Billings, MT City Council Minutes

[ronmarabito2002]

O.K., I hope this makes up for the lack of comments attached to my
last message related to comments made by owners of two campgrounds in
Billings, MT. Go to this site:

http://ci.billings.mt.us/Online/PDF/Gove...TES_2005_0
8_15.pdf


Please go and read the link and see if you like what these businesses
think about their customers. You and Me.

They are definitely on my DO NOT CAMP HERE LIST.

R.E. (Ron) Marabito, Dallas, TX 92WB40

[Thomas Warner]

Seems like FMCA is not sticking up for us. Have they painted an image
of us that we dont like?

many of the people writing to complain are "escapees" from
Livingston, TX who are fulltime
RVers with no fixed address who live free in RVs. These people drain
their tanks into storm
drains and along roadways and dump their trash in other peoples receptacles

tom
1982 FC35
Vernon Center,NY


At 11:20 PM 9/16/2005, you wrote:
>O.K., I hope this makes up for the lack of comments attached to my
>last message related to comments made by owners of two campgrounds in
>Billings, MT. Go to this site:
>
><http://ci.billings.mt.us/Online/PDF/Gove...TES_2005_0>http:/\
/ci.billings.mt.us/Online/PDF/Government/minutes/WSMINUTES_2005_0
>8_15.pdf
>
>
>Please go and read the link and see if you like what these businesses
>think about their customers. You and Me.
>
>They are definitely on my DO NOT CAMP HERE LIST.
>
>R.E. (Ron) Marabito, Dallas, TX 92WB40

[Julia Bonser]

Sure wish I lived free in my RV like the campground owner said. We
spent one night there this year while getting our toad looked at. We
choose to go on down the road to Livingston, MT to another campground
and drive the 100 miles to Billings for the rest of the service on
our car a/c. Their price was prohibitive over $30 a night for a spot
in an over crowded line of RV's.

My free RV just cost us some more money as the cooling unit went out
on our refrigerator. The refrigerator is less than 4 years old and
the cooling unit should have lasted us at least 6 more years
according to the RV technician. We decided to replace it with a small
apartment sized electric refrigerator. Today they removed the Dometic
and we brought in the new refrigerator. It was a tough job getting
them through the door.

If I ever overnight in Billings you can be sure it will be in a
parking lot instead of a campground.

Julie Bonser
1992 WLWB PT 40'



On Sep 16, 2005, at 8:20 PM, ronmarabito2002 wrote:

> O.K., I hope this makes up for the lack of comments attached to my
> last message related to comments made by owners of two campgrounds in
> Billings, MT. Go to this site:
>
> http://ci.billings.mt.us/Online/PDF/Government/minutes/
> WSMINUTES_2005_0
> 8_15.pdf
>
>
> Please go and read the link and see if you like what these businesses
> think about their customers. You and Me.
>
> They are definitely on my DO NOT CAMP HERE LIST.
>
> R.E. (Ron) Marabito, Dallas, TX 92WB40
>
>
>
>
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[erniecarpet@...]

Julie, we had to replace our refer back in July. Brenda went in the coach
one day and smelled ammonia. We did the same as you- put in an apartment sized
refer. Thanks to Bim Burt for helping with the R/R and modifications. We
hardly ever boon dock, and can always start the generator. Ernie-83pt40 in
montana


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Jack & Donna Smith]

Note on Billings KOA.. At this spot, you get off the freeway and
drive about 2 or 3 miles to the Billings KOA. About 1/2 mile before
you reach the KOA, you pass another private campground... There are
plenty of signs along the way informing you that the KOA is the SECOND
campground!!
A couple of years ago, our refidgerator quit on the first few days of
a 2 month trip. We visited the local Home Depot, and bought a small
(2cuft) 110V. Bar type unit, and strapped it to the dinette table with
a ratchet tiedown.. It got us thru the trip.
Back home, we visited our RV repair store, and lucked out by finding a
year old 'take-out' unit from someone that had upgraded.. At $650,
installed and a 90 day guarentee, we were "Happy Campers"..
Jack & Donna Smith
1973FC31
SoCal


