Help...Us buy our first motoerhome......

[Al Scudder]

no rivets on the 2000 and beyond I believe

Scooter

2000 LX Ocqueoc,MI

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To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
From: w5sk@...
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2010 08:01:27 -0600
Subject: RE: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Help...Us buy our first motoerhome......

Good Morning,

On the Prevost side - I think I like the rivited coaches (XL) both from cost and from appearance. Maybe 98 to 2000 with IFS - no slides.

On the BB - I am just learning. Probably 200k $ limit. The cost has been dropping quickly on both - not sure where the bottom is yet or if there will be one.

I note that you suggested LXi 2004 or earlier?

Wave

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From: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com [mailto:WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ross MacKillop
Sent: Monday, January 18, 2010 6:08 PM
To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Help...Us buy our first motoerhome......

HI,

What years or $ are you considering for a coach.

Prevost - best to consider 2004 shell (2005 conversion) or later. Has front axle upgrade

Blue Bird--LXi 2004 or earlier.

Ross

06 LXi

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From: wavel net>
To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, January 18, 2010 3:36:30 PM
Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Help...Us buy our first motoerhome......

David,



Thanks you for the insight.You are right - I do not have an agenda except to move up to a bus - which means I am looking at Prevost and Bluebird. I am sure that topic has come before the group many times.It appears that BB is the better bargin- but I am not sure about the rest of the equation. I really appreciate the group and what they mean to a prospective owner.



Wave



SW Oklahoma

-----Original Message-----
From: david brady
Sent: Jan 17, 2010 10:58 PM
To: WanderlodgeForum@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Help...Us buy our first motoerhome.. ....

Wave,

I'm sure you have good intentions so I'll followup. The factory used
2 different bars on the LXi. A 1.75" diameter bar and a 2.125" diameter
bar. My bus came equipped with the 2.125". I don't know why they
used two bars; since there's no factory at this point one could only
speculate. I haven't had an opportunity to try the softer 1.75" bar.
It may be just right. All I know for certain is that the 2.125" bar is too
stiff. Over the years I've noticed that we Wanderlodge owners aren't
afraid to tune our buses to our personal tastes. Many of us are engineers,
or have years of trucking experience, or race car experience, or hands
on mechanical experience and knowledge. One thing I've learned over
the years is to never prejudge a Wanderlodge owner; we are a credentialed
lot.

David Brady
'02 LXi, NC


On 1/17/2010 10:42 PM, wavel wrote:

Can imagine someone new to the product feeling like they have to second guess the engineers at BB by removing the anti sway bar for an acceptable ride on the LXi? Should these issues not be worked out at the factory?







Wave

-----Original Message-----
From: David Brady
Sent: Jan 17, 2010 8:58 PM
To: WanderlodgeForum@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Help...Us buy our first motoerhome.. ....

Hi Brad,

Thanks for your clarification. You may be on to something. There's simply
no way to build something as big as an LXi and not have any flex in the
chassis, and indeed there is strength in flexibility. The LXi is a departure
from the usual Wanderlodge build methods. It still uses the main c-channel
backbone, but in addition, it adds supporting framework that envelops the
backbone. The FC's, PT's and even the Wide Bodies, are all essentially
box over frame construction. The box adds considerable stiffness to what
would otherwise be a rather whippy c-channel backbone. There was no way
that this style of construction could stand a hole cut in the side for a slide.
The engineers needed to rethink the structure. In the LXi you'll find the c-channnel
backbone, and connected to it a stout set of triangulated boxes that make up the
basement. Along the perimeter of the skin there are 5 sets of stout longitudinal
structures, (1) a pair of longitudinal frame rails that run underneath the basement
from steer axle to drive axle, (2) extruded aluminum torque tubes at the top
corners of the roof, (3) the belt bar that runs the full length of the coach at
the base of the windows, (4) the hip beam that runs the full length of the coach
at floor level, and (5) a beam that runs at the basement floor outer corner from
the steer to the drive axle. All of these have vertical supports posts tying the beams
together at the outer skin. The inside walls are also steel gusseted from floor
level to the belt bar under the windows. The joints are welded or huck bolted
together. The folks at the factory, whom I've spoken with, have nothing but praise
for the rigidity of the slide equipped LXi. It is a rather amazing piece representing
40 years of evolution along with new design elements meant to support slide
technology. In my view it's more of a perimeter design than the older box on
frame style, meaning that the space frame envelops the c-channel and the two
work in harmony. My hats off to the folks who did it. Now does it ride rough?
In stock form it does. As everyone here knows by now, I removed my OEM
steer axle anti-sway bar and am overwhelmed by the improvement in ride and
handling. The stock bar is simply too stiff. This stiffness results in almost no
independent steer axle wheel movement and excessive vertical suspension
movement. This may be the cause of some of the issues owners have expressed
with their buses. There may be other causes: tire pressures, ride height, shocks,
maybe a chassis that's too stiff. I don't know. My own experience is that with
the anti-sway bar removed you'll be hard pressed to find a better handing or riding
bus, and I've driven many Prevost's over the years. On the other hand, I am a
slightly biased LXi owner so feel free to take all of this with a grain of salt!. LOL.

Good luck in your search.

David Brady
'02 LXi, NC

-----Original Message-----
From: brad barton
Sent: Jan 17, 2010 8:10 PM
To: wanderlodgeforum@ yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Help...Us buy our first motoerhome.. ....

Wave,
I am only a civilian, not a mechanic, so these are just my impressions. There are many others who would disagree. Compared to my 35'FC and the 43' LXi, the Newell had much less vertical movement in travel. It's just the way different manufacturers set up the suspension and handle the weight on their coaches.
My opinion is that the 43' length of the coach, exaggerated by the wide travel of the suspension produced either flexes or possibly shocks that resulted in several failures plus chatters, chirps and rattles, alllocated near the middle of the coach which I outlined earlier. Maybe they were all unrelated. Maybe I just had some bad luck- Ican't sayfor sure.
Don't get me wrong, my LXi was, and still is the most elegant coach I've ever seen.I'm glad I had the experience of owning it. If I was forced to make a choice right now though, I'd take a close look at a non-slide LXi, a PT40 or an LX if they were impeccably maintained or re-done.
Best of luck,
Brad




"bbartonwx@hotmail.com"

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To: WanderlodgeForum@ yahoogroups. com
From: w5sk@earthlink. net
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2010 15:57:36 +0000
Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Help...Us buy our first motoerhome.. ....

Brad,

I am new to this forum. Have owned several glass coaches but looking to move up to a bus. Currently in a 40' Vogue V 96 which is really a very nice fiberglass Prevost look alike.

You said that the 43 foot Wonderlodge had some issues with the ride. Do you think that was the length or the chassis. Could you tell me more?

Thanks,

Wave
Near Medicine Park, Ok.
96 Vogue V
still working

--- In "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com", brad barton <bbartonwx@. ..> wrote:
>
>
> Clyde,
>
> I've owned an 84 FC Blue Bird Wanderlodge, an 86 Newell and a 2000 Wanderlodge LXi. For what it's worth, my 84 FC was the most trouble-free coach I had, but underpowered (for my taste).
>
> The 86 Newell was the best handling coach I had, a pleasure to drive, but a few of the parts were getting hard to find in 2004. My LXi was more problematic than I thought it should've been. I think the 43' length, excessive vertical movement and body flex were related to several problems. I'd rather stay at 38-40'.
>
>
>
> Since you're in St. Louis, you'd be fairly close to the Newell factory in Miami, OK. And they are a pleasure to deal with on maintenance and service issues (as I'm sure Blue Bird was when their factory was still in business). A later-model Newell (Series 2000 or newer) in pristine condition would be a good choice, just keep it serviced at the factory.
>
>
>
> A late 80's to mid 90's Wanderlodge PT40 or SP36 would be fine if it's been renovated and free of rust.
>
>
>
> If I were in the market for a bus-style coach, I'd find out who services Prevost and Marathon coaches in my area and get their opinion on parts and maintenance.
>
> And, if you buy a metal coach, you'll probably never want to buy a fiberglass coach again, no matter what the price.
>
>
> No coach, new, used, metal or plastic will be a snap to own and run. You have to be prepared financially and emotionally for wear, tear, breakage, replacement parts and plenty of maintenance. One other thing that's real important is..no leaks. No air leaks at the door, no water leaks anywhere, roof, windows, tanks or valves. They have a way of causing more damage to more things than you can imagine. If it leaks, and they won't guarantee the fix, keep looking. Best of luck.
>
>
> bbartonwx@.. .
>
>
>
>
>
> To: "WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com"
> From: cmlintx@...
> Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 07:07:50 -0800
> Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Help...Us buy our first motoerhome.. ....
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> My wife and I would like to buy a diesel pusher this spring. In your opinion, would it be better to buy an older Blue Bird, Prevost, or Newell or....... a newer Newmar, Holiday Rambler, Fleetwood, or Tiffin? Our funds are limited so a new ones are out of the question.
>
> Your opinion is welcome and needed!!
>
> Thank You,
> Clyde Byram
> St. Louis, MO
> Want-A-Be Motorhomer
>
>
>
> ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
> Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection.
> http://clk.atdmt. com/GBL/go/ 196390707/ direct/01/
>

---

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---

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[Mark]

Thanks Brad and Pete for those insights. I don’t have
any problems doing stuff like you describe.

I think my worry was about major systems failures such as
engine and driveline. Stuff that cannot be fixed

While boondocking.

[Ryan Wright]

Mark,

You should be able to drop two or three grand, at will, when necessary. You might do this once or twice a year, or you might do it every two or three years, but the fact is something is going to fail. My air compressor croaked and it cost me about a thousand bucks with labor (I had them replace some deteriorated coolant lines while they were back there). A new alternator was in the $400-500 range. My refrigerator died, that was $1200 (I replaced that myself).


Point is, if you have money set aside and can pull a couple grand out to fix something on a whim, and if you can reasonably replenish that fund in a few months just in case you need it again, you will probably be fine. However, people who are living month to month where a $500 repair is a huge problem for them, probably should reconsider buying a coach, especially one like this. It will quickly become an anchor around their neck, deteriorate and turn into a yard ornament.


You can do a lot of work yourself. I spent a weekend replacing some parts on my generator. ~$100 worth of parts and saved ~$2000 in labor by doing the work myself. It wasn't even that difficult, as I had forum members here who gave me the necessary advice and virtual hand-holding to get through it (thank you!). This is an excellent resource. I could have replaced the alternator and compressor, too, but I was in a hurry and just wanted it done (and didn't really have a good place to do it myself).


I'd plan on $3k to $5k per year in maintenance. If you can handle that, you'll be fine. If you get a good coach and take care of it, you won't have to spend this every year. Some years you might only spend a couple hundred bucks on oil and filters. As long as you are able and willing to spend this much yearly, you shouldn't be disappointed in your new toy.


You mentioned "major systems... such as (the) engine." Expect to pay $25,000 give or take if you need to rebuild your engine. That's a huge hit for most of us. I mitigate this potential by keeping up on all engine maintenance, keeping the radiator cleaned, and watching the gauges closely for signs of trouble. Thankfully, a Blue Bird has an abundance of gauges.


-Ryan

On Tue, Jan 19, 2010 at 9:00 AM, Mark <"summitwolf@comcast.net"> wrote:

 

Thanks Brad and Pete for those insights. I don’t have
any problems doing stuff like you describe.

I think my worry was about major systems failures such as
engine and driveline. Stuff that cannot be fixed

While boondocking.

[Ryan Wright]

Forgot to sign my post with coach information.

-Ryan
'86 PT-40 8V92

On Tue, Jan 26, 2010 at 1:51 PM, Ryan Wright wrote:
> Mark,
>
> You should be able to drop two or three grand, at will, when necessary. You
> might do this once or twice a year, or you might do it every two or three
> years, but the fact is something is going to fail. My air compressor croaked
> and it cost me about a thousand bucks with labor (I had them replace some
> deteriorated coolant lines while they were back there). A new alternator was
> in the $400-500 range. My refrigerator died, that was $1200 (I replaced that
> myself).
>
> Point is, if you have money set aside and can pull a couple grand out to fix
> something on a whim, and if you can reasonably replenish that fund in a few
> months just in case you need it again, you will probably be fine. However,
> people who are living month to month where a $500 repair is a huge problem
> for them, probably should reconsider buying a coach, especially one like
> this. It will quickly become an anchor around their neck, deteriorate and
> turn into a yard ornament.
>
> You can do a lot of work yourself. I spent a weekend replacing some parts on
> my generator. ~$100 worth of parts and saved ~$2000 in labor by doing the
> work myself. It wasn't even that difficult, as I had forum members here who
> gave me the necessary advice and virtual hand-holding to get through it
> (thank you!). This is an excellent resource. I could have replaced the
> alternator and compressor, too, but I was in a hurry and just wanted it done
> (and didn't really have a good place to do it myself).
>
> I'd plan on $3k to $5k per year in maintenance. If you can handle that,
> you'll be fine. If you get a good coach and take care of it, you won't have
> to spend this every year. Some years you might only spend a couple hundred
> bucks on oil and filters. As long as you are able and willing to spend this
> much yearly, you shouldn't be disappointed in your new toy.
>
> You mentioned "major systems... such as (the) engine." Expect to pay $25,000
> give or take if you need to rebuild your engine. That's a huge hit for most
> of us. I mitigate this potential by keeping up on all engine maintenance,
> keeping the radiator cleaned, and watching the gauges closely for signs of
> trouble. Thankfully, a Blue Bird has an abundance of gauges.
>
> -Ryan
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 19, 2010 at 9:00 AM, Mark wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks Brad and Pete for those insights. I don’t have any problems doing
>> stuff like you describe.
>>
>> I think my worry was about major systems failures such as engine and
>> driveline. Stuff that cannot be fixed
>>
>> While boondocking.
>>
>>
>
>