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newell house.....
12-01-2013, 22:24 (This post was last modified: 12-01-2013 22:53 by encantotom.)
Post: #1
newell house.....
hi gang

i am the process of getting going on a shop out back of my house. it will be 70 deep and 65 wide with 18' sidewalls and either a 2/12 or 3/12 pitch roof.

i am designing it so there can be side by side 45' rigs in it if needed.

so the question at hand is two.....

1. i am planning on doing two 14x14 doors. and i will be backing into the shop. what width door do you guys have or recommend?

2. lighting. the engineer is in analysis paralasis (hey i cant spell either) in foot candles at waist etc. i do not want metal halide high bay so it is either cfl high bay (around 9k lumens per fixture) or t5 HO 4' high bay fixtures. they put out a lot more light. any suggestions for how many foot candles for a comfortable shop?

i had a camera buff friend (and fellow newell owner) go around town to measure lighting in various places in foot candles. lowes was 50, other big box stores ranged from 30 to 80. it is easy to say do 80 but it gets very expensive. ....i am retired and on a budget now ha

any thoughts or experiences that you have had would be welcomed.

happy sunday

tom

http://www.newellgurus.com

2002 Two Slide Newell Coach 608 DD Series 60, Allison 6 speed
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12-02-2013, 00:16 (This post was last modified: 12-02-2013 11:32 by davidbrady.)
Post: #2
RE: newell house.....
Hey Tom,

I own a tiny garage by your standards but I find it houses my bus and my tools perfectly and even two buses in a pinch with space left over for shelving, drill press, air compressor, workbench, and other light tools. It's 1750 square feet (35x50, 16' ceilings) and I have two 14x14 garage doors. I back the bus in at a slight angle and have plenty of room to straighten out without hitting the dividing wall which separates the two bays - in my opinion 14x14 is the minimum door size for maneuverability and for clearance when carrying items in and out. The wall comes in handy if I ever decide to lease one or both bays. My fluorescent lighting is very adequate but I haven't a clue of its density. Next time I'm at the garage I'll make some notes and take some pics to share. My garage is heated and air conditioned; it has an epoxy coated floor, running water, a dump station, and a security gate.

İmage
İmage
İmage
İmage

david brady,
'02 Wanderlodge LXi 'Smokey' (Sold),
'04 Prevost H3 Vantare 'SpongeBob'

"I don't like being wrong, but I really hate being right"
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12-02-2013, 00:49 (This post was last modified: 12-02-2013 01:00 by Arcticdude.)
Post: #3
RE: newell house.....
Tom,

I truly apologize. I meant to get you some pictures when we last spoke and completely forgot about it. Here's what I've got at this time in my 60x40.

This one is down the side of the bus to show that I've got about 4' between the side wall and the bus.
İmage

This one is from ground level at the rear of the bus to sort of show the open floor space I've got.
İmage

This one is taken from the very front of the bird on the roof to give you an idea of the amount of left over room I've got currently.
İmage

This last one is the fluorescent bulb I'm using in the overhead lights. I've got 4 pair of bulbs on each rafter, with a total of 5 rafters with lights (20 fixtures, each with 2 bulbs total). None of the other pictures were taken with a flash and all the overhead lights were on. For this particular picture, there's only one rafter's worth of overhead lights on, thus the shadow.
İmage

Yes, I do often need a work light for the exact area I'm working on, but nothing more than that. And that's only if I'm under or inside one of the bays of the bus, or under/in a vehicle/tractor, etc.

Hope this helps.

As an addendum, my fixtures came out of Home Depot, right off the shelf. There's more than enough light to do any normal work when I have direct lighting. I have no issues with lack of light in this building. The T8's work very well and the newer T5's should do as well or better.

I've got 16x14 doors on each end, but currently use only the rear one. The walls are 16' as well with a 3/12 roof pitch. I had custom rafters done to eliminate much of the crawling I'd have to do when on top of the bus. I still have to bend over at each rafter, but nothing like I'd have to do with a straight across rafter type.

