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Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird - Printable Version +- Wanderlodge Gurus - The Member Funded Wanderlodge Forum (http://www.wanderlodgegurus.com) +-- Forum: Yahoo Groups Archive (/forumdisplay.php?fid=61) +--- Forum: WanderlodgeForum (/forumdisplay.php?fid=63) +--- Thread: Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird (/showthread.php?tid=5198) |
Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird - Ron Thompson - 06-26-2007 00:01 Brad, Man am I glad you jogged my memory about that bus fire during the Houston evac. I remember seeing that thing burn too. What a tradgedy. Yes, you are right about a fire on a coach being a serious matter. I was just thinking about what I would do if I was in the bedroom and a fire broke out in the galley. There is no door to get out. I tried the windows in the bedroom and you would have to have a pry bar to get them open. I don't think they have ever been open so they are stiff as hell. Going to have to lube them to get them moving again. A little WD-40 will do wonders. I notice too that the window latches are very difficult to release. One of the windows I had to go get a screw driver to get the latch to release. All of the windows are stiff like that. Is that a usual thing on these Blue Birds? Thanks again Brad. My best regards, Ron Thompson Waller, Texas 1995 Wide Body 42" BB Detroit Diesel Series 60 470 HP Kubota, 4 cylinder, 1681 cc. Phone 936-931-2802 land line cell..713-295-0119 Cingular brad barton <bbartonwx@...> wrote: Ron, One more ramble and I'll quit. Marty is right about heat. A dragging brake on a tour bus evacuating nursing home patients from Hurricane Rita in Houston, blew out one time on I-45. The driver didn't understand English, so he continued on after the tire was changed. The brake heated up again even in stop and go traffic. The wheel became red hot and caught the rear of the bus on fire. The driver failed to notice until portable oxygen tanks used by the patients began exploding. The bus turned into a crematorium for 24 of those patients. I'll never forget watching the bus burning up live on TV. Also, I left my magnetic retarder on by mistake in Flagstaff and nearly caught my 84 Bird on fire. I burned through the air line that operated the driver's seat slide. Imagine smoke coming from under your coach and you're struggling to get to the extinguisher with your seat next to the doghouse. Fire on a motorcoach is almost as serious as fire on board an airplane. Brad Barton 00LXiDFW bbartonwx@... To: WanderlodgeForum@...: martingregg598@...: Tue, 26 Jun 2007 00:32:18 +0000Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird Ron, if you have a Allison HT-755 five speed with a retarder, I have know advice, if you have a 1995-42' you should have a Allison HD-4060 and a DD series 60 with a 3 position Jacobs engine brake. Jacobs's brakes close the valves and turn the cylinder into a compressor creating braking horsepower, each position adds more cylinders. I haven't driven a 95 in the mountains but I have driven over a lot of the passes in the Cascades, Montana, Idaho and so on, but I can't imagine that if your in the right gear at the right RPM that the engine brake won't hold it back. For me with a less effective Pac Brake, it is 4th gear at 50 mph at about 2400 rpm's on a 6% or so, on a steeper grade it's 3 gear at 35-40 mph and I almost never have to use my air brakes. If I am in 4th and it starts to run away, faster that I like, I use the brakes to get the coach down to the speed that I can select the next lower gear. If the Jacobs brake doesn't hold you back, maybe there is something wrong with the Jacobs brake? As for the "Drum type" air brakes, if you have been on the road for a time and the ambient temp. is hot, and If you ride the brakes for a long period of time the drum can expand away from the shoe and you lose your brakes. With some real bad luck you could heat the wheel up so hot that it heats the tire up and blowout.Marty95 BMC 37Kennewick Wa __________________________________________________________ Play free games, earn tickets, get cool prizes! Join Live Search Club. http://club.live.com/home.aspx?icid=CLUB_wlmailtextlink [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird - Ron Thompson - 06-26-2007 00:03 Tom, Where can you get each tire weighed? It should be a total weight of 42,000 lbs right now since it is empty. I don't have anything in it yet. Don't want to put stuff into it until I get all the systems running properly. Thanks for the info, Tom. Ron Thompson Waller, Texas 1995 Wide Body 42" BB Detroit Diesel Series 60 470 HP Kubota, 4 cylinder, 1681 cc. Phone 936-931-2802 land line cell..713-295-0119 Cingular Tom McCarthy 42,000 is empty; no liqiuds, tools, dishes, water, pans , people, etc. Comfortably provisioned, you should be over 