathed into the computer.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ----------------------------------------------------------
> > ------
> > > >
> > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
> > > > Checked by AVG.
> > > > Version: 7.5.405 / Virus Database: 270.8.0/1715 - Release
Date:
> > 10/9/2008 12:00 AM
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------
------
> >
> > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
> > Checked by AVG.
> > Version: 7.5.405 / Virus Database: 270.8.0/1715 - Release Date:
10/9/2008 12:00 AM
> >
>

[David Brady]

Hi Kurt,



No thanks, I already have a stock muffler. Thanks for the links,

there's some pretty nifty items there. Be careful with those fancy

braided stainless steel pieces. They look sharp, but they've always

leaked on my turbocharged subaru wrx. Kurt, you've been around

a few over-the-road coaches, Prevost' and what not, what do they

run on their exhaust systems; i.e., expansion pipes, flex pipe, etc.



David Brady

'02 LXi, NC



Kurt Horvath wrote:

David, Would you like to take that brand new muffler off my
hands???



According to DD straight pipe & ECU will not have any issues in the


95 vintage S 60.



OEM built that pipe for BB ACAP - As Cheep As Possible -



The original routing of the pipe leaves the turbo, source of the

first failure, cracked the 1st 90 degree turn a short straight run

2nd. 90 degree turn, then into a double ball connector that also

telescopes in and out. You can check out that piece of S---, sorry

engineering wonder here.



http://www.dynaflexproducts.com/downloads/DP_Catalog_03_pg70-89.pdf




Page 76 Double Ball Joint with Slip Joint Feature Allowing Lateral

Movement length 16 to 18 inches mine measures 14 .55 inches at

present. This marvel allows for 10 degrees of angularity 360 degree

rotation 2" of offset 2" axial movement,. Hell the u joints can't

move around that much. Besides it was hard clamped to the mount from

the engine in front of this connection not to mention rusted to the

point that it took an pneumatic impact chisel to get it apart.. So

what's the point. You need flex in between the turbo and the first

mount.



The Flex Connector with liner I choose is here at



http://vibrantperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php?

cPath=1022_1035_1064_1114&products_id=1008&osCsid=999d7ef5fdd15864bae3

3db41abf5ef9



The 2 90 degree turns were fabricated in that manner because it's not

easy to bend large diameter pipe in a single 180 degree bend, thus

they weld 2 90's together, which is the industry standard for

manufacturing a 180 degree turn in large pipe exhausts. Well this

ain't the factory and we're not constrained by what is easy. I have

acquired a 14ga 180 degree U-Tube that has the same external

dimensions as the original pipe. I'm not an engineer but I reasonably

certain that with the remaining 90 degree bend and a 45 degree bend

there will be sufficient back pressure.



There will also be a flexible pipe hanger mount behind the Flex

connector mounted on the ceiling of the engine compartment that will

support the middle section of pipe and will allow for any movement

and or torque that may be transferred to the pipe by the motor. The

original clamps for the muffler have to go as they are 6" but the

rubber isolated mounting bars will remain and that's all that was

there to begin with. So where's the rub? Bub!



Not to take anything away from the engineers that designed the Bird,

But there are some glaring deficiencies. 7 way trailer plug, Air

Purge System, Watts valve, Accelerator and Brake peddles, Front Left

Shock Mount, Relay for Jake Brake, W/D Vent for Slendide 2000,

Installation of Refrigerator with inadequate convection, The seat

belts mounted to floor instead of the seat, That reminds me I still

have to fix that one. Nothing like hitting a road transition just to

have the air ride seat bounce and the seat belts automatically adjust

for the slack then the air ride seat rebounds and the belts try to

cut you in half at the waist. That's just the 95 PT 42. I'm not

bitchin! I'm fixin



Kurt Horvath

95 PT 42

10AC



--- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com",
David Brady "dmb993@..."

wrote:

>

> Kurt,

>

> I agree with Greg. I'm gonna keep mine stock. There's a bunch

> of vibration and movement back there. I figure BB's been building

> buses a whole lot longer than I have. Initially I'd scratch my

> head when looking at the frame and support pieces, but when

> you consider that something as big as a bus must twist and flex,

> this flexibility needs to be designed in. Make one piece stronger

> and you've created a stress raiser someplace else.

>

> I have a friend who transplanted a honda v-tech motor into a

> lotus elise. Everything worked but the alternator mount. The mount

> insists on cracking. There can be some weird harmonics and

> resonant frequencies going on that are difficult to grasp and

> only trial and error and a 50 year track record of building buses

> can solve (unless you can model it and run high powered

> computer finite element analysis on it). He's still fighting that

> mount...

