+- Wanderlodge Gurus - The Member Funded Wanderlodge Forum (http://www.wanderlodgegurus.com)
+-- Forum: Yahoo Groups Archive (/forumdisplay.php?fid=61)
+--- Forum: WanderlodgeForum (/forumdisplay.php?fid=63)
+--- Thread: Why the engine replacements? (/showthread.php?tid=1253)
Pages: 1 2
Why the engine replacements? - Christina Corpus - 08-26-2005 16:25
Hi all,
This is Christina's hubby, Phil. She's shared your answers to her
previous posts/questions with me while I was on the road. Everyone
has been very helpful. Thank you.
In way of introduction, I am a carhauler--I drive one of those rigs
you see hauling 9-10 new cars to dealerships. Prior to that I was in
the towing/heavy equipment transport business, and prior to that, I
owned an auto repair business. Can you guess what my duties will be
when we find our 'bird?
Which brings me to my question.
While reading the Bluebird 'for sale' listings on various websites, I
noticed a good percentage of the listings noted, "coach has 120,000
miles, engine has 20,000 miles" or, "low miles on 'new' motor",
etc.,etc. What struck me was the relatively low mileage on the motors
being replaced.
Keep in mind I've been driving diesel rigs for several years and it's
routine to run them 500,000 miles before any major repairs, if any,
are performed, and then it will probably be an in frame overhaul. I've
also driven medium duty trucks with gas engines that ran 200-300,000
miles before anything major.
So, my question for you veteran Bluebird owners--why do I see comments
about motors being replaced in coaches that the seller is claiming has
relatively low miles (less that 125,000)?
I'm making some assumptions here--tell me if I'm right or wrong, or
somewhere in between:
1. Someone got sold a bill of goods.
2. Lack of use (5000 miles per year for 15-20 years). Engine gaskets
and seals blowing out.
3. Something regarding the durability of diesel motors primarily used
in the Bluebird.
4. Lack of proper maintenance of the lubrication and/or cooling
systems, causing premature wear or overheating.
5. Original motor was underpowered and the replacement was an upgrade
to more horsepower.
There may be more assumptions to be made, but these are the first
that come to mind.
All comments are welcome.
Thanks,
Phil
Why the engine replacements? - Gregory OConnor - 08-26-2005 17:32
Phil, I just bought a 94pt40 last month and started looking two
months prior. I too found it unusual that low mile birds had new
engines. I have several dump trucks with over 400,000 and drive them
hard off road and they have the orig powerplants. The 3208 Cats are
not a sleve cylinder engine and an inframe is not possible but with
such low miles I dont think they ever get worn out. I think
operators are over tacking the Cats or lugging them and burning them
up. The 4 and 5 allison gives less room for mistakes then a 10 speed
manual shift. I have a 8v92 detroit and let me tell you that I have
alot to learn as I try to keep the r's up and the temp down. I look
at the gauges and once in a while I look at the road. It is hard to
climb a hill and keep the trans from down shifting to a lug with only
5 speeds to use. I think the detroits were just driven wrong. Cant
go wrong if you get a bird from Miller coach works or Randy Dupree,
wish I did.
Greg O'Connor
94pt40 CAlifornia
When I drive --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Christina
Corpus"
> Hi all,
>
> This is Christina's hubby, Phil. She's shared your answers to her
> previous posts/questions with me while I was on the road. Everyone
> has been very helpful. Thank you.
>
> In way of introduction, I am a carhauler--I drive one of those rigs
> you see hauling 9-10 new cars to dealerships. Prior to that I was
in
> the towing/heavy equipment transport business, and prior to that, I
> owned an auto repair business. Can you guess what my duties will be
> when we find our 'bird?
>
> Which brings me to my question.
>
> While reading the Bluebird 'for sale' listings on various websites,
I
> noticed a good percentage of the listings noted, "coach has 120,000
> miles, engine has 20,000 miles" or, "low miles on 'new' motor",
> etc.,etc. What struck me was the relatively low mileage on the
motors
> being replaced.