45,000 and you need to be under 48,900, the max. weight. Get the coach weighed at each tire to see how it is balanced and what your actual weight is. Tom McCarthy 95 PT42 Poway, CA --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Ron Thompson wrote: > > I don't know about the new ones but mine is a 1995 and the body tag says 42,000 lbs. My guess would be that it is probably heavier than the new ones. They are taking weight out of them to cut the cost of production. > > Just my thoughts./ > > Regards, > Ron Thompson > > erniecarpet@... wrote: Ron, I may be wrong but don't the newer coaches weigh more then the 42,000 > pounds? > > Ernie Ekberg > 83PT40 > Livingston, Mt > > ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird - Ron Thompson - 06-26-2007 00:11 Hey Pete, you sound like an expert to me. I appreciate your in depth cretique. I print everything you write. I have been over the mountains at Berthoud pass when I was a kid but that was the only time. I remember my Grandmother was driving since my Grandfather never learned to drive and she was riding those brakes and had the manual transmission down it 1st gear and both hands on the steering wheel with white nuckles. It impressed me enough that I still remember the quietness in the car when it was usually mayhem. Everyone breathed a sigh of relief when we got down on level ground again. And that pass is not that bad. Thanks Pet and safe driving. Hope your trip home is without incident. Ron Thompson Waller, Texas 1995 Wide Body 42" BB Detroit Diesel Series 60 470 HP Kubota, 4 cylinder, 1681 cc. Phone 936-931-2802 land line cell..713-295-0119 Cingular Pete Masterson expert, but I've crossed the Rockies in southern Wyoming twice, I've done the Raton pass in southern Colorado twice, I've gone up and back down Colorado I-70 to near Evergreen CO, and I've crossed the Sierras into California on I-80. Plus I've traveled through a fair number of lesser mountains in Oregon, Idaho, and California. So I've seen a few mountains. Basically, the technique is to watch the temperatures, especially the oil temp when you're climbing. Higher revs = cooler engine, so slow down and shift down, as necessary. Take it easy. Coming down, use the jake brake (it's actually integrated into the automatic transmission, so when it's enabled, it 'kicks in' as needed. The engine computer "watches" the revs to avoid over-reving but you still need to watch that you don't exceed 2400 RPM while exhaust (Jake) brake is operating and 2100 RPM while under power. In general, come down at moderate speed. When you slow down with the service brakes, slow to 5 mph or more _below_ your target speed, then let the coach gradually pick up speed (still using the jake brake). The coach has plenty of service brake capacity to control the vehicle ... but you do need to pay attention an not run low on air. Don't "ride" the brakes as that will heat them up and not really help maintain control. It is said that you should descend at the same speed that you climb at ... but the reality is somewhat different. For example, from Reno to Donner Pass on I-80 you climb about 3500 feet in 10 miles or so. Then from Donner Pass to Roseville, you descend nearly 7000 feet in 40 miles. So, the grades are quite different and your speeds will not be "the same"... Nevertheless, "keep it moderate" is a wise approach. If road-side signs suggest a curve be taken at 40 mph -- take it to heart. It's good advice. Be sure to get to 40 or slower for that curve. (For years, I always wondered just who they were thinking of with the curve-speed advisories. Now I know....) Note: Do not use the jake brake under poor traction conditions (such as snow or wet pavement) as it can lead to control/skidding problems. Pete Masterson '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42 aeonix1@... On the road at Harrisburg Oregon On Jun 25, 2007, at 12:28 PM, Ron Thompson wrote: > This is a question that lots of people might want to explore. Would > someone with a lot of experience driving a big rig in the mountains > please write up a good descriptive instruction for mountain driving. > > I have never driven in the big mountains with a normal vehicle much > less a 42,000 lb motor coach. I am planning a trip through the > mountains maybe this year but definitely next year from Texas through > the Rockies and on up to Alaska. It would sure be helpful to have > some pointers from an expert. > > Best regards, > Ron Thompson > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird - Ron Thompson - 06-26-2007 00:17 This is good info Pete, I suppose it will take some operation to develop a feel for what position the Jake ought to be in. Thanks again. Ron Thompson Waller, Texas 1995 Wide Body 42" BB Detroit Diesel Series 60 470 HP Kubota, 4 cylinder, 1681 cc. Phone 936-931-2802 land line cell..713-295-0119 Cingular Pete Masterson "jake brake" on