>

> Okay, I'm off my soap box.

>

> David Brady

> '02 LXi, NC

>

> Gregory OConnor wrote:

> >

> > Kurt, try and figure why there were 4 bends. it may be that
it was

> > engineered to alow for swing room between the 'hung exhaust'
and

> > the 'torque reaction of the ruber mounted detroit'. look at
the

roll

> > of the torque and see that there is a place for the movement
to

twist

> > a union. I kinda think this movement was the problem with the

> > resulting crack. crack=result ;movement=cause ;facilitate
movement

> > =repair. may be that BB enginered it correct but someone

> > overtightened a band to cure an exhaust leak??????? you also
got

to

> > keep the stack from cantilivering off of the maniford with
your

new

> > design. Scavenging is one variable in fuel efficiency. even

straight

> > pipes some time will result in lower fuel economy because the


intake

> > variable get screwd. backpressure is mathed into the computer.

> >

> >

> > ----------------------------------------------------------

------

> >

> > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > Checked by AVG.

> > Version: 7.5.405 / Virus Database: 270.8.0/1715 - Release
Date:

10/9/2008 12:00 AM

> >

>

Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.405 / Virus Database: 270.8.0/1715 - Release Date: 10/9/2008 12:00 AM

[David Brady]

The LXi, like your WB, uses a 6 inch muffler. Five inch will

certainly suck some ponies away.



David Brady

'02 LXi, NC



Kurt Horvath wrote:

Yea I've heard that but the one with the liner has fixed the high

pressure leaks according to the Mfg. Let's hope. Prevost has from

what I recall pipes bent in one piece, they are held together with

those nifty band clamps that seat and conform to the pipe exterior,

If the V-Bands and Flanges don't work out I'll go to those pipe

clamps. The Flanges are also available with three different types of

gaskets, o-ring, flat, and, and, and I can't remember, oh yea the

type I bought, male-female flanges, perfect alignment, leak free,

again according to Vibrant Mfg. There is also a Stainless Steel

Muffler available that may work well on your coach, but it's inlet

outlet is 5" not the 6" like on your coach. well I assume yours is

6"??? Also it is 10" in diameter which would help with crowed exhaust

tunnel.



Kurt Horvath

95 Pt 42

10AC



--- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com",
David Brady "dmb993@..."

wrote:

>

> Hi Kurt,

>

> No thanks, I already have a stock muffler. Thanks for the links,

> there's some pretty nifty items there. Be careful with those fancy

> braided stainless steel pieces. They look sharp, but they've always

> leaked on my turbocharged subaru wrx. Kurt, you've been around

> a few over-the-road coaches, Prevost' and what not, what do they

> run on their exhaust systems; i.e., expansion pipes, flex pipe,
etc.

>

> David Brady

> '02 LXi, NC

>

> Kurt Horvath wrote:

> >

> > David, Would you like to take that brand new muffler off my

hands???

> >

> > According to DD straight pipe & ECU will not have any
issues in

the

> > 95 vintage S 60.

> >

> > OEM built that pipe for BB ACAP - As Cheep As Possible -

> >

> > The original routing of the pipe leaves the turbo, source of
the

> > first failure, cracked the 1st 90 degree turn a short
straight run

> > 2nd. 90 degree turn, then into a double ball connector that
also

> > telescopes in and out. You can check out that piece of S---,
sorry

> > engineering wonder here.

> >

> > http://www.dynaflexproducts.com/downloads/DP_Catalog_03_pg70-

89.pdf

> > <http://www.dynaflexproducts.com/downloads/DP_Catalog_03_pg70-

89.pdf>

> >

> > Page 76 Double Ball Joint with Slip Joint Feature Allowing
Lateral

> > Movement length 16 to 18 inches mine measures 14 .55 inches at

> > present. This marvel allows for 10 degrees of angularity 360

degree

> > rotation 2" of offset 2" axial movement,. Hell the u joints
can't

> > move around that much. Besides it was hard clamped to the
mount

from

> > the engine in front of this connection not to mention rusted
to

the

> > point that it took an pneumatic impact chisel to get it
apart.. So

> > what's the point. You need flex in between the turbo and the
first

> > mount.

> >

> > The Flex Connector with liner I choose is here at

> >

> > http://vibrantperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php?