>
> Keep in mind I've been driving diesel rigs for several years and
it's
> routine to run them 500,000 miles before any major repairs, if any,
> are performed, and then it will probably be an in frame overhaul.
I've
> also driven medium duty trucks with gas engines that ran 200-300,000
> miles before anything major.
>
> So, my question for you veteran Bluebird owners--why do I see
comments
> about motors being replaced in coaches that the seller is claiming
has
> relatively low miles (less that 125,000)?
>
> I'm making some assumptions here--tell me if I'm right or wrong, or
> somewhere in between:
>
> 1. Someone got sold a bill of goods.
>
> 2. Lack of use (5000 miles per year for 15-20 years). Engine
gaskets
> and seals blowing out.
>
> 3. Something regarding the durability of diesel motors primarily
used
> in the Bluebird.
>
> 4. Lack of proper maintenance of the lubrication and/or cooling
> systems, causing premature wear or overheating.
>
> 5. Original motor was underpowered and the replacement was an
upgrade
> to more horsepower.
>
> There may be more assumptions to be made, but these are the first
> that come to mind.
>
> All comments are welcome.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Phil
Why the engine replacements? - Dan Weaver - 08-27-2005 00:26
Greg's post Sounds reasonable to me along with several items
mentioned by Phil:
2. Lack of use (5000 miles per year for 15-20 years). Engine gaskets
and seals blowing out.
4. Lack of proper maintenance of the lubrication and/or cooling
systems, causing premature wear or overheating.
Along with trying to limp in with a problem, when a pro trucker
might pull over and wait for a service truck.
Dan
previous 83 FC35 with the Cat 3208
now 94 BMC 37' with the Cummnins
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Gregory OConnor"
> Phil, I just bought a 94pt40 last month and started looking two
> months prior. I too found it unusual that low mile birds had new
> engines. I have several dump trucks with over 400,000 and drive
them
> hard off road and they have the orig powerplants. The 3208 Cats
are
> not a sleve cylinder engine and an inframe is not possible but
with
> such low miles I dont think they ever get worn out. I think
> operators are over tacking the Cats or lugging them and burning
them
> up. The 4 and 5 allison gives less room for mistakes then a 10
speed
> manual shift. I have a 8v92 detroit and let me tell you that I
have
> alot to learn as I try to keep the r's up and the temp down. I
look
> at the gauges and once in a while I look at the road. It is hard
to
> climb a hill and keep the trans from down shifting to a lug with
only
> 5 speeds to use. I think the detroits were just driven wrong.
Cant
> go wrong if you get a bird from Miller coach works or Randy
Dupree,
> wish I did.
>
> Greg O'Connor
> 94pt40 CAlifornia
>
> When I drive --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Christina
> Corpus"
> > Hi all,
> >
> > This is Christina's hubby, Phil. She's shared your answers to her
> > previous posts/questions with me while I was on the road.
Everyone
> > has been very helpful. Thank you.
> >
> > In way of introduction, I am a carhauler--I drive one of those
rigs
> > you see hauling 9-10 new cars to dealerships. Prior to that I
was
> in
> > the towing/heavy equipment transport business, and prior to
that, I
> > owned an auto repair business. Can you guess what my duties
will be
> > when we find our 'bird?
> >
> > Which brings me to my question.
> >
> > While reading the Bluebird 'for sale' listings on various
websites,
> I
> > noticed a good percentage of the listings noted, "coach has
120,000
> > miles, engine has 20,000 miles" or, "low miles on 'new' motor",
> > etc.,etc. What struck me was the relatively low mileage on the
> motors
> > being replaced.
> >
> > Keep in mind I've been driving diesel rigs for several years and
> it's
> > routine to run them 500,000 miles before any major repairs, if
any,
> > are performed, and then it will probably be an in frame
overhaul.
> I've
> > also driven medium duty trucks with gas engines that ran 200-
300,000
> > miles before anything major.
> >
> > So, my question for you veteran Bluebird owners--why do I see
> comments
> > about motors being replaced in coaches that the seller is
claiming
> has
> > relatively low miles (less that 125,000)?
> >
> > I'm making some assumptions here--tell me if I'm right or wrong,
or
> > somewhere in between:
> >
> > 1. Someone got sold a bill of goods.