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, erniecarpet@a... wrote:
> Julie, we had to replace our refer back in July. Brenda went in the
coach
> one day and smelled ammonia. We did the same as you- put in an
apartment sized
> refer. Thanks to Bim Burt for helping with the R/R and
modifications. We
> hardly ever boon dock, and can always start the generator.
Ernie-83pt40 in montana
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Thomas Warner]

One of the first rules of engaging in a battle is to know your enemy.
I suggest everyone take a look at the KOA campground in
Billings,Montana and take a different tack to this battle. It is
obvious that the owners have put a considerable amount of money into
the grounds and take pride in its beautiful location. I suggest that
any further emails to Billings includes how nice this site is and the
fact we would stay at it IF we were staying in the area more then
just one night. The point is if you want honey from the hive, then
dont kick the hive first or everyone knows what happens then.
http://www.koa.com/where/mt/26104/index.htm

Tom
1982 Bluebird
Vernon Center,NY


At 11:20 PM 9/16/2005, you wrote:
>O.K., I hope this makes up for the lack of comments attached to my
>last message related to comments made by owners of two campgrounds in
>Billings, MT. Go to this site:
>
><http://ci.billings.mt.us/Online/PDF/Gove...TES_2005_0>http:/\
/ci.billings.mt.us/Online/PDF/Government/minutes/WSMINUTES_2005_0
>8_15.pdf
>
>
>Please go and read the link and see if you like what these businesses
>think about their customers. You and Me.
>
>They are definitely on my DO NOT CAMP HERE LIST.
>
>R.E. (Ron) Marabito, Dallas, TX 92WB40
>
>
>
>
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[Wallace Craig]

Very wise words--do you have any Texas relatives? Wallace Craig Azle Tx

Thomas Warner wrote:One of the first rules of engaging in a
battle is to know your enemy.
I suggest everyone take a look at the KOA campground in
Billings,Montana and take a different tack to this battle. It is
obvious that the owners have put a considerable amount of money into
the grounds and take pride in its beautiful location. I suggest that
any further emails to Billings includes how nice this site is and the
fact we would stay at it IF we were staying in the area more then
just one night. The point is if you want honey from the hive, then
dont kick the hive first or everyone knows what happens then.
http://www.koa.com/where/mt/26104/index.htm

Tom
1982 Bluebird
Vernon Center,NY


At 11:20 PM 9/16/2005, you wrote:
>O.K., I hope this makes up for the lack of comments attached to my
>last message related to comments made by owners of two campgrounds in
>Billings, MT. Go to this site:
>
><http://ci.billings.mt.us/Online/PDF/Gove...TES_2005_0>http:/\
/ci.billings.mt.us/Online/PDF/Government/minutes/WSMINUTES_2005_0
>8_15.pdf
>
>
>Please go and read the link and see if you like what these businesses
>think about their customers. You and Me.
>
>They are definitely on my DO NOT CAMP HERE LIST.
>
>R.E. (Ron) Marabito, Dallas, TX 92WB40
>
>
>
>
>----------
>YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
>
> * Visit your group
> "<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WanderlodgeForum>WanderlodgeForum" on the web.
> *
> * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> *
>
Wanderl\
odgeForum-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> *
> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the
> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>----------






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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Julia Bonser]

We stayed at the campground on the way to the KOA which was a little
less than the KOA. I think they were both overpriced for what they
offered. Also the city street going to the campgrounds is in
deplorable condition, lots of broken down asphalt.
When I want a campground I usually will stay at any other CG in
preference to a KOA usually they don't suit big rigs very well, they
charge more, and there head office of their franchise is in Billings
and pursues having communities deny parking privileges to RVers.