the '95 with the Series 60 engine is a true "exhaust" brake and it generates no excess heat energy that must be handled. It is not a magnetic brake like those used on earlier 'birds. The brake system is integrated with the automatic transmission. You flip the "enable" switch on and set the "intensity" switch to low, medium, or high. When you take your foot of the accelerator pedal, the jake kicks in. The transmission will shift down (if within a safe RPM range) to the next lower gear to strengthen the braking effect, depending on the position of the low/med/high switch. If you then press on the accelerator pedal, the jake shuts off and (after a brief delay) the transmission will up-shift to ensure that the RPM will be in the safe range. I note that on my coach, someone has wired-out the medium setting so that I have the choice of either high or low, but I'm usually able to find a balance on most grades that's satisfactory. Pete Masterson aeonix1@... '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42' El Sobrante, CA On Jun 25, 2007, at 3:43 PM, brad barton wrote: > <snip> If you have a magnetic retarder, be aware that it will build > up considerable heat if used for several minutes..so downshift to > help it out. I don't think your Jake brake or Pac brake is limited > that way but a diesel mechanic can be more specific. <snip> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird - Ron Thompson - 06-26-2007 00:18 Pete, You guys know more about the weight than I do at this point, but I am catching up fast. Ron Thompson Waller, Texas 1995 Wide Body 42" BB Detroit Diesel Series 60 470 HP Kubota, 4 cylinder, 1681 cc. Phone 936-931-2802 land line cell..713-295-0119 Cingular Pete Masterson digging out my blue box, The maximum allowed GVW of the '95 is around 52,000 lbs. The approximate "curb" weight is around 42,000 lbs. (That may or may not count water and holding tanks -- I'd have to dig out the book to be certain.) As typically loaded, I'd expect that most would weigh about 46-48,000 lbs. Pete Masterson aeonix1@... '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42' El Sobrante, CA On Jun 25, 2007, at 4:12 PM, erniecarpet@... wrote: > Ron, I may be wrong but don't the newer coaches weigh more then the > 42,000 > pounds? > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird - Ron Thompson - 06-26-2007 00:33 Obviously, Pete, you have been studying these systems for awhile. I am like that too. I like to know everything I can so that I am at least knowledgeable enough to keep from gettin hosed by an unscrupulous mechanic. Thanks for all your indepth analysis. You have been a great help is dispelling some of my fears on this motor coach. Regrds, Ron Thompson Waller, Texas 1995 Wide Body 42" BB Detroit Diesel Series 60 470 HP Kubota, 4 cylinder, 1681 cc. Phone 936-931-2802 land line cell..713-295-0119 Cingular Pete Masterson Jake Brake or Jacob Brake is a particular brand of engine brake manufactured and sold by Jacobs Vehicle Systems, Inc. While the term Jake Brake technically only describes Jake Brake brand engine brakes, it has become a genericized trademark and is often used to refer to engine brakes or compression release engine brakes in general, especially on large vehicles or heavy equipment. See Wikipedia for a full entry at: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jake_brake> The magnetic retarder used on some earlier BBs is similar to the technology used for "dynamic braking" on diesel-electric railroad locomotives. The diesel-electric locomotive is actually a diesel generator (up to 5000 HP) that powers electric motors to drive the engine. On down grades, the motors are electrically switched to become generators, and the power produced is directed to very heavy duty grids and discarded as heat. Realize that these things produce 600 amps at 600 volts and that's a _lot_ of heat! (Great for toasting marshmallows.) Pete Masterson aeonix1@... '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42' El Sobrante, CA On Jun 25, 2007, at 4:28 PM, Ron Thompson wrote: > My BB has an engine retarder. I have no idea what that is > exactly. I assume it is using the compression of the engine to > hold back the transmission which will hold back the BB > > What is a Jake Brake? > <snip> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird - Leroy Eckert - 06-26-2007 00:34 My windows in the bedroom are the same way. I have lubed the track with limited success. I keep a small sledge hammer in the bedroom jic. I posted back in April a potential major source for fire. I have removed the source from my bus. The freeze heaters on my coach burned a hole in the water pipe under the night stand while in the infield at Talladega. The event did not trip the circuit breaker. Flooded the bus also. I am glad the water was in the line and the pump was on! Or??? The reason for the failure was two of