> >
> > 2. Lack of use (5000 miles per year for 15-20 years). Engine
> gaskets
> > and seals blowing out.
> >
> > 3. Something regarding the durability of diesel motors
primarily
> used
> > in the Bluebird.
> >
> > 4. Lack of proper maintenance of the lubrication and/or cooling
> > systems, causing premature wear or overheating.
> >
> > 5. Original motor was underpowered and the replacement was an
> upgrade
> > to more horsepower.
> >
> > There may be more assumptions to be made, but these are the
first
> > that come to mind.
> >
> > All comments are welcome.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Phil
Why the engine replacements? - pattypape - 08-27-2005 03:39
Phil,
I think you are on track with your # 2 & # 4 assumptions.
Neglect, lack of knowledge, and trying to save a dime on routine
maintenance.
Bill 88 FC
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Christina Corpus"
> Hi all,
>
> This is Christina's hubby, Phil. She's shared your answers to her
> previous posts/questions with me while I was on the road. Everyone
> has been very helpful. Thank you.
>
> In way of introduction, I am a carhauler--I drive one of those rigs
> you see hauling 9-10 new cars to dealerships. Prior to that I was
in
> the towing/heavy equipment transport business, and prior to that, I
> owned an auto repair business. Can you guess what my duties will
be
> when we find our 'bird?
>
> Which brings me to my question.
>
> While reading the Bluebird 'for sale' listings on various
websites, I
> noticed a good percentage of the listings noted, "coach has 120,000
> miles, engine has 20,000 miles" or, "low miles on 'new' motor",
> etc.,etc. What struck me was the relatively low mileage on the
motors
> being replaced.
>
> Keep in mind I've been driving diesel rigs for several years and
it's
> routine to run them 500,000 miles before any major repairs, if any,
> are performed, and then it will probably be an in frame overhaul.
I've
> also driven medium duty trucks with gas engines that ran 200-
300,000
> miles before anything major.
>
> So, my question for you veteran Bluebird owners--why do I see
comments
> about motors being replaced in coaches that the seller is claiming
has
> relatively low miles (less that 125,000)?
>
> I'm making some assumptions here--tell me if I'm right or wrong, or
> somewhere in between:
>
> 1. Someone got sold a bill of goods.
>
> 2. Lack of use (5000 miles per year for 15-20 years). Engine
gaskets
> and seals blowing out.
>
> 3. Something regarding the durability of diesel motors primarily
used
> in the Bluebird.
>
> 4. Lack of proper maintenance of the lubrication and/or cooling
> systems, causing premature wear or overheating.
>
> 5. Original motor was underpowered and the replacement was an
upgrade
> to more horsepower.
>
> There may be more assumptions to be made, but these are the first
> that come to mind.
>
> All comments are welcome.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Phil
Why the engine replacements? - Gary Miller - 08-27-2005 07:21
Phil,
Very good question. I've pondered the same thing before and would
have to agree with your assumptions #1 and #4, with #2 being a part
of #4.
I've been following the Wanderlodge forums for 4 years or so now,
and am often amazed when the topic of lubrication comes up and
people are trying to figure out the minimum they can get away with
when maintaining their engines/drivelines. Do I hafta use expensive
lubricants? Do I hafta change the oil before storage? Should I
bother with oil sampling? Should I bother with additives in the
coolant? Normally these folks become converts to proper mechanical
maintenance after the discussions, but there are folks out there who
don't partake in the forum.
How often should I check the oil? Well, if you have to ask,
probably more often than you are...
Regarding assumption #1, I saw receipts from an owner of a fresh
transmission fluid and filter change (internal and external). His
transmission had no internal filter (to my knowledge), and the spin
on filter had a date marked on it with marker over 5 years old! I
insist on keeping a friendly eye on the folks who work on my coach
(rare).
Some folks overspin their engines. This'll kill the CAT. The way I
understand it the valve springs can't keep up and it eats a valve.