If we had a choice we would not have stayed in Billings but it was
the nearest place that had a Subaru dealer when our a/c went out
during our tour of the Theodore Roosevelt National Park in 90 degree
weather.

I was aware Billings had an ordinance against parking in WalMart and
other such type lots. After the slander of Escapees that the
campground owner spewed to the Billings City Council I will let the
automobile dealer know that we won't be doing business with them
again due the cities inhospitality to RV owners.

Julie Bonser
1992 WLWB PT 40'



On Sep 17, 2005, at 8:21 AM, Jack & Donna Smith wrote:

> Note on Billings KOA.. At this spot, you get off the freeway and
> drive about 2 or 3 miles to the Billings KOA. About 1/2 mile before
> you reach the KOA, you pass another private campground... There are
> plenty of signs along the way informing you that the KOA is the SECOND
> campground!!
>

[Al]

I think that communities are lashing out at rvers that want to go to a
Walmart and stay a few days in the parking lot. Setup camp pull out
the ole grill and pop a beer. If rvers were just passing thru and
spending a night and moving on, then communities would not be reacting
this way. Instead, it looks like rvers are over-staying themselves in
Billing, Montana.

Lets look at this from the campground owner perspective: This family
has a morgage to pay, employees to pay and all the rest of the bills
associated with running a business, which is based on what they
perceive to be rvers that might stay at their campground. If they
don't protect their right as a business trying to make an honest
living then how are they to survive. Walmart is free, RV park cost a
minimal sum of money.

We did not go thru Billing, MT but we did go thru Cody, Wyoming. We
did notice when we went thru Cody, no less than 12 RVs parked in
Walmart for the night and it was right around lunch. If someone says
KOA cost too much, I would say down the road less than 10 miles is a
state park that run $12 a night. The state park which I might add was
just beautiful was maybe 1/3 full. Lots of spaces everywhere.
Buffalo Bill Reser has my recommendation. Its set on a dam on the
side of a hill. Any RV no matter the size can get in and locate a
space. Clearly we are in their community taking up their resources.
We should give back to them moneys that is rightfully due.

If we were merely passing thru and needed a place to stay and no other
campgrounds are available, then Walmart would be an appropriate
setting. If we planned to stay a few days, then a campground whether
private or public is the more appropriate setting. This ordance if
you read closely is trying to prevent the Walmart Campground Syndrome
where as people setup camp for an extended period of time. We also
must note that when we dry camp in Walmart parking lot, many times we
are looking for somewhere to dump our trash and tanks and take on
water without paying for those priviledges. And after just surviving
Hurricane Katrina where I had a dumpster we use for my business being
taken over with everyone's except mine rotten food, I have a different
perspective on dumping into a dumpster that I am not paying to be
picked up. So I am not trying to start a debate here, just saying if
every rver were not over-staying their welcome, then communities like
this would not be putting laws on the books.

Al & Kathy Johnson
'96 BMC 37'
Mandeville, Louisiana


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "ronmarabito2002"
wrote:
> O.K., I hope this makes up for the lack of comments attached to my
> last message related to comments made by owners of two campgrounds
in
> Billings, MT. Go to this site:
>
>
http://ci.billings.mt.us/Online/PDF/Gove...TES_2005_0
> 8_15.pdf
>
>
> Please go and read the link and see if you like what these
businesses
> think about their customers. You and Me.
>
> They are definitely on my DO NOT CAMP HERE LIST.
>
> R.E. (Ron) Marabito, Dallas, TX 92WB40

[Bruce Morris]

Al, your experience is certainly different from mine. Maybe because I take a
lot of back roads or something. I don't think that the "community is reacting"
to this ordinance, I think two campground owners are trying to stir the pot.
Here in Raleigh I have never seen more than 2 or maybe 3 motor coaches in a
public parking lot at night. If I get tired while driving I look for the next
place I can pull off and get a little sleep. I prefer a rest area but in a
pinch I will stop someplace that looks like it is level and safe. The one thing
I do not want to do is drive when I am not alert and put my 17 ton Bird in
someone else's space.