> > <http://vibrantperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php?>

> >

cPath=1022_1035_1064_1114&products_id=1008&osCsid=999d7ef5fdd15864bae3

> > 3db41abf5ef9

> >

> > The 2 90 degree turns were fabricated in that manner because
it's

not

> > easy to bend large diameter pipe in a single 180 degree bend,
thus

> > they weld 2 90's together, which is the industry standard for

> > manufacturing a 180 degree turn in large pipe exhausts. Well
this

> > ain't the factory and we're not constrained by what is easy.
I

have

> > acquired a 14ga 180 degree U-Tube that has the same external

> > dimensions as the original pipe. I'm not an engineer but I

reasonably

> > certain that with the remaining 90 degree bend and a 45
degree

bend

> > there will be sufficient back pressure.

> >

> > There will also be a flexible pipe hanger mount behind the
Flex

> > connector mounted on the ceiling of the engine compartment
that

will

> > support the middle section of pipe and will allow for any
movement

> > and or torque that may be transferred to the pipe by the
motor.

The

> > original clamps for the muffler have to go as they are 6" but
the

> > rubber isolated mounting bars will remain and that's all that
was

> > there to begin with. So where's the rub? Bub!

> >

> > Not to take anything away from the engineers that designed
the

Bird,

> > But there are some glaring deficiencies. 7 way trailer plug,
Air

> > Purge System, Watts valve, Accelerator and Brake peddles,
Front

Left

> > Shock Mount, Relay for Jake Brake, W/D Vent for Slendide 2000,

> > Installation of Refrigerator with inadequate convection, The
seat

> > belts mounted to floor instead of the seat, That reminds me I


still

> > have to fix that one. Nothing like hitting a road transition
just

to

> > have the air ride seat bounce and the seat belts
automatically

adjust

> > for the slack then the air ride seat rebounds and the belts
try to

> > cut you in half at the waist. That's just the 95 PT 42. I'm
not

> > bitchin! I'm fixin

> >

> > Kurt Horvath

> > 95 PT 42

> > 10AC

> >

> > --- In "WanderlodgeForum%40yahoogroups.com"


> > <"Wanderlodge"Forum%40yahoogroups.com>,
David Brady

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Kurt,

> > >

> > > I agree with Greg. I'm gonna keep mine stock. There's a
bunch

> > > of vibration and movement back there. I figure BB's been


building

> > > buses a whole lot longer than I have. Initially I'd
scratch my

> > > head when looking at the frame and support pieces, but
when

> > > you consider that something as big as a bus must twist
and flex,

> > > this flexibility needs to be designed in. Make one piece


stronger

> > > and you've created a stress raiser someplace else.

> > >

> > > I have a friend who transplanted a honda v-tech motor
into a

> > > lotus elise. Everything worked but the alternator mount.
The

mount

> > > insists on cracking. There can be some weird harmonics
and

> > > resonant frequencies going on that are difficult to
grasp and

> > > only trial and error and a 50 year track record of
building

buses

> > > can solve (unless you can model it and run high powered

> > > computer finite element analysis on it). He's still
fighting

that

> > > mount...

> > >

> > > Okay, I'm off my soap box.

> > >

> > > David Brady

> > > '02 LXi, NC

> > >

> > > Gregory OConnor wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Kurt, try and figure why there were 4 bends. it may
be that

it was

> > > > engineered to alow for swing room between the 'hung
exhaust'

and

> > > > the 'torque reaction of the ruber mounted detroit'.
look at

the

> > roll

> > > > of the torque and see that there is a place for the
movement

to

> > twist

> > > > a union. I kinda think this movement was the
problem with the

> > > > resulting crack. crack=result ;movement=cause
;facilitate

movement

> > > > =repair. may be that BB enginered it correct but
someone

> > > > overtightened a band to cure an exhaust leak???????
you also

got

> > to

> > > > keep the stack from cantilivering off of the
maniford with

your

> > new

> > > > design. Scavenging is one variable in fuel
efficiency. even

> > straight

> > > > pipes some time will result in lower fuel economy
because the

> > intake

> > > > variable get screwd. backpressure is mathed into
the computer.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ----------------------------------------------------------

> > ------

> > > >

> > > > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > > > Checked by AVG.

> > > > Version: 7.5.405 / Virus Database: 270.8.0/1715 -
Release

Date:

> > 10/9/2008 12:00 AM

> > > >

> > >

> >

> >

> > ----------------------------------------------------------

------

> >

> > Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

> > Checked by AVG.

> > Version: 7.5.405 / Virus Database: 270.8.0/1715 - Release
Date:

10/9/2008 12:00 AM

> >

>

Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.

Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.405 / Virus Database: 270.8.0/1715 - Release Date: 10/9/2008 12:00 AM