These coaches were built when the national speed limit was 55 and
most were geared for about 65 max. So unless you install a new rear
end or larger tires, that's all you should do. As you know, the
governor won't slow the engine if the driver wants to point the rig
downhill and mat the pedal and some tach's are in need of
adjustments after many years. There's always the temptation to be
motoring on down the road, but hey, if there's a house on your back,
what's the hurry? You're already there.
So improper maintenance like no valve lash adjustment at the proper
interval, plus overspinning, plus perhaps marginal lubrication, and
maybe no additives in the coolant... How long can the poor engine
last?
If Grandpa hasn't driven it in five years, perhaps it should have
fresh fluids before start-up. It happens.
The engines are all very staunch, heavy duty top line units. But
they're only bulletproof with proper maintenance.
I wouldn't make the assumption that all the engines have a checkered
past though. What you are seeing is a small percentage of coaches
that have been misunderstood by their owners and are being sold.
I would look for an owner who baby's his coach, changes fluids and
keeps records, gets oil samples, and generally would rather keep his
coach than sell it. Oh wait...that's me!
Gary Miller
83 FC 33 - For Sale 'millercoachworks.com'
Milwaukee area
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Christina Corpus"
> Hi all,
>
> This is Christina's hubby, Phil. She's shared your answers to her
> previous posts/questions with me while I was on the road. Everyone
> has been very helpful. Thank you.
>
> In way of introduction, I am a carhauler--I drive one of those rigs
> you see hauling 9-10 new cars to dealerships. Prior to that I was
in
> the towing/heavy equipment transport business, and prior to that, I
> owned an auto repair business. Can you guess what my duties will
be
> when we find our 'bird?
>
> Which brings me to my question.
>
> While reading the Bluebird 'for sale' listings on various
websites, I
> noticed a good percentage of the listings noted, "coach has 120,000
> miles, engine has 20,000 miles" or, "low miles on 'new' motor",
> etc.,etc. What struck me was the relatively low mileage on the
motors
> being replaced.
>
> Keep in mind I've been driving diesel rigs for several years and
it's
> routine to run them 500,000 miles before any major repairs, if any,
> are performed, and then it will probably be an in frame overhaul.
I've
> also driven medium duty trucks with gas engines that ran 200-
300,000
> miles before anything major.
>
> So, my question for you veteran Bluebird owners--why do I see
comments
> about motors being replaced in coaches that the seller is claiming
has
> relatively low miles (less that 125,000)?
>
> I'm making some assumptions here--tell me if I'm right or wrong, or
> somewhere in between:
>
> 1. Someone got sold a bill of goods.
>
> 2. Lack of use (5000 miles per year for 15-20 years). Engine
gaskets
> and seals blowing out.
>
> 3. Something regarding the durability of diesel motors primarily
used
> in the Bluebird.
>
> 4. Lack of proper maintenance of the lubrication and/or cooling
> systems, causing premature wear or overheating.
>
> 5. Original motor was underpowered and the replacement was an
upgrade
> to more horsepower.
>
> There may be more assumptions to be made, but these are the first
> that come to mind.
>
> All comments are welcome.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Phil
Why the engine replacements? - Christina Corpus - 08-27-2005 11:02
Greg,
I agree with you that low mileage motors probably weren't replaced
because they were worn out. More a matter of something breaking due
to misuse.
Lack of knowledge on how to operate a heavy diesel powered vehicle
(over- taching the RPM's or lugging it down) results in an expensive
lesson. Good reason to read the operator manuals.
When my wife and I are looking at cockpit photos of units for sale,
she kids me about, "it's got all of the guages you want." I tell her,
"the more, the merrier." All those guages tell me what is happening
under the dog house and floor boards.
Keep the R's up and temp down.
Phil
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Gregory OConnor"
> Phil, I just bought a 94pt40 last month and started looking two
> months prior. I too found it unusual that low mile birds had new
> engines. I have several dump trucks with over 400,000 and drive
them
> hard off road and they have the orig powerplants. The 3208 Cats
are
> not a sleve cylinder engine and an inframe is not possible but with
> such low miles I dont think they ever get worn out. I think
> operators are over tacking the Cats or lugging them and burning
them
> up. The 4 and 5 allison gives less room for mistakes then a 10
speed
> manual shift. I have a 8v92 detroit and let me tell you that I have
> alot to learn as I try to keep the r's up and the temp down. I
look
> at the gauges and once in a while I look at the road. It is hard
to
> climb a hill and keep the trans from down shifting to a lug with
only
> 5 speeds to use. I think the detroits were just driven wrong. Cant
> go wrong if you get a bird from Miller coach works or Randy Dupree,
> wish I did.
>
> Greg O'Connor
> 94pt40 CAlifornia
>
>
Why the engine replacements? - Gregory OConnor - 08-27-2005 11:37
Phil you and many of the operators that read this forum know about
over rpm damage but I think it deserves to be pointed out that you
can cook a motor by over rpming "r'ing" on a down hill with your
foot off the fuel. by using back pressure in the motor and a lower
gear I never let the r's go over 2,000 before I ride the brakes
slowing the r's to 1,800. on a down hill I flip the fan overide
switch which puts a load on the engine and helps to keep it in the r
range. One other reason I think the engines are swapped inplace of a
rebuild or inframe repair is ;A coach sold with unknown engine probs
is sold so low $ that a reman swap is cost effective and gives the
new owner peace of mind. I run the limits on oilchanges, I dont do
sampling because I dont want to spend the $ or see the results, I
stopped using additives after Rogain failed me back in the 80's. It
may be wise to do all the over maintaining things but as Jeff Miller
points out doing the right maintainance at the proper time is key.
Greg
Bald in California
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Christina Corpus"
> Greg,
>
> I agree with you that low mileage motors probably weren't replaced
> because they were worn out. More a matter of something breaking due
> to misuse.
>
> Lack of knowledge on how to operate a heavy diesel powered vehicle
> (over- taching the RPM's or lugging it down) results in an expensive
> lesson. Good reason to read the operator manuals.
>
> When my wife and I are looking at cockpit photos of units for sale,
> she kids me about, "it's got all of the guages you want." I tell
her,
> "the more, the merrier." All those guages tell me what is happening
> under the dog house and floor boards.
>
> Keep the R's up and temp down.
>
> Phil
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Gregory OConnor"
>
> > Phil, I just bought a 94pt40 last month and started looking two
> > months prior. I too found it unusual that low mile birds had new
> > engines. I have several dump trucks with over 400,000 and drive
> them
> > hard off road and they have the orig powerplants. The 3208 Cats
> are
> > not a sleve cylinder engine and an inframe is not possible but
with
> > such low miles I dont think they ever get worn out. I think
> > operators are over tacking the Cats or lugging them and burning
> them
> > up. The 4 and 5 allison gives less room for mistakes then a 10
> speed
> > manual shift. I have a 8v92 detroit and let me tell you that I
have
> > alot to learn as I try to keep the r's up and the temp down. I
> look
> > at the gauges and once in a while I look at the road. It is hard
> to
> > climb a hill and keep the trans from down shifting to a lug with
> only
> > 5 speeds to use. I think the detroits were just driven wrong.
Cant
> > go wrong if you get a bird from Miller coach works or Randy
Dupree,
> > wish I did.
> >
> > Greg O'Connor
> > 94pt40 CAlifornia
> >
> >
Why the engine replacements? - Christina Corpus - 08-27-2005 15:42
Good point, Dan. Thanks.
Of course, I can call the company maintenance department and pass the
buck to them whether or not to call road service. It's not any money
out of my pocket. I guess that's why subscribing to an emergency road
service program may be wise for an RV owner.
Phil
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Dan Weaver"
>
> Greg's post Sounds reasonable to me along with several items
> mentioned by Phil:
> 2. Lack of use (5000 miles per year for 15-20 years). Engine gaskets
> and seals blowing out.
> 4. Lack of proper maintenance of the lubrication and/or cooling
> systems, causing premature wear or overheating.
>
> Along with trying to limp in with a problem, when a pro trucker
> might pull over and wait for a service truck.
>
> Dan
> previous 83 FC35 with the Cat 3208
> now 94 BMC 37' with the Cummnins
>
>
Why the engine replacements? - Christina Corpus - 08-27-2005 17:03
Gary,
Thanks for your reply.
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Gary Miller"
> Phil,
>
> Very good question. I've pondered the same thing before and would
> have to agree with your assumptions #1 and #4, with #2 being a part
> of #4.
>
> I've been following the Wanderlodge forums for 4 years or so now,
> and am often amazed when the topic of lubrication comes up and
> people are trying to figure out the minimum they can get away with
> when maintaining their engines/drivelines. Do I hafta use
expensive
> lubricants? Do I hafta change the oil before storage? Should I
> bother with oil sampling? Should I bother with additives in the
> coolant? Normally these folks become converts to proper mechanical
> maintenance after the discussions, but there are folks out there
who
> don't partake in the forum.
Kind of like the old TV ad, "Pay me now, or pay me later." Sounds
like asking a seller whether or not he has all his service records
available would be a good idea. If not, then it's 'buyer beware'
time.
> How often should I check the oil? Well, if you have to ask,
> probably more often than you are...
Copy that.
>
> Regarding assumption #1, I saw receipts from an owner of a fresh
> transmission fluid and filter change (internal and external). His
> transmission had no internal filter (to my knowledge), and the spin
> on filter had a date marked on it with marker over 5 years old! I
> insist on keeping a friendly eye on the folks who work on my coach
> (rare).
...and since there is more money to made...
>
> Some folks overspin their engines. This'll kill the CAT. The way
I
> understand it the valve springs can't keep up and it eats a valve.
One company I worked for installed a CAT engine into one its medium
duty trucks. It was replacing a Cummins. The thing I remember about
driving that truck after the swap was how quickly the CAT engine
peaked out in each gear. You definitely had to watch the tach.
> These coaches were built when the national speed limit was 55 and
> most were geared for about 65 max. So unless you install a new
rear
> end or larger tires, that's all you should do. As you know, the
> governor won't slow the engine if the driver wants to point the rig
> downhill and mat the pedal and some tach's are in need of
> adjustments after many years.
Out here in California, we have the Grapevine heading north out of Los
Angeles. On the north side, northbound, the speed limit for trucks is
35 mph. I downshift my 78,000 pound truck into 6th gear, engage the
Jake brake, and cruise down that grade at 18 mph, never touching the
brake pedal. I am constantly amazed at all the motorhomes that pass
me going full tilt down that mountain. I mean, they are keeping up
with the cars that are going down at 75 mph. You can hear the engines
winding out tight.
> There's always the temptation to be motoring on down the road, but
> hey, if there's a house on your back, what's the hurry? You're
>already there.
Our plan is to full time, so this is exactly our philosophy.
>
> The engines are all very staunch, heavy duty top line units. But
> they're only bulletproof with proper maintenance.
>
> I wouldn't make the assumption that all the engines have a
checkered
> past though. What you are seeing is a small percentage of coaches
> that have been misunderstood by their owners and are being sold.
It appears from the responses to my question from everyone that there
is no issue regarding the durability of the engines used in the
Bluebird.
>
> I would look for an owner who baby's his coach, changes fluids and
> keeps records, gets oil samples, and generally would rather keep
his
> coach than sell it. Oh wait...that's me!
My wife is very impressed with your coach. I have to remind her what
our plans are and that 35 feet is the minimum we've decided on. Now
if you could figure out how to extend your unit 2-3 feet... :>)
>
> Gary Miller
> 83 FC 33 - For Sale 'millercoachworks.com'
> Milwaukee area
>
Why the engine replacements? - Gary Miller - 08-28-2005 01:35
Phil,
Thanks for the nice words. Can't stretch the coach for ya. Have to
admit, if I were full-timing, the extra two closets in the 35 footer
would come in handy, though not critical. Truth be told we've never
run out of storage with three kids and two adults on long trips.
Overthinking things a bit (which I tend to do), a 35 foot coach is
about 2000 pounds heavier than a 33 on the same axles. Those are
heavy closets! (extra A/C, heavier genset, slightly larger fuel
tank, bigger jacks, etc...)
Pulling 2000 pounds more trailer or toad likely offers even more
storage than the two closets, and it's not on the axles.
Hmmmm. Just thought I'd muddy the water for you.
Gary Miller
83 FC 33 - For Sale 'millercoachworks.com'
Milwaukee area
--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Christina Corpus"
> Gary,
>
> Thanks for your reply.
>
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Gary Miller"
>
> > Phil,
> >
> > Very good question. I've pondered the same thing before and
would
> > have to agree with your assumptions #1 and #4, with #2 being a
part
> > of #4.
> >
> > I've been following the Wanderlodge forums for 4 years or so
now,
> > and am often amazed when the topic of lubrication comes up and
> > people are trying to figure out the minimum they can get away
with
> > when maintaining their engines/drivelines. Do I hafta use
> expensive
> > lubricants? Do I hafta change the oil before storage? Should I
> > bother with oil sampling? Should I bother with additives in the
> > coolant? Normally these folks become converts to proper
mechanical
> > maintenance after the discussions, but there are folks out there
> who
> > don't partake in the forum.
>
> Kind of like the old TV ad, "Pay me now, or pay me later." Sounds
> like asking a seller whether or not he has all his service records
> available would be a good idea. If not, then it's 'buyer beware'
> time.
>
>
> > How often should I check the oil? Well, if you have to ask,
> > probably more often than you are...
>
> Copy that.
>
> >
> > Regarding assumption #1, I saw receipts from an owner of a fresh
> > transmission fluid and filter change (internal and external).
His
> > transmission had no internal filter (to my knowledge), and the
spin
> > on filter had a date marked on it with marker over 5 years old!
I
> > insist on keeping a friendly eye on the folks who work on my
coach
> > (rare).
>
> ...and since there is more money to made...
>
>
> >
> > Some folks overspin their engines. This'll kill the CAT. The
way
> I
> > understand it the valve springs can't keep up and it eats a
valve.
>
> One company I worked for installed a CAT engine into one its medium
> duty trucks. It was replacing a Cummins. The thing I remember
about
> driving that truck after the swap was how quickly the CAT engine
> peaked out in each gear. You definitely had to watch the tach.
>
>
> > These coaches were built when the national speed limit was 55
and
> > most were geared for about 65 max. So unless you install a new
> rear
> > end or larger tires, that's all you should do. As you know, the
> > governor won't slow the engine if the driver wants to point the
rig
> > downhill and mat the pedal and some tach's are in need of
> > adjustments after many years.
>
> Out here in California, we have the Grapevine heading north out of
Los
> Angeles. On the north side, northbound, the speed limit for
trucks is
> 35 mph. I downshift my 78,000 pound truck into 6th gear, engage
the
> Jake brake, and cruise down that grade at 18 mph, never touching
the
> brake pedal. I am constantly amazed at all the motorhomes that
pass
> me going full tilt down that mountain. I mean, they are keeping up
> with the cars that are going down at 75 mph. You can hear the
engines
> winding out tight.
>
> > There's always the temptation to be motoring on down the road,
but
> > hey, if there's a house on your back, what's the hurry? You're
> >already there.
>
> Our plan is to full time, so this is exactly our philosophy.
>
>
> >
> > The engines are all very staunch, heavy duty top line units.
But
> > they're only bulletproof with proper maintenance.
> >
> > I wouldn't make the assumption that all the engines have a
> checkered
> > past though. What you are seeing is a small percentage of
coaches
> > that have been misunderstood by their owners and are being sold.
>
> It appears from the responses to my question from everyone that
there
> is no issue regarding the durability of the engines used in the
> Bluebird.
>
>
> >
> > I would look for an owner who baby's his coach, changes fluids
and
> > keeps records, gets oil samples, and generally would rather keep
> his
> > coach than sell it. Oh wait...that's me!
>
> My wife is very impressed with your coach. I have to remind her
what
> our plans are and that 35 feet is the minimum we've decided on.
Now
> if you could figure out how to extend your unit 2-3 feet... :>)
>
> >
> > Gary Miller
> > 83 FC 33 - For Sale 'millercoachworks.com'
> > Milwaukee area
> >