John Mace
96 42 big bird
living in the wild hinterlands of the north
free to roam without the man getting me down
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12-02-2013, 01:02
Post: #4
RE: newell house.....
John,

Do you wish you had another door up front? How do you get the truck, trailer, and tractors out with the bird in the way? I'm a believer in lining the front of the building in doors! Smile

david brady,
'02 Wanderlodge LXi 'Smokey' (Sold),
'04 Prevost H3 Vantare 'SpongeBob'

"I don't like being wrong, but I really hate being right"
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12-02-2013, 02:57 (This post was last modified: 12-02-2013 02:57 by Arcticdude.)
Post: #5
RE: newell house.....
There's JUST enough room off the back end of the bus to get the trailer in/out with the tractor. I have to spin it to fast to use any of the trucks. The trucks and tractors are tight, but manageable. As a matter of fact, I had just put the truck back in after running over to the farm for the weekend. While more doors might be nice, that's also more area to worry about for intrusion (air, water, etc), so I don't mind. If I can swing at least an 80x60 for the next one, I won't have to worry about it. Of course, the next one will be built in a lower UV zone, so I can put some things under cover, but not enclosed. They'll still do well that way. The money will decide it all. I'd build a 100x140 or so, but I'd have to live in the bus! And SWMBO wouldn't go for that! Wink

John Mace
96 42 big bird
living in the wild hinterlands of the north
free to roam without the man getting me down
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12-02-2013, 13:03
Post: #6
RE: newell house.....
It's a really nice looking garage John. Was it made by one of the standard metal building manufacturers? I'll probably go with a wood Morton building. The barn out back, which I'm trying to buy and will eventually buy is a Morton building. If I build one in the meantime I want it to match.

david brady,
'02 Wanderlodge LXi 'Smokey' (Sold),
'04 Prevost H3 Vantare 'SpongeBob'

"I don't like being wrong, but I really hate being right"
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12-02-2013, 18:54
Post: #7
RE: newell house.....
Not really, as to the manufacturer. In this part of the country, there are numerous people who will construct a metal building essentially to your requirements on your site. I knew how big I could go and how much I wanted to spend, then it was just a matter of seeing who could get close and still offer respectable quality. I got most of what I wanted, overall. There were a few extras that got discussed, but didn't show up in the final. But, as it turns out, since we're not going to be here all that long, it's not really an issue. After having essentially 3 metal buildings and one wood frame/metal roofed one, I'll probably never do another wood building. It's way to easy to get clear spans of enormous size with a metal that would require serious engineering to do in wood. My previous building was a metal structure that I fully insulated, hung 3/4" plywood walls, bricked the exterior and shigled the roof. It loooked so close to the house and had it's own drive that most thought is was a house. Nobody knew it was metal until they got inside and started looking around.

All the wood framed buildings have always deteriorated over time and started leaking, etc. None of my metal buildings have done that to date. The only thing I might try to do differently would be the interior insulation. It is rather fragile and can cause some issues, but mostly in appearance only. Just being a little OCD that way, I guess.

John Mace
96 42 big bird
living in the wild hinterlands of the north
free to roam without the man getting me down
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12-02-2013, 19:29
Post: #8
RE: newell house.....
Concerning insulation: My winter spot is at a 40x40 metal building that is not used anymore at my wife's family farm. It has the insulation that is plastic faced and hung between each span like what arctic dude has pictured. Not sure how old it is but it is falling in almost every place, the roof and sides. It is really a mess inside. But we're parked outside so not a problem for us. Only using the inside for projects. I'd consider a different type of insulation than this stuff. Not sure if it can be repaired but this one has been neglected.

Forest & Cindy Olivier
1998 Newell 45' double slide
2004 Z71 toad with Rzr 570LE
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12-02-2013, 19:57
Post: #9
RE: newell house.....
Forrest,

What I did in my other building was put up normal rolled insulation in the metal rafters and then screwed up chicken netting over all of that. It didn't matter what I did, the insulation stayed put. It was cheap and went up fairly quickly. I did the same in the well house at the farm (wooden structure) and it works ok there, but I couldn't get to the very bottoms of the rafters (would have required a serious time investment). It is still doing pretty well there, only the rodents have tended to push out the unsupported lower areas. The rest is fine. I used simple sheet metal self tapping screws with washers to install in the metal building. It was a 30x30 and I probably did the insulation and the wire all in a day.

John Mace
96 42 big bird
living in the wild hinterlands of the north
free to roam without the man getting me down
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12-13-2013, 21:07 (This post was last modified: 12-13-2013 21:10 by davidbrady.)
Post: #10
RE: newell house.....
Tom,

Here's what I have for lighting. One bay is 1000 sq ft with 7 fixtures and the other bay is 750 sq ft with five:


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İmage İmage İmage

david brady,
'02 Wanderlodge LXi 'Smokey' (Sold),
'04 Prevost H3 Vantare 'SpongeBob'

"I don't like being wrong, but I really hate being right"
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