the wires were touching when they failed. That is not allowed per specifications. I still do not know why they operated at 85 degrees. In any event, they are gone now. With hydronic heat, there is no real reason to have them. It is not easy to do and inspection of these wires as they are encased in insulation covering the water pipes. However, if two of these wires are crossed or get together from movement over the years the result is inevitable. Kinda off the original subject but very important. Leroy Eckert 1990 WB-40"Smoke N Mirrors" Niceville, FL ----- Original Message ----- From: Ron Thompson To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 7:01 AM Subject: RE: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird Brad, Man am I glad you jogged my memory about that bus fire during the Houston evac. I remember seeing that thing burn too. What a tradgedy. Yes, you are right about a fire on a coach being a serious matter. I was just thinking about what I would do if I was in the bedroom and a fire broke out in the galley. There is no door to get out. I tried the windows in the bedroom and you would have to have a pry bar to get them open. I don't think they have ever been open so they are stiff as hell. Going to have to lube them to get them moving again. A little WD-40 will do wonders. I notice too that the window latches are very difficult to release. One of the windows I had to go get a screw driver to get the latch to release. All of the windows are stiff like that. Is that a usual thing on these Blue Birds? Thanks again Brad. My best regards, Ron Thompson Waller, Texas 1995 Wide Body 42" BB Detroit Diesel Series 60 470 HP Kubota, 4 cylinder, 1681 cc. Phone 936-931-2802 land line cell..713-295-0119 Cingular brad barton <bbartonwx@...> wrote: Ron, One more ramble and I'll quit. Marty is right about heat. A dragging brake on a tour bus evacuating nursing home patients from Hurricane Rita in Houston, blew out one time on I-45. The driver didn't understand English, so he continued on after the tire was changed. The brake heated up again even in stop and go traffic. The wheel became red hot and caught the rear of the bus on fire. The driver failed to notice until portable oxygen tanks used by the patients began exploding. The bus turned into a crematorium for 24 of those patients. I'll never forget watching the bus burning up live on TV. Also, I left my magnetic retarder on by mistake in Flagstaff and nearly caught my 84 Bird on fire. I burned through the air line that operated the driver's seat slide. Imagine smoke coming from under your coach and you're struggling to get to the extinguisher with your seat next to the doghouse. Fire on a motorcoach is almost as serious as fire on board an airplane. Brad Barton 00LXiDFW bbartonwx@... To: WanderlodgeForum@...: martingregg598@...: Tue, 26 Jun 2007 00:32:18 +0000Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird Ron, if you have a Allison HT-755 five speed with a retarder, I have know advice, if you have a 1995-42' you should have a Allison HD-4060 and a DD series 60 with a 3 position Jacobs engine brake. Jacobs's brakes close the valves and turn the cylinder into a compressor creating braking horsepower, each position adds more cylinders. I haven't driven a 95 in the mountains but I have driven over a lot of the passes in the Cascades, Montana, Idaho and so on, but I can't imagine that if your in the right gear at the right RPM that the engine brake won't hold it back. For me with a less effective Pac Brake, it is 4th gear at 50 mph at about 2400 rpm's on a 6% or so, on a steeper grade it's 3 gear at 35-40 mph and I almost never have to use my air brakes. If I am in 4th and it starts to run away, faster that I like, I use the brakes to get the coach down to the speed that I can select the next lower gear. If the Jacobs brake doesn't hold you back, maybe there is something wrong with the Jacobs brake? As for the "Drum type" air brakes, if you have been on the road for a time and the ambient temp. is hot, and If you ride the brakes for a long period of time the drum can expand away from the shoe and you lose your brakes. With some real bad luck you could heat the wheel up so hot that it heats the tire up and blowout.Marty95 BMC 37Kennewick Wa __________________________________________________________ Play free games, earn tickets, get cool prizes! Join Live Search Club. http://club.live.com/home.aspx?icid=CLUB_wlmailtextlink [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird - Stephen Birtles - 06-26-2007 00:54 Lube tracks with paraffin wax a small amount goes a long way If you really worried about escaping from the bedroom through the window a spring loaded center punch will make the window disappear with one shot it is tempered non-laminated glass and will crumble One good piece of equipment on any emergency truck or vehicle usually located in rescue worker's pocket for fast access along with seat belt cutter Stephen 77fc35 --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Leroy Eckert" > > My windows in the bedroom are the same way. I have lubed the track with limited success. I keep a small sledge hammer in the bedroom jic. > I posted back in April a potential major source for fire. I have removed the source from my bus. The freeze heaters on my coach burned a hole in the water pipe under the night stand while in the infield at Talladega. The event did not trip the circuit breaker. Flooded the bus also. I am glad the water was in the line and the pump was on! Or??? The reason for the failure was two of the wires were touching when they failed. That is not allowed per specifications. I still do not know why they operated at 85 degrees. In any event, they are gone now. With hydronic heat, there is no real reason to have them. > It is not easy to do and inspection of these wires as they are encased in insulation covering the water pipes. However, if two of these wires are crossed or get together from movement over the years the result is inevitable. > Kinda off the original subject but very important. > > Leroy Eckert > 1990 WB-40"Smoke N Mirrors" > Niceville, FL > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Ron Thompson > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 7:01 AM > Subject: RE: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird > > > Brad, > > Man am I glad you jogged my memory about that bus fire during the Houston evac. I remember seeing that thing burn too. What a tradgedy. > > Yes, you are right about a fire on a coach being a serious matter. I was just thinking about what I would do if I was in the bedroom and a fire broke out in the galley. There is no door to get out. I tried the windows in the bedroom and you would have to have a pry bar to get them open. I don't think they have ever been open so they are stiff as hell. Going to have to lube them to get them moving again. A little WD-40 will do wonders. I notice too that the window latches are very difficult to release. One of the windows I had to go get a screw driver to get the latch to release. All of the windows are stiff like that. Is that a usual thing on these Blue Birds? > > Thanks again Brad. > > My best regards, > > Ron Thompson > Waller, Texas > 1995 Wide Body 42" BB > Detroit Diesel Series 60 470 HP > Kubota, 4 cylinder, 1681 cc. > Phone 936-931-2802 land line > cell..713-295-0119 Cingular > > brad barton <bbartonwx@...> wrote: > Ron, > One more ramble and I'll quit. > Marty is right about heat. A dragging brake on a tour bus evacuating nursing home patients from Hurricane Rita in Houston, blew out one time on I-45. The driver didn't understand English, so he continued on after the tire was changed. The brake heated up again even in stop and go traffic. The wheel became red hot and caught the rear of the bus on fire. The driver failed to notice until portable oxygen tanks used by the patients began exploding. The bus turned into a crematorium for 24 of those patients. I'll never forget watching the bus burning up live on TV. Also, I left my magnetic retarder on by mistake in Flagstaff and nearly caught my 84 Bird on fire. I burned through the air line that operated the driver's seat slide. Imagine smoke coming from under your coach and you're struggling to get to the extinguisher with your seat next to the doghouse. Fire on a motorcoach is almost as serious as fire on board an airplane. Brad Barton 00LXiDFW > bbartonwx@... > > To: WanderlodgeForum@...: martingregg598@...: Tue, 26 Jun 2007 00:32:18 +0000Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird > > Ron, if you have a Allison HT-755 five speed with a retarder, I have know advice, if you have a 1995-42' you should have a Allison HD-4060 and a DD series 60 with a 3 position Jacobs engine brake. Jacobs's brakes close the valves and turn the cylinder into a compressor creating braking horsepower, each position adds more cylinders. I haven't driven a 95 in the mountains but I have driven over a lot of the passes in the Cascades, Montana, Idaho and so on, but I can't imagine that if your in the right gear at the right RPM that the engine brake won't hold it back. For me with a less effective Pac Brake, it is 4th gear at 50 mph at about 2400 rpm's on a 6% or so, on a steeper grade it's 3 gear at 35-40 mph and I almost never have to use my air brakes. If I am in 4th and it starts to run away, faster that I like, I use the brakes to get the coach down to the speed that I can select the next lower gear. If the Jacobs brake doesn't hold you back, maybe there is something wrong > with the Jacobs brake? As for the "Drum type" air brakes, if you have been on the road for a time and the ambient temp. is hot, and If you ride the brakes for a long period of time the drum can expand away from the shoe and you lose your brakes. With some real bad luck you could heat the wheel up so hot that it heats the tire up and blowout.Marty95 BMC 37Kennewick Wa > > __________________________________________________________ > Play free games, earn tickets, get cool prizes! Join Live Search Club. > http://club.live.com/home.aspx?icid=CLUB_wlmailtextlink > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird - Ron Thompson - 06-26-2007 00:56 Thanks Gardner for your input. Gathering understanding is exactly what I am doing. I have seen those runaway truck ramps in the mountains and I sure don't won't to learn to use one the hard way. LOL Ron Thompson Waller, Texas 1995 Wide Body 42" BB Detroit Diesel Series 60 470 HP Kubota, 4 cylinder, 1681 cc. Phone 936-931-2802 land line cell..713-295-0119 Cingular Gardner Yeaw The true 'Jake Brake' is an integral part of the engine design. It alters the exhaust valve timing to use the exhaust stroke for compression braking as well as the normal compression stroke. It makes a very distinctive loud sound when the exhaust valve is opened late. You most likely have heard it whan an 18 wheeler is behind you on a down grade. This system provides a significant braking effect. An exhaust brake simply blocks the exhaust pipe. Since the volume of the exhaust pipe is significantly greater than the cylinder in the engine, there is far less resistance to the exhaust stroke and equally less braking effect. A retarder is an electronic or hydraulic device that provides resistance to the drive train. These systems generate a lot of heat and need to be used in conjunction with the service brakes to distribute the braking load. Whatever system your coach has, take the time to understand how it works and how to effectively use it. Don't assume that it will work all by itself without your understanding. --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Stephen Birtles" > > up to 1200 amps at 480 volts but don't do that on a curve or you get > to see the wrong side of the tree line > we are limited to 500 amps on heavy curves > you have to use a combination of train brake and dynamic on 2%or more > grades > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, Pete Masterson > wrote: > > > > The Jake Brake or Jacob Brake is a particular brand of engine brake > > manufactured and sold by Jacobs Vehicle Systems, Inc. While the term > > Jake Brake technically only describes Jake Brake brand engine brakes, > > it has become a genericized trademark and is often used to refer to > > engine brakes or compression release engine brakes in general, > > especially on large vehicles or heavy equipment. See Wikipedia for a > > full entry at: > > <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jake_brake> > > > > The magnetic retarder used on some earlier BBs is similar to the > > technology used for "dynamic braking" on diesel-electric railroad > > locomotives. The diesel-electric locomotive is actually a diesel > > generator (up to 5000 HP) that powers electric motors to drive the > > engine. On down grades, the motors are electrically switched to > > become generators, and the power produced is directed to very heavy > > duty grids and discarded as heat. Realize that these things produce > > 600 amps at 600 volts and that's a _lot_ of heat! (Great for toasting > > marshmallows.) > > > > Pete Masterson > > aeonix1@ > > '95 Blue Bird Wanderlodge WBDA 42' > > El Sobrante, CA > > > > > > > > > > On Jun 25, 2007, at 4:28 PM, Ron Thompson wrote: > > > > > My BB has an engine retarder. I have no idea what that is > > > exactly. I assume it is using the compression of the engine to > > > hold back the transmission which will hold back the BB > > > > > > What is a Jake Brake? > > > > > <snip> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird - Leroy Eckert - 06-26-2007 01:02 Stephen: Will try the wax idea. Leroy Eckert 1990 WB-40"Smoke N Mirrors" Niceville,FL ----- Original Message ----- From: Stephen Birtles To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 7:54 AM Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird Lube tracks with paraffin wax a small amount goes a long way If you really worried about escaping from the bedroom through the window a spring loaded center punch will make the window disappear with one shot it is tempered non-laminated glass and will crumble One good piece of equipment on any emergency truck or vehicle usually located in rescue worker's pocket for fast access along with seat belt cutter Stephen 77fc35 --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Leroy Eckert" > > My windows in the bedroom are the same way. I have lubed the track with limited success. I keep a small sledge hammer in the bedroom jic. > I posted back in April a potential major source for fire. I have removed the source from my bus. The freeze heaters on my coach burned a hole in the water pipe under the night stand while in the infield at Talladega. The event did not trip the circuit breaker. Flooded the bus also. I am glad the water was in the line and the pump was on! Or??? The reason for the failure was two of the wires were touching when they failed. That is not allowed per specifications. I still do not know why they operated at 85 degrees. In any event, they are gone now. With hydronic heat, there is no real reason to have them. > It is not easy to do and inspection of these wires as they are encased in insulation covering the water pipes. However, if two of these wires are crossed or get together from movement over the years the result is inevitable. > Kinda off the original subject but very important. > > Leroy Eckert > 1990 WB-40"Smoke N Mirrors" > Niceville, FL > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Ron Thompson > To: WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 7:01 AM > Subject: RE: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird > > > Brad, > > Man am I glad you jogged my memory about that bus fire during the Houston evac. I remember seeing that thing burn too. What a tradgedy. > > Yes, you are right about a fire on a coach being a serious matter. I was just thinking about what I would do if I was in the bedroom and a fire broke out in the galley. There is no door to get out. I tried the windows in the bedroom and you would have to have a pry bar to get them open. I don't think they have ever been open so they are stiff as hell. Going to have to lube them to get them moving again. A little WD-40 will do wonders. I notice too that the window latches are very difficult to release. One of the windows I had to go get a screw driver to get the latch to release. All of the windows are stiff like that. Is that a usual thing on these Blue Birds? > > Thanks again Brad. > > My best regards, > > Ron Thompson > Waller, Texas > 1995 Wide Body 42" BB > Detroit Diesel Series 60 470 HP > Kubota, 4 cylinder, 1681 cc. > Phone 936-931-2802 land line > cell..713-295-0119 Cingular > > brad barton <bbartonwx@...> wrote: > Ron, > One more ramble and I'll quit. > Marty is right about heat. A dragging brake on a tour bus evacuating nursing home patients from Hurricane Rita in Houston, blew out one time on I-45. The driver didn't understand English, so he continued on after the tire was changed. The brake heated up again even in stop and go traffic. The wheel became red hot and caught the rear of the bus on fire. The driver failed to notice until portable oxygen tanks used by the patients began exploding. The bus turned into a crematorium for 24 of those patients. I'll never forget watching the bus burning up live on TV. Also, I left my magnetic retarder on by mistake in Flagstaff and nearly caught my 84 Bird on fire. I burned through the air line that operated the driver's seat slide. Imagine smoke coming from under your coach and you're struggling to get to the extinguisher with your seat next to the doghouse. Fire on a motorcoach is almost as serious as fire on board an airplane. Brad Barton 00LXiDFW > bbartonwx@... > > To: WanderlodgeForum@...: martingregg598@...: Tue, 26 Jun 2007 00:32:18 +0000Subject: [WanderlodgeForum] Re: Mountain Driving with 1995 42', 42,000 lb. Blue Bird > > Ron, if you have a Allison HT-755 five speed with a retarder, I have know advice, if you have a 1995-42' you should have a Allison HD-4060 and a DD series 60 with a 3 position Jacobs engine brake. Jacobs's brakes close the valves and turn the cylinder into a compressor creating braking horsepower, each position adds more cylinders. I haven't driven a 95 in the mountains but I have driven over a lot of the passes in the Cascades, Montana, Idaho and so on, but I can't imagine that if your in the right gear at the right RPM that the engine brake won't hold it back. For me with a less effective Pac Brake, it is 4th gear at 50 mph at about 2400 rpm's on a 6% or so, on a steeper grade it's 3 gear at 35-40 mph and I almost never have to use my air brakes. If I am in 4th and it starts to run away, faster that I like, I use the brakes to get the coach down to the speed that I can select the next lower gear. If the Jacobs brake doesn't hold you back, maybe there is something wrong > with the Jacobs brake? As for the "Drum type" air brakes, if you have been on the road for a time and the ambient temp. is hot, and If you ride the brakes for a long period of time the drum can expand away from the shoe and you lose your brakes. With some real bad luck you could heat the wheel up so hot that it heats the tire up and blowout.Marty95 BMC 37Kennewick Wa > > __________________________________________________________ > Play free games, earn tickets, get cool prizes! Join Live Search Club. > http://club.live.com/home.aspx?icid=CLUB_wlmailtextlink > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |