Should we even be looking at Old Birds?

[Jack & Donna Smith]

As one with practical experience with a "Vintage" Bird, I second the
idea of staying away from a coach that needs a lot, or even some
work.
You will have enough work "sprucing up" and making the coach "Yours"
and you don't want any extra tasks, if possible.
Although these things are called "RVs", they really are not, as you
will soon find out when you take one to a regular RV shop for much
more than awning replacment, or new floormats..
In the few cases I have had to tow the coach, I have always tried to
impress on them that this is a BIG 31' BUS, and the front axel is
sone 5 feet in back of the front bumper. When the tow truck
arrives, the driver usually says, "I should of Brought our Big
Truck"!
The rule of thumb is that you should have a fund of some $10K to
cover repairs, fix-ups, and other items. Tires can run $3 to 4
hundred each.
I think an 83 or so would be a good starting point, with the Turbo
and Air Bags.
Also, if you live in one of those "Wunnerful" HOA's, be prepared to
hear, "Get that big ugly thing out of here", and add in $150 a month
or so to store it elsewhere, and remember that usually you cant work
on it or wash it at the storage lot.
But, Welcome to the world of Wanderlodges and all the quality people
you will meet in "The Family"....
Jack Smith
1973FC31
SoCal.



--- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "campingleroy"
wrote:
>
> Wow tons of great feedback and fast! This forum definately seems
> very helpful, and really helps me feel more comfortable about
making
> a step toward an older coach, and knowing i have a team to help me
> figure things out.
>
> I think that I'd be better at actually doing the
repairs/maintenance
> than troubleshooting problems at least on the mechancial stuff,
until
> I got to know things a bit more.
>
> A bit more background on us. We're late 20s, early 30s, with 2
girls
> under 3 years old. We currently travel about 1 big trip a year
and 2-
> 4 more smaller weekend trips. We expect that will increase again
as
> the girls get older (read out of diapers and crib).
>
> I work in IT with computers for a living, and have done nearly
every
> type of work around the house and my RV, with only limited
mechanical
> work.
>
> I think we'd like an 83 or 84 FC based on all i read. They have
the
> power of the Turbo, and also air suspension, but still aren't too
> pricey. We want the diesel engine and the diesel generator. We
want
> the one with twin couches up front, and a double bed in the back.
>
> I dont have an exact budget at the moment. Obviously the less I
> could spend the better, but I want the most reliable coach I can
get
> too. I would like to spend near $20K.
>
> Thanks for all the great feedback. I had heard a lot of good
stuff
> about this place from the RV.NET group, and it definately seems
like
> you've got a great group.
>
>
> We actually went and checked out an 83 this weekend. Floor plan
was
> cool, perfect. But it left me with a lot of questions. Here's an
> excerpt from what I wrote on RV.NEt about it.
>
> "Late last night I found a deal on an old 1983 Wanderlodge an hour
or
> so south of me. We've been thinking for a few years that it would
be
> very nice to have an old Bird. This deal seemed too good to be
true,
> $12,000. I'd never personally been inside a vintage bird, so i
> figured now is a good time to go see if they'd really be a good
fit
> for us. The seller was selling on behalf of his brother and didn't
> know much about it.
>
> Engine started right up, but the smell of diesel was extremely
strong
> outside the front end, passenger side. Is that normal?
>
> The diesel genset didn't want to start up, he thought it was fed
by a
> separate tank, but I dont think that is the case.
>
> Outside was rough, definately needed a new coat of paint. Inside
was
> decent. Was nice being in an older unit with not a signle sign of
a
> leak. Much of the uppolstry needed to be replaced, couchs, chairs,
> dinnettes. And the carpet was ugh-riginal.
>
> 12V electrical system was great for lights, but nearly everything
on
> the dash was dead. Gauges seemed to work, but switches were all
> useless. A/C, Heat etc didnt work.
>
> As for the 110V stuff, I couldn't test with no genset and no shore
> power.
>
> Awnings needed some help, but I was about done by the time I got
to
> them, that I didn't even check them out.
>
> Man, this thing could be nice to someone who wants to put a bit of
> time into it, just not sure I'm really up to it at this point in
the
> game.
>
> Question is, should I lowball this guy? And see if I can get it at
a
> price where I could pay someone else to fix the broken "stuff"?
Any
> factor sound like sign of something much worse?
> "
>
>
> --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Jack & Donna Smith"
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Old Bird or Newer?? Well, as some say, "You Pays Your Money,
and
> > Takes Your Choice"...
> > Our 1973 Bird lacks some of the items that are standard on Newer
> > coaches, but also lack some of the headaches..What is
a "Sporlian
> > Valve", anyway, or "Air Operated Sreps"?
> > As my old pappy said, "What ain't there, cant break".
> > Some costs are less, such as my yearly DMV fee of $67,(even here
in
> > the Land of Arnold), and lower Insurance costs, and it afforded
me
> > my unique method of financing, One Payment & walk away with the
> Pink
> > Slip..
> > But make no mistake, repairs may be necessary, and as Jeff
Miller
> > said, "Pay Now, oor Pay Later".
> > The old coaches are much simpler and therefore easier (read
Cheaper)
> > to maintain.
> > The great thing about Bluebirds is that they practically never
wear
> > out. A lot of the original items on our coach are still
working,
> > while I imagine my old "Sticks & Staples Tioga is probably in
that
> > Big KOA in the Sky...
> > We also like to visit the various RV dealers and look over the
> > current crop.. It is real interesting to see the look on the
> > salesmans face when he asks us if we have an RV and we
reply, "Yes,
> > a Bluebird". We are usually left alone after that......
> > Jack Smith
> > 1973FC31
> > SoCal
> >
> >
> > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael" <mike.putz@>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > I also agree with everything I've read here. I own a 63
Bluebird
> > > conversion and just recently purchased a 78FC35. I choose
this
> > bus
> > > to upgrade to a diesel, leveling jacks, bigger generator,
etc..
> I
> > > did not want air bags as I like to go off road often with a
> > trailer
> > > full of quads and dirt bikes. I wanted something tough with
> > ground
> > > clearance. I had the pleasure of driving my friends 90SP36
from
> > > Texas to Arizona not long ago. It was very nice, plush,
fancy,
> > and
> > > strong with the 300 HP Cat. However, it was just not for me.
So
> > old
> > > or new.. you can't go wrong with these busses. I'm a "bang-
for-
> > buck"
> > > kind of guy on a small budget so the FC's were perfect!
> > > Just another 2 cents...
> > >
> > > Michael
> > > 78FC35 "Putz'n Around"
> > > Mesa, Az
> > >
> > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "bubblerboy64"

> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Leroy, I think everything that has been said is on target.
You
> > > > certainly want the best that you can buy. No doubt the
later
> > FC's
> > > > are considerably improved and being newer should in theory
at
> > least
> > > > be in better condition. That being said there is always the
> > debate
> > > as
> > > > to how much a guy should spend on an FC before he considers
a
> > PT. I
> > > > have never ridden in or experienced a late model FC but my
> > thoughts
> > > > are if I was going to spend upwards of 50K would I add to it
a
> > > little
> > > > (or a lot) and go with a PT. These are things you have to
> > decide.
> > > I
> > > > was there a year ago and I am certain all of us would agree
> that
> > > you
> > > > should invest in some travel and time to investigate a
number
> of
> > > > these coaches before you buy. I think personal preference
and
> > how
> > > > you are going to use the coach are the critical things to
> > > consider.
> > > > I love my old 1973 but if I was intending to make a lot of
long
> > > runs
> > > > I would consider moving up. My coach is also smallish for
more
> > then
> > > > two. I consider it like buying any vehicle you want to match
it
> > to
> > > > your use as well as your pocket book.
> > > > John Heckman
> > > > central Pa
> > > > 1973 FC
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In
WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "michaelhohnstein"
> > > > > <MHOHNSTEIN@> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- In WanderlodgeForum@yahoogroups.com, "campingleroy"
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I have experience with quite a few mid 80s Birds, buying
> > > selling
> > > > > > and "fixing on." My 83 rear bath suits the wife and I
real
> > > well
> > > > > and
> > > > > > I wouldn't trade it for a triple slide anything. Not
even
> a
> > > > Newell.
> > > > > > That being said, I recommend 87 and newer FCs for those
who
> > > wish
> > > > to
> > > > > > get into a vintage Bird. The engine and accessories are
> much
> > > > easier
> > > > > > to maintain due to improved design engine cover and
swing
> > > > radiator.
> > > > > > 86 and older are a pain to adjust valves on, and that's
not
> > > good.
> > > > > > Moreover the 87 up has a charge air cooler and 300 hp.,
a
> > very
> > > > > > welcome feature when trying to get down the road. The
ZF
> > trans
> > > > is
> > > > > a
> > > > > > great piece and features OD.
> > > > > > My 83 has been upgraded to 87 specs. Fiberglass engine
> > cover,
> > > > > > charge air cooler and inlet air enhancements. The
Allison
> > is
> > > > > backed
> > > > > > by a drive line OD transmission in front of the Jake
> > retarder.
> > > > > > I was able to do all this 'stuff' to my Bird due the
line
> of
> > > work
> > > > > > I'm in. Much easier to just pay a little more and get
the
> > > newer
> > > > > > version, and it's all done for you.
> > > > > > MH
> > > > > >
> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > My wife and I really like a lot of things about
vintage
> > > birds,
> > > > > > > including the safety, reliability, and durability. I
> > think a
> > > > mid
> > > > > > 80s
> > > > > > > FC would be about the best fit for us and our budget.
> The
> > > one
> > > > > > with a
> > > > > > > double bed in the back, and 2 couches up front.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I dont mind tinkering and working on a lot of
projects.
> > Our
> > > > > > current
> > > > > > > coach is a 1989 Class C, I had to rebuild the entire
cab
> > over
> > > > on
> > > > > > that.
> > > > > > > But I'm by no means a mechanic. I do consider myself
to
> > be
> > > > very
> > > > > > > mechanically inclined though. I can follow directions
> > really
> > > > > > well, if
> > > > > > > there are procedures on doing projects though. And
based
> > on
> > > > what
> > > > > > I
> > > > > > > know or believe things to cost, I can't afford to have
a
> > > > mechanic
> > > > > > do
> > > > > > > every bit of maintenance these things need. The
> > electrical
> > > > > > problems
> > > > > > > concern me much less than mechanical ones.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > My question is, should I steer away from these old
> birds?
> > Is
> > > > the
> > > > > > > majority of the work something that an average person
> > could
> > > do
> > > > > > given
> > > > > > > patience and research/reading? Don't want to get
myself
> > in
> > > > over
> > > > > > my
> > > > > > > head.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I would DEFINATELY want to hire someone to look at a
unit
> > > > before
> > > > > > > purchasing, to make sure I understood what I was
getting
> > > myself
> > > > > > into.
> > > > > > > If I get to that point, I'll be asking here for
> > > recommendations
> > > > > on
> > > > > > who.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > I would just say this and that is buy from a person who
loves
> > his
> > > > old
> > > > > coach! Pay a little bit more but then most of the work has
> > been
> > > > done.
> > > > > As far as Vlv adjustment that only happens every 50,000
miles
> > and
> > > > my
> > > > > coach has only had that done two times. Yep and beside my
old
> > > coach
> > > > > gets 10 mpg (1978) and the newer ones well we all know
they
> > were
> > > > made
> > > > > for cheap fuel prices in mind. Jon
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>