I have never seen anyone dump their waste tanks along the road or down a storm
drain on purpose. And I certainly have never seen anything that would make me
believe that Escapees are free loaders and encourage such acts.

I personally objected to the statements made by the two campground owners. I
think that they were misleading and made solely to influence the city council to
vote to enforce the ordinance.

I understand that campgrounds have costs and payroll to consider. I believe
that the way you assure your success is to offer a better product for a fair
cost. I don't believe that you legislate prohibitions so that people have to
use your service regardless. I haven't been to a good campground that looked
like it was lacking for business. When we went to the East Coast Rally in
Myrtle Beach I thought since it was off season the campground would have plenty
of sites. Nope . . . we were lucky to get within the same section with our 20
coaches. They must be doing something right.

I wrote to the council and expressed my views. This is my .02 cents worth.

Bruce Morris (919)872-7635 Raleigh, NC
Webmaster - Wanderlodge Owners Online
1983 WL FC35RB

FMCA: 7142s Ham Radio: KI4ME
Vietnam Vet - 1966-67 'Doc' (Navy Corpsman) 3rd MarDiv
----- Original Message -----
From: Al
To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 17, 2005 7:20 PM
Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Billings, MT City Council Minutes


I think that communities are lashing out at rvers that want to go to a
Walmart and stay a few days in the parking lot. Setup camp pull out
the ole grill and pop a beer. If rvers were just passing thru and
spending a night and moving on, then communities would not be reacting
this way. Instead, it looks like rvers are over-staying themselves in
Billing, Montana.

Lets look at this from the campground owner perspective: This family
has a morgage to pay, employees to pay and all the rest of the bills
associated with running a business, which is based on what they
perceive to be rvers that might stay at their campground. If they
don't protect their right as a business trying to make an honest
living then how are they to survive. Walmart is free, RV park cost a
minimal sum of money.

We did not go thru Billing, MT but we did go thru Cody, Wyoming. We
did notice when we went thru Cody, no less than 12 RVs parked in
Walmart for the night and it was right around lunch. If someone says
KOA cost too much, I would say down the road less than 10 miles is a
state park that run $12 a night. The state park which I might add was
just beautiful was maybe 1/3 full. Lots of spaces everywhere.
Buffalo Bill Reser has my recommendation. Its set on a dam on the
side of a hill. Any RV no matter the size can get in and locate a
space. Clearly we are in their community taking up their resources.
We should give back to them moneys that is rightfully due.

If we were merely passing thru and needed a place to stay and no other
campgrounds are available, then Walmart would be an appropriate
setting. If we planned to stay a few days, then a campground whether
private or public is the more appropriate setting. This ordance if
you read closely is trying to prevent the Walmart Campground Syndrome
where as people setup camp for an extended period of time. We also
must note that when we dry camp in Walmart parking lot, many times we
are looking for somewhere to dump our trash and tanks and take on
water without paying for those priviledges. And after just surviving
Hurricane Katrina where I had a dumpster we use for my business being
taken over with everyone's except mine rotten food, I have a different
perspective on dumping into a dumpster that I am not paying to be
picked up. So I am not trying to start a debate here, just saying if
every rver were not over-staying their welcome, then communities like
this would not be putting laws on the books.

Al & Kathy Johnson
'96 BMC 37'
Mandeville, Louisiana


--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "ronmarabito2002"
wrote:
> O.K., I hope this makes up for the lack of comments attached to my
> last message related to comments made by owners of two campgrounds
in
> Billings, MT. Go to this site:
>
>
http://ci.billings.mt.us/Online/PDF/Gove...TES_2005_0
> 8_15.pdf
>
>
> Please go and read the link and see if you like what these
businesses
> think about their customers. You and Me.
>
> They are definitely on my DO NOT CAMP HERE LIST.
>
> R.E. (Ron) Marabito, Dallas, TX 